Incident on The Smiler 02/06/2015

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RoyJess

TS Member
So basically, you don't know when it was removed and are just relying on hearsay at best. For all we know the order could have been lifted ages ago and the reason it hasn't opened yet COULD be entirely down to Alton dragging their feet. Just wanted to clear that up as I still havn't seen any definitive evidence that the order has still been in place in recent times. Apologies if I seem slightly abrupt but it gets annoying when people keep throwing this prohibition order thing around with no real knowledge of how long it lasted for or even if it is still in place. Also, I really wouldn't rely on anything the staff on the ground say as various things have been said by staff members and people in the know in recent months which have proven not to be true.

I fully understand where you are coming from. If I was given a £ for every bit of information that I've been given from staff members over the years and they fail to materialize, I'll be a very rich man ;) So yes I'm very weary on repeating what I hear.

Only time will tell. Like I said, they still have many hours of testing still, but I slightly optimistic about a end of season opening, but I'm not going to go crazy and build my hopes up (nor should any one else), but I think we can quiet safely say it will open next season.
 

Grand_Nash

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Nemesis
Guest numbers are low as Alton really is not advertising at the moment.

Not seen many scare fest, fireworks adverts this year
 

Rob

TS Team
Favourite Ride
Steel Vengeance
I missed the revelation of this, unless people are interpreting the presentation a few months ago as not showing Alton Towers on the major investment column for 2017? I saw that, but I also recall the statements from Varney that the investment strategy for Alton Towers wasn't going to be changed.

I think postponing the investment would be flawed, as a major new addition is needed now more than ever to draw people back. UNLESS you are going to offload or close the park down of course.

I am basing it on that presentation, it states that the major 2017 CAPEX projects will be for Heide Park and Chessington. Merlin now work on four year cycles which would mean that Alton Towers is actually due in 2017 and Heide Park in 2018. It would be unprecedented for Merlin to have three major CAPEX projects in 2017, it just is not going to happen.

For various reasons the Alton Towers major CAPEX has seemingly been pushed back to 2018. I'd imagine final confirmation of this may come by the end of January with the lack of planning application submitted to SMDC.

It's sad but true.

:)
 

Hat

TS Member
When have they said it will be closed for fireworks ?

On twitter they are still saying the normal response re when someone asked if open for fireworks

Don't think they have confirmed whether it will be open or closed yet
 

Tom

TS Member
When have they said it will be closed for fireworks ?

On twitter they are still saying the normal response re when someone asked if open for fireworks

Don't think they have confirmed whether it will be open or closed yet

They said it won't be open in an earlier reply, but have now reverted to their regurgitated generic statement. Their investigation/design review is ongoing.
 

RoyJess

TS Member
I think people should stop harassing Alton Towers (via the media) on this matter. They don't usually tell the staff anything with what is going on, so I doubt that they will tell the general public.

People should go for the fireworks weekend for the fireworks and the current attractions that are open, not just for the Smiler. If the Smiler is open the fireworks weekend then that would be a bonus.

But if everyone suddenly turn up just to ride the Smiler, then you all will be spending a good few hours queuing.
 

delta79

TS Member
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Nemesis, Air
From a check this afternoon by works H&S consultant. Prohibition notice is still in force.
 

xylyx

TS Member
Personally I would say pulling back any investment now would do them no favours. I put faith in this article: http://riderater.co.uk/2015/merlin-entertainments-far-from-dead-in-the-water/
which was about two months after the accident, indicating they are not dropping any of their intended plans. I know they subsequently issued the profit warning and the capex announcement, however I still hold hope in this. Even if it's eventually proven futile. Ryan b could even have a point (made many pages ago, before the topic underwent the spirals) that, with some nifty deals across clever creators, SW8, if it is a woody, may not even cross into the realms of high investment yet still be an awesome ride.

In terms of the press it's generally accepted, even with the gp, that the mirror seem to have it in for Alton Towers and Merlin, reading the comments on the articles on fb there's a whole lot of disgruntlement with the continued spin.
 

Spark

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Nemesis
Perhaps the planned investment coincided with a theme which would be classed as distasteful, therefore rather than have problems with a rushed project they have decided to put it on hold
 

Danza91

TS Member
People should go for the fireworks weekend for the fireworks and the current attractions that are open, not just for the Smiler. If the Smiler is open the fireworks weekend then that would be a bonus.

I think part of the issue is the entrance price as it hasn't changed to reflect what's on offer. Currently a number of late openings, rides closing early or rides not opening altogether.
 

