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Banned from the shoutbox.

Meat Pie

TS Member
Since when was 'continuously' arguing with another member a reason to be banned?

What an absolute farce and a disgrace.
 
Ignoring a team members request twice is enough reason.

Case closed.
 
Personally, having read back through the shoutbox, I think the ban is justified.

However, as other people may read this topic without any context of the incident, I think it would be best if someone on the team could just post in this thread to give a bit more background to what happened and why he's been banned.
 
Meat Pie,

I gave you a final warning to take your argument to PMs, as well as there being evidence of you insulting another member. But since you failed to do this, you were banned from the shoutbox. If you wish to discuss this further, please PM a team member.
 
Obviously, it's not up to me (more's the pity), so I can only give the view of someone who's on the outside looking in.

However, it's not all that different from Jordan's.

What I can say is that the first things I saw when I signed into the site tonight were not comments I massively wanted to read, not things that gave a good impression of the forum, and certainly not in keeping with the level of conduct TS expects from its members!

I spend a great deal of time shouting from the rooftops about the wonderful, troublefree atmosphere we have on this site, and have nothing but praise for the team who work tirelessly to keep it that way. As such, should one person decide, for whatever reason, personally justified or otherwise, to disrupt our peaceful equilibrium, it seems only fitting they be dealt with appropriately.

Similarly, it seems to me that creating numerous publicly viewable topics to ensure the matter is not laid to rest is unlikely to garner the person any support. That's my thoughts anyway.
 
Firstly, if I am to be 'warned', then it MUST be via PM. As someone who has been dipping in and out of the forum today, I was unable to see some prior warnings and only saw that which I was given by Lottie. Warnings via the shoutbox will flow right out the other end until they cannot be seen, and that is not a reasonable enough way to offer warning.

Secondly, I find it unacceptable that I am being penalised for responding to someone in exactly the same hostile manner as I had been treated all afternoon by this individual member. Also, where will the Mods draw the line of when something is an insult or just an opinion? At one point I was called a 'filthy Marxist fascist'. I would call being called a fascist highly insulting, but I would never seek to silence someone who would call me that, because that is a political opinion, one which I disagree with and feel is demonstrably untrue, but an opinion that shouldn't be censored no matter how insulting I felt it was.

Another point, I had let the discussion end at a natural conclusion, and it remained peaceful until later in the evening where I had been attacked with an unprovoked insult. If moderators really wanted to deal with the situation and avoid controversy they should have acted at that point and not blamed the party who simply responded to such attacks, as almost anyone would.

Thirdly, why are arguments not acceptable in the shoutbox? I am not aware of any such rule, but it seems bizarre, especially when that had probably been the first sustained conversation with any length that has happened in that section of the forum recently.
 
The shoutbox is visible to all members. I assume the reason for no arguing is that the shoutbox is meant to be kept light so as not to make new members seem left out. Also the entire argument proves exactly why they are banned. Debates are fine, it turned into an argument though.

All IMO, I could be wrong (I usually am :p)
 
The shoutbox is many people's first impression of the forum, it's certainly how I tried to talk to people when I was new, it is there for light and fun conversation, with the odd debate if you want, but there's a key word, Debate not argue, not start name calling, and yes the arguement was restarted, but did you have to respond, could you not just have reported it and leave it for a while, you didn't have to sink to that level you chose to, then when it finally got dealt with, you didn't just leave it.
 
Lottie. said:
If you wish to discuss this further, please PM a team member.

I do not feel comfortable discussing the conduct of the forum team and the issue of being banned in private. I much prefer to be open and transparent, a quality I hope the moderation team would also share.
 
Meat Pie said:
Lottie. said:
If you wish to discuss this further, please PM a team member.

I do not feel comfortable discussing the conduct of the forum team and the issue of being banned in private. I much prefer to be open and transparent, a quality I hope the moderation team would also share.

Request it is discussed in here or even better, chat, then. Just PM a team member with your request. They aren't unreasonable you know.....
 
Poison Tom is correct, and this has been raised in the past both on TT and when we moved to TS. The shoutbox is meant to be an informal chat, nothing more. There's a couple of reasons for this:

- There's only a limited number of lines of text that show in the shoutbox. For that reason, it's difficult when a couple of people are posting point after point for others to get involved as previous posts are very quickly lost.
- The shoutbox has always had a relaxed atmosphere for people to pop in and out of and just have a quick rant or chat with no specific topic. When two or three people are having a lengthy serious discussion, then it should be taken to a topic. This frees up the shoutbox to all who just want a quick chat, and more importantly allows others to participate in a proper discussion in a dedicated topic. A much better solution for all.
 
