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[The Smiler] Construction Updates and Ride Speculation

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Dave said:
Quetzal said:
I'm not too keen about the addition of these inversions, it seems like they're keen to cut out variety in order to get a record. I have to say I'm loving the corkscrew into the Brake run though.

I'm hoping the inside section is as special as it could be, for me that'll be what makes or breaks this as a ride.
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Inside section is a left turning twisted drop raising back up again into an in-line before turning towards the lift. Doesn't at the moment look like anything else in regards to track happens but as its still to be built it might have something (but i doubt it).

Just because its annoying me though here is your variety

x1 in-line
x1 Cobra (2 inversions)
x1 batwing (2 inversions)
x2 Immelmens
x1 half loops with twist (2 inversions)
x2 Invert and drops
x2 Barrel Roll
x1 Corkscrews

plus 2 airtime hills, indoor drop and quite a bit of track not actually inverting

Here is Collosus variety

x1 loop
x1 Cobra (2 inversions)
x 2 Corkscrews
x 5 in-lines

plus one crap airtime hill, a single drop and a wiggly bit where they couldn't get 2 elements to quite meet.

I love bashing Towers when they deserve it but i'm in the pro camp for this one (if it don't have Gerst Ache).
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Oh I completely agree that this will be better than Collosus. This is going to be a very good ride, but just not as good as it seemed from the original plans.

In terms of the inside section, I mean theming wise. The theme is obviously a very important part of this ride, and I really hope that they go all out.

And please, don't think that just because I'm not loving everything the park are doing with this ride that I'm 'bashing'.
 
They can't trim the airtime hills too much at a guess as the train needs to negotiate the Batwing/ Cobra straight after so it needs some energy left.

I don't mourn the loss of the 2 drops as based on the plans they wouldn't have crested the hills at any great speed looking at the height difference from the top of the lift-hills. The only bit that might have been fun to keep would have been the final s-bend as that would have been interesting at speed.

And Smiler really doesn't have the same sequence of elements as Collosus which repeats the same element 4 times in a row with no gap, hence why it's boring (and Smiler has 1 corkscrew). I personally found the old plans though to lack anything really punchy, the drops wouldn't have had much airtime, the last mad wiggle again would have lacked airtime and just thrown you around a bit.

If they had lost the two camel backs (as i feared they might when i heard the 14 inversion rumour) then i would have been worried but i personally think the new layout is interesting, will be absolutely mad yet still has variety (and airtime).

.... if it doesn't have Gerst Ache :)
 
I know I just made a post saying the changes might be a mistake, but I'm bored of people dry humping the original plans now. Everyone's going on about them as if they were the best thing ever, but before these changes, everyone was saying they hoped the plans were completely wrong and were saying still that it was like it was designed on RCT.
 
Nick said:
Dave said:
See i don't really get the whole inversions are boring argument if there are too many. It's variety that counts and a cobra roll is as different to an in-line as a loop is to a bunny hop.
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Everyone seems to completely slate Colossus, and that has a double corkscrew and a cobra roll, by calling it boring, when SW7 has exactly the same sequence of elements- it even has the air-time hill before the cobra roll.
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Colossus gets criticised as much for its uncomfortable trains as for its layout. I'm sure that if it had lapbars/well maintained and comfortable restraints it would be much better rated. As it is, it's uncomfortable as well as uninspired and repetitive.
 
Alastair said:
Nick said:
Dave said:
See i don't really get the whole inversions are boring argument if there are too many. It's variety that counts and a cobra roll is as different to an in-line as a loop is to a bunny hop.
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Everyone seems to completely slate Colossus, and that has a double corkscrew and a cobra roll, by calling it boring, when SW7 has exactly the same sequence of elements- it even has the air-time hill before the cobra roll.
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Colossus gets criticised as much for its uncomfortable trains as for its layout. I'm sure that if it had lapbars/well maintained and comfortable restraints it would be much better rated. As it is, it's uncomfortable as well as uninspired and repetitive.
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I don't think it's uncomfortable at all. I still criticise it for its boringness.
 
I share some of your concerns about "squeezing in" inversions for the sake of breaking a record and would have been perfectly happy with the original layout we had. I also agree that the double corkscrew at the end is probably a little over the top, but i'm thinking of it as a nod to corkscrew :p

But without sounding like a blind fanboy (ahem ::)), however, I think it's important to remember that the community, in general, has been hoping for a proper thrill addition for a good number of years now, and that is has been presented to us. And even though the sheer number of inversions may not be to everyone's taste, I don't think that the average Joe will feel let down that they have lost a couple of airtime hills - mainly because they won't know there was meant to be one in the first place!

For Alton Towers it will be a winner. People love to boast about things they've done, and going on the coaster with the largest number of inversions in the world will get people talking.
 
those final two inversions look more like barrell rolls than corkscrews and they can ride extremely crazily (see Blue Fire at EP for proof)
 
Dave said:
those final two inversions look more like barrell rolls than corkscrews and they can ride extremely crazily (see Blue Fire at EP for proof)
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Well considering the plans have changed, although I'm not sure, Nemesis94 probably had the track for these inversions in the same place as the original plans. We don't know what the actual inversions will be like until they are put in place.
 
