2015: General Discussion

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Ketz

TS Member
Basically Nemesis and CBeebies brings the crowds. I'm surprised that 2010 was so big, I guess the hype worked for Thirteen then!

Would be good to see those figures with the ride openings alongside for a comparison

Again there is no real significant increase of attendance in any year, baring the opening of Air 2002and Th13teen 2010.

I think Th13teen was well marketed, bringing in a lot of intrigue, and probably a lot of people wanting to ride to find what is going on.

I think that is one thing with gimmicky/ world first coasters, once you have ridden it once you are often not compelled enough to come back and ride it again, despite it being a good ride.
 

smudge

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Nemesis
Those figures are interesting, albeit utter rubbish imho. Merlin have, and always will, fabricate information like this to spread out their profitability/turnover between parks and all other assets, which is their right I'd like to add. This can justify investemnts when needed, although I doubt any serious trader would pay attention to these figures anyway.

As Dave says, there is no reason why merlin would relaese true figures, ever.
 

jon81uk

TS Member
Those figures are interesting, albeit utter rubbish imho. Merlin have, and always will, fabricate information like this to spread out their profitability/turnover between parks and all other assets, which is their right I'd like to add. This can justify investemnts when needed, although I doubt any serious trader would pay attention to these figures anyway.

As Dave says, there is no reason why merlin would relaese true figures, ever.

Given that Merlin only acquired the Tussaud's group in 2007 I don't think they have much to do with those gate figures.

I don't know if James wants to elaborate on where is found them, but I imagine most came from the Themed Entertainment Association reports.
 

delta79

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Nemesis, Air
using the figure for 2013 based on two people per car, it means merlin took about 7.5 million in car parking charges.
 

GaryH

TS Member
Thanks James for posting those gate numbers. Would be interesting to see the average occupancy rates of the hotels over the years too but im guessing such information isn't publicly available.
 

jon81uk

TS Member
using the figure for 2013 based on two people per car, it means merlin took about 7.5 million in car parking charges.

Many guest arrive on a coach trip (school or tour), MAP Premium and hotel guests get free parking and I guess the average number per car is at least 3, not many people go on their own, most are couples or families of 4/5 per car. Therefore I expect actual car park revenue is about £3M, assuming 1.5M people need to pay (assume other 1M are coaches, hotel and passholders) and they average 3 people per car.
 

Dave

TS Founding Member
An example of how the numbers are fudged is the year after Air opened, a few years ago we got to speak to a now ex-director at Towers, he stated the year after Air opened was a far busier year than the year it opened. Those figures have them the same.

I always take published guest figures with a pinch of salt. It's strongly rumoured they hit around 3 million last year but I doubt that will be what they publish.
 

James

TS Founding Member
Just to elaborate a little further. I wouldn't take any of the figures as gospel, even when it comes to figures released from Merlin/Tussuads they are very open to manipulation. Like mentioned above and also stressed since the Merlin take-over, they are under no obligation to share accurate figures.

In most cases Merlin usually release far lower figures than they really get. 2010 is the best example of this, the TEA report for that year as well as most official word at the beginning of 2011 stated that in 2010 Towers got 2.7m guests, although that was a lower figure than what Merlin actually got which is inbetween 3.0-3.2 million.

There's nothing to say Tussauds didn't do this too, so I wouldn't take those figures as accurate either. In any case assume a leeway between 0.1-0.4m.

Here are the figures again. All figures from 2007 onwards are a mixture, mainly from TEA reports although some are from Merlin. Figures that have 'confirmed' next to them are officially 'confirmed' figures from Tussuads/Merlin, those that are 'unconfirmed' are figures that aren't directly from Merlin/Tussauds, although are gathered from multiple reliable sources. Again I stress not to take the figures too seriously and give a leeway for each figure given how open they are to manipulation.

2013: 2.5 (confirmed)
2012: 2.4 (confirmed)
2011: 2.7 (confirmed)
2010: 3.1 (confirmed - Merlin)
2009: 2.5 (confirmed)
2008: 2.5 (confirmed)
2007: 2.4 (confirmed)
2006: 2.5 (unconfirmed)
2005: 2.5 (confirmed)
2004: 2.5 (confirmed)
2003: 2.5 (confirmed)
2002: 2.5 (confirmed)
2001: 2.3 (confirmed)
2000: 2.5 (confirmed)
1999: 2.6 (confirmed)
1998: 2.7 (confirmed)
1997: 2.7 (confirmed)
1996: 2.7 (unconfirmed)
1995: 2.7 (confirmed)
1994: 3.1 (confirmed)
 
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Ketz

TS Member
Surly they would artificially inflate there figures to make themselves look more successful than they actually are. I remember hearing before the electric turnstiles and tickets Disney used to spin there turnstiles to increase there attendance. I'd imagine that practice was common. But since electric ticketing, I'd imagine figures disclosed by most parks will be accurate.
 

GaryH

TS Member
If they did artificially inflate the number to make themselves look better than they actually are then it wouldn't go down too well with investment companies and stakeholders in Merlin.
 

Ketz

TS Member
I am not saying its a good thing but it's something that has happened, can't really comment on towers doing it, but most companies do things to improve there figures, whether it tax avoidance or dodgy accountancy, it happens, and we usually don't know about it.
 

siralgenon

TS Member
New for 2015: Ice Age The 4D Experience - No Time For Nuts

In the Resort pull-out in the Sun newspaper today, the resort map shows a new for 2015 4D film based on the character Scrat.
 

Ketz

TS Member
New for 2015: Ice Age The 4D Experience - No Time For Nuts

In the Resort pull-out in the Sun newspaper today, the resort map shows a new for 2015 4D film based on the character Scrat.

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Unfortunately it looks like it will use an existing film, it was a TV short released in 2006, so it's older than the current film. Should run a little better as it was designed to be of a short length.
 

James

TS Founding Member
Glad to see a new Ice Age film coming to the park. I don't mind it already being a short film out for years, the show at Towers was getting a bit samey so something new is all good, it's a nice little thing to add on top of Octonauts.

Just seen in the pullout too The Sun's hotel discount for Alton Towers has gone from 50% to just 30% off... quite a big cut to what has been the past few years an amazing discount. I can't say 30% off interests me that much when Towers do regular 30% off offers on their site anyway. 30% is still something but meh.
 
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