Rob

TS Team
Favourite Ride
Steel Vengeance
Personally I would say pulling back any investment now would do them no favours. I put faith in this article: http://riderater.co.uk/2015/merlin-entertainments-far-from-dead-in-the-water/
which was about two months after the accident, indicating they are not dropping any of their intended plans. I know they subsequently issued the profit warning and the capex announcement, however I still hold hope in this. Even if it's eventually proven futile. Ryan b could even have a point (made many pages ago, before the topic underwent the spirals) that, with some nifty deals across clever creators, SW8, if it is a woody, may not even cross into the realms of high investment yet still be an awesome ride.

Plans can change very quickly. As we know from the screening opinion that was submitted to SMDC is appeared that SW8 was quite a way down the line in terms of development and it was indeed going to be a woodie. Ever since The Smiler incident it has all gone very quiet. Regardless of what coaster type Towers were to go for costs would remain high and be classed as a major CAPEX, groundwork costs for all Towers major coasters always have to be taken into account. With where the woodie was said to be going I can only imagine the costs of groundwork and construction would have been high.

Chances are there are other reasons for holding off on SW8 though. If for whatever reasons SW8 fell through, Merlin may have decided that rather than rush a plan B like they ended up doing with The Smiler (and we all know how that one went) it would be better to push SW8 back to 2018 and plan it properly. These major projects need to be well planned and thought out, The Smiler was an all round example of how to totally mess up a major install.

:)
 
U

UserDeleted

Plans can change very quickly. As we know from the screening opinion that was submitted to SMDC is appeared that SW8 was quite a way down the line in terms of development and it was indeed going to be a woodie. Ever since The Smiler incident it has all gone very quiet. Regardless of what coaster type Towers were to go for costs would remain high and be classed as a major CAPEX, groundwork costs for all Towers major coasters always have to be taken into account. With where the woodie was said to be going I can only imagine the costs of groundwork and construction would have been high.

Chances are there are other reasons for holding off on SW8 though. If for whatever reasons SW8 fell through, Merlin may have decided that rather than rush a plan B like they ended up doing with The Smiler (and we all know how that one went) it would be better to push SW8 back to 2018 and plan it properly. These major projects need to be well planned and thought out, The Smiler was an all round example of how to totally mess up a major install.

:)

Couldn't agree more.

After all of it is getting a "SW" title, take the time and get it right.
 

Sku

TS Member
I agree take the time and get it right. Also marketing is everything when it comes to a major new attraction and they won't want a new attraction tainted/associated with The Smiler accident. They have to be sure the press have moved on before they make anything further public on new developments.
 

Rob

TS Team
Favourite Ride
Steel Vengeance
That's also a good point. Planning applications for major SW projects are normally submitted around about November/December two years preceeding the attraction opening (so that is this year for a 2017 opening, next year for a 2018 opening). You can imagine the headlines that will be made if an application for a major new coaster went in this year (especially if it was made of wood) - "Alton Towers bosses plan new terrifying scream machine just months after horror crash, and this time it's made from WOOD!". Not ideal, sure it's free marketing but at the same time it could reflect badly. Such newspaper articles are far less likely in December 2016.

I don't think this is at all a driving force in any decision that may have been made regarding the next major attraction mind.

:)
 

xylyx

TS Member
Couldn't agree more that it should be done right, smiler was a sloppy installation, however if they do push it back, for whatever reasons, they really need to do something in the meantime.

The family market is expanding nicely and the resort with it, but even with Smiler back up and running the thrill line up has been decreasing. With the lower numbers in park those who love the adrenaline have been able to do every ride they want as many times as they want. Adding the smiler again will be nice but if that's the only extra until 2018 I don't think it will sustain the excitement, especially as a fair whack of peeps have already ridden it.

Yeah I don't think the bad press would inform such decisions, the Mirror have proven that they'll spin anything Merlin does as a reeling desperate reaction to the smiler collision with that article about the deal with China. There's nothing you can do about them unless they libel you so best to remain open and honest and carry on as normal while attempting to ignore them. They'll go away if people stop listening. :) lol it always reminds me of that Simpson's Ep with the advertisment monsters: "Just don't look."

It may be a pipedream but I still hold out hope for 2017 :)
 
U

UserDeleted

I doubt that the idea to open Legoland China has happened within a few months. I think it might have been in the pipeline a lot longer.
 

JB1985

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Oblivion
I am basing it on that presentation, it states that the major 2017 CAPEX projects will be for Heide Park and Chessington. Merlin now work on four year cycles which would mean that Alton Towers is actually due in 2017 and Heide Park in 2018. It would be unprecedented for Merlin to have three major CAPEX projects in 2017, it just is not going to happen.

For various reasons the Alton Towers major CAPEX has seemingly been pushed back to 2018. I'd imagine final confirmation of this may come by the end of January with the lack of planning application submitted to SMDC.

It's sad but true.

:)

Question and off topic.....what were the original plans for SW7?
 
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