Nick said:
Dave said:
those final two inversions look more like barrell rolls than corkscrews and they can ride extremely crazily (see Blue Fire at EP for proof)
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Well considering the plans have changed, although I'm not sure, Nemesis94 probably had the track for these inversions in the same place as the original plans. We don't know what the actual inversions will be like until they are put in place.
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You can see the inversions in the video for the game as well, obviously that is hardly concrete proof but it suggests that they are not standard corkscrews, either quite stretched out ones or barrell rolls
 
I think it looks pretty good and spectacular. While I would love some air time moments, I'm not going to say it looks boring...


But I dunno till I ride it, I only think the break in the middle for the second lift does put a spanner into the pacing. But I think its a good break between the inversions.

The inverted drops look amazing. And if the barrel roll/corkscrews have an almost bluefire sensation, then well... That's fantastic.

Either way I'm staying neutral. It looks pretty though!
 
Fredward said:
if the barrel roll/corkscrews have an almost bluefire sensation, then well... That's fantastic.
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I agree, though that depends entirely on the restraints, which sadly look likely to be OTSRs.
 
The first of the two corkscrews looks interesting, it's like the drop in reverse, it starts of tall and wide but gets tighter to end up higher than it started, and the second one looks very Blue Fire-ish.
 
First, great job nemesis94, it looks great.

Second, how much space is there in the building for show scenes etc. , seeing as this seems likely to play a part in the ride?
 
DiogoJ42 said:
Fredward said:
if the barrel roll/corkscrews have an almost bluefire sensation, then well... That's fantastic.
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I agree, though that depends entirely on the restraints, which sadly look likely to be OTSRs.
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I disagree dude, I am sure it will be lap restraints. Everything about this coaster has gone for extremes they can reach for - if this is OTSRs it will ruin it, or at least, very seriously impact upon how it feels.

If they can do laps on this, I believe they will - when Alton go for all out thrill to scare the crap outa ya, they succeed. Nemmy and Blivvy were there attempts to do this, and for their respective times they were built, they out did everything else.

The very bespoke looking cars, clearly designed for this ride, and not the B&M based mock ups, show lap bars - that is now in artwork all over the place, it will be ridiculous if they aren't accurate - what's the point?

Lap bars guys, lap bars.
 
On a completely unrelated note, it didn't seem like there was much (if any) construction work going on today. However there was a trailer loaded up with supports at the end of the day ready to be taken to the construction site.

:)
 
I saw one trailer of supports being moved today, and that's about it. There's been a trailer full of station steelwork sitting in the car park for ages and I really want it to move to the site! :p
 
Hmmm, now ive seen the updated video im not so sure about this ride. The great JW said "you can build the biggest ride with the most loops etc but people wont want to ride it more than once" or something along those lines!

To me, watching the video, it looks a bit, erm, dull. Upside down, erm, loop de loop, upside down again, more upside down... etc

Im not slating the ride and will make my decision when I ride it, but, from watching that ride, I dunno, im not overly thrilled by it if im honest.....
 
To be honest I'm beginning to come to the conclusion that if they submitted the plans to build Nemesis tomorrow and then someone did a no limits recreation, loads on here would say it looked dull.

I have spent many joyful years slating Alton Towers (its deserved it) yet this looks to be an interesting layout with a mix of positive and negative G's and a decent theme with back-story. There is nothing here that looks boring, it may prove to be I suppose when it opens but there is no real evidence to suggest this is the case yet.

I myself think this looks great, with a mix of elements and experiences, I know enthusiasts tend to like woodies therefore a ride that goes up and down repeatedly is seen as variety and fun (example Shambala) for no real reason other than you get to go "weeeeee" as you fly over the hills, whereas inversions are seen as less than good but I think the negative is a bit premature.

Multi-looping can be a lot of fun, I agree its often done in a lazy fashion but this just doesn't to me seem lazy. It seems varied and unlike most other multi-loopers has considered throwing in a few bits of Airtime too.
 
I find it funny how some people say that B&M hypers are boring and yet they have loads of hills. This is apparently boring. Th13teen was boring (Im not arguing that one). So basically unless its a woodie or an Intamin hyper/giga coaster, you don't wanna know. Seems a bit daft considering to me this has one of the best thought out layouts I have seen in years!
 
BigDave said:
I find it funny how some people say that B&M hypers are boring and yet they have loads of hills. This is apparently boring. Th13teen was boring (Im not arguing that one). So basically unless its a woodie or an Intamin hyper/giga coaster, you don't wanna know. Seems a bit daft considering to me this has one of the best thought out layouts I have seen in years!
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I'm not a fan of Gerst really and even I have to completely agree with that.
 
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