Meat Pie said:
Lottie. said:
If you wish to discuss this further, please PM a team member.

I do not feel comfortable discussing the conduct of the forum team and the issue of being banned in private. I much prefer to be open and transparent, a quality I hope the moderation team would also share.

Meat Pie said:
Firstly, if I am to be 'warned', then it MUST be via PM.

What's the difference?
 
I kind of assumed quoting a team members post saying I do not want to discuss it in PMs, in a topic about the issue, would make it self-evident that I wish it to be dealt with here, but just in case it isn't... I would like it in here, and preferably with a response to this previous post of mine:

Meat Pie said:
Firstly, if I am to be 'warned', then it MUST be via PM. As someone who has been dipping in and out of the forum today, I was unable to see some prior warnings and only saw that which I was given by Lottie. Warnings via the shoutbox will flow right out the other end until they cannot be seen, and that is not a reasonable enough way to offer warning.

Secondly, I find it unacceptable that I am being penalised for responding to someone in exactly the same hostile manner as I had been treated all afternoon by this individual member. Also, where will the Mods draw the line of when something is an insult or just an opinion? At one point I was called a 'filthy Marxist fascist'. I would call being called a fascist highly insulting, but I would never seek to silence someone who would call me that, because that is a political opinion, one which I disagree with and feel is demonstrably untrue, but an opinion that shouldn't be censored no matter how insulting I felt it was.

Another point, I had let the discussion end at a natural conclusion, and it remained peaceful until later in the evening where I had been attacked with an unprovoked insult. If moderators really wanted to deal with the situation and avoid controversy they should have acted at that point and not blamed the party who simply responded to such attacks, as almost anyone would.

Thirdly, why are arguments not acceptable in the shoutbox? I am not aware of any such rule, but it seems bizarre, especially when that had probably been the first sustained conversation with any length that has happened in that section of the forum recently.

Perhaps also with an explanation as to why no expiration date has been posted where it is meant to be underneath the "You are banned" notification. If I've received a life-time ban, I think even most who feel this action was justified would consider that a tad over-the-top.

Craig - I take the point, but considering the Shoutbox had been dead at the point the discussion came into being and has recently been dead anyway, it certainly seems counter-intuitive to me to stifle conversation by putting sanctions upon those who are actually being active.
 
I would just like to take the chance to thank the team for all the hard work they do here on the forum, the social side, and the main site.

Without their hard work, time, money spent and dedication to the site, none of us would be here, and none of us would be able to enjoy it.

They run the site for free, and allow a lot to go that other sites would jump on straight away. I therefore think its only fair, and its considerate that when a member of the team asks us to do something, or stop doing something, we respect their decisions no matter how much we disagree with it.

It would not surprise me if there is a number of the team thinking why do they bother, and if they are, I would like to tell them that I and most of us really appreciate it, and thank you for your time and effort running the site.

Ian
 
So you'll happily cause a ruckus in a thread about being banned, but you INSIST that you have to be warned by PM?

Double standards. ::)
 
Panda said:
Meat Pie said:
Lottie. said:
If you wish to discuss this further, please PM a team member.

I do not feel comfortable discussing the conduct of the forum team and the issue of being banned in private. I much prefer to be open and transparent, a quality I hope the moderation team would also share.

Meat Pie said:
Firstly, if I am to be 'warned', then it MUST be via PM.

What's the difference?

Because in the first instance I'm expressing a wish to have the conversation in a public and therefore more accountable position, and in the second instance I need a PM just so that I am actually aware I have been warned as PMs generate an automatic email and appear in my notifications?

Rather obvious really.
 
But if you were posting in the shoutbox, how can you not see the notification from Lottie that you were given a warning, if everyone else saw it, why didn't you?
 
As I'm not a forum mod (just the tavern)

Id like to point out on This very accessible Member Expectations page the following is said:

Everyone is entitled to an opinion, and although things can get heated, avoid getting into direct arguments with others and ensure you contribute in a mature and sensible manner. If your behaviour is brought to the team’s attention, we might need to contact you to discuss further and/or edit or remove the problem posts. Repeat offenders may risk changes being made to their posting rights

So as I see it, someone went against this expectation and doesn't like the outcome of a clear response? I dont think the blame lies with the team.

Just an objective view from not seeing any of the shout box posts or other thread(s?).
 
Meat Pie said:
If I've received a life-time ban, I think even most who feel this action was justified would consider that a tad over-the-top.

I think you should just be grateful you haven't been banned from the forums altogether. Quite frankly your behaviour was absolutely disgraceful.
 
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