The Brexit Thread

Matt N

TS Member
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Mako (SeaWorld Orlando)
Apologies if this isn’t expressly Brexit-related, but I just wanted to ask; is this new announcement about refugees from war-torn countries being shipped to Rwanda anything to do with Brexit?

I don’t mean that it was directly caused by Brexit, but could it be something to do with honouring promises made in the referendum to do with immigration, as while I know that not every Brexit voter voted the way they did due to immigration concerns (far from it, in fact), I’ve been led to believe that a not insignificant percentage of Brexit voters voted Leave due to concerns about immigration? So could this be the government’s way of shielding Britain from the impact of refugee immigration in a way that appeases Leave supporters?

I’ll admit I’m not sure how I feel about this new policy. I never had an issue with immigration of any kind myself; surely as a more fortunate country, you’d want to accept the less fortunate into your country and permit them to live better lives?

Out of interest, why is it that many people are concerned about immigration? I’m not asking that with the intention of starting any flame wars or anything, so I apologise if it comes across that way; I was merely interested to know.
 

tayspru

TS Member
We’ve got space for white Europeans fleeing from war in Ukraine, but no space for Black and mixed refugees fleeing from war in Syria, so they can be shipped off to Rwanda. I don’t know though I’m sure it’s nothing to do with appeasing the core Brexit voter base or anything
 

Matt N

TS Member
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Mako (SeaWorld Orlando)
We’ve got space for white Europeans fleeing from war in Ukraine, but no space for Black and mixed refugees fleeing from war in Syria, so they can be shipped off to Rwanda. I don’t know though I’m sure it’s nothing to do with appeasing the core Brexit voter base or anything
What difference does nationality or skin colour make, out of interest?

I apologise if I’m missing something here, but surely they’re all people fleeing war-torn countries who need our help?
 

rob666

TS Member
Still playing the "All Brexit supporters must be racist" record then.
Tory scum playing to Tory voters just before elections.
Nothing else.
 

Matt N

TS Member
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Mako (SeaWorld Orlando)
Still playing the "All Brexit supporters must be racist" record then.
Tory scum playing to Tory voters just before elections.
Nothing else.
That’s not what I was trying to imply at all, Rob, and I apologise if that’s what it looked like.

I know plenty of people voted Brexit for non-immigration related reasons, and I know that having concerns about immigration doesn’t automatically make you racist. My grandad voted for Brexit on the basis of immigration concerns, and I know that he certainly isn’t racist by any stretch.

I was merely asking because I did think that Priti Patel’s proposed immigration solution would solve the supposed issue that a significant proportion of Brexit voters raised during the referendum, so I wondered whether the solution was being proposed as a way of following through with referendum promises.

If I came across discriminatory towards Leave voters, I apologise, as that wasn’t my intent.
 

MaxPower

TS Member
Brown people moving countries = Immigrant
White people moving countries = Expat 😆

We do need to properly vet everyone entering the country illegally but shipping people off to Rwanda just seems like a PR stunt to appease voters who want tighter border controls.
 

Matt.GC

TS Member
What difference does nationality or skin colour make, out of interest?

I apologise if I’m missing something here, but surely they’re all people fleeing war-torn countries who need our help?
I think the point more is that there's been less empathy for the people of war torn countries in Africa and Asia, some of them where the west has been indirectly or sometimes directly to blame for their predicament.

Who's standing with the people of Yemen?
 

imanautie

TS Member
Brown people moving countries = Immigrant
White people moving countries = Expat 😆

We do need to properly vet everyone entering the country illegally but shipping people off to Rwanda just seems like a PR stunt to appease voters who want tighter border controls.
Remember asylum seekers aren't technically entering illegally
 

JAperson

TS Member
Brown people moving countries = Immigrant
White people moving countries = Expat 😆

We do need to properly vet everyone entering the country illegally but shipping people off to Rwanda just seems like a PR stunt to appease voters who want tighter border controls.
Although I agree with you I will point out that this isn't always the case, expat tends to be people retiring and I've heard people say for example that they know someone who has emigrated to Australia. It's weird and confusing with the amount of words used on this subject. Unfortunately people now associate the word immigrant with illegal immigrant and then assume that all asylum seakers are illegal immigrants which again isn't correct. That's basically what UKIP did.
 

rob666

TS Member
As you just quoted!
"Tory scum playing to Tory voters".
Statistics can be tricky, more than half of all Brexit voters were not Conservative voters.
Can't give the actual source, but quoted on the Today programme on R4 quite recently.
 

BarryZola

TS Member
The core Brexit voter was and remains conservatives.

Why do *you* think refugees from other countries than Ukraine are being treated differently

Some of the reasons are probably:

- Refugees from other countries are travelling through many safe countries where they could stay and be safe, but for some reason they want to get to the UK. The Ukranians who come here are going through the correct channels and on the whole the Ukranian refugees are being dispersed widely throughout Europe through legal means.
- A lot of refugees from other countries that are turning up here are young fit men. They appear to be economic migrants. On the opposite end of the scale, most of those coming from Ukraine are female and children who are clearly here just to stay safe whilst their men stay in their own country and fight for their country.
- The Ukranian refugees look more like us and most likely share the same religion as us. They are more likely to share our values.

There are many reasons why Ukranian immigrants are probably more welcome here. No need to just paint the country (or Tory/Brexit voters) as racist, that's an over simplified argument.
 

tayspru

TS Member
Some of the reasons are probably:

- Refugees from other countries are travelling through many safe countries where they could stay and be safe, but for some reason they want to get to the UK. The Ukranians who come here are going through the correct channels and on the whole the Ukranian refugees are being dispersed widely throughout Europe through legal means.
- A lot of refugees from other countries that are turning up here are young fit men. They appear to be economic migrants. On the opposite end of the scale, most of those coming from Ukraine are female and children who are clearly here just to stay safe whilst their men stay in their own country and fight for their country.
- The Ukranian refugees look more like us and most likely share the same religion as us. They are more likely to share our values.

There are many reasons why Ukranian immigrants are probably more welcome here. No need to just paint the country (or Tory/Brexit voters) as racist, that's an over simplified argument.
1) there is no requirement for refugees to remain in the nearest “safe” country - that’s a misconception. Many have family or connections based in the U.K. and already speak the language. I imagine if you were in a situation where you had to uproot your life you would go somewhere that you can speak the language

2) The workforce is currently falling apart from a lack of “fit young men” as you put it. That aside, there are no safe routes of travel that the patriarch is willing to put their family through, they travel themselves to establish a new safe place before their families follow

3) I agree that unfortunately people perceive white people as having more “value”
 

BarryZola

TS Member
1) there is no requirement for refugees to remain in the nearest “safe” country - that’s a misconception. Many have family or connections based in the U.K. and already speak the language. I imagine if you were in a situation where you had to uproot your life you would go somewhere that you can speak the language

2) The workforce is currently falling apart from a lack of “fit young men” as you put it. That aside, there are no safe routes of travel that the patriarch is willing to put their family through, they travel themselves to establish a new safe place before their families follow

3) I agree that unfortunately people perceive white people as having more “value”
That's all wonderful and whatever, but I'm just telling you why the good people of Britain feel differently about Ukranian immigrants. I couldn't care less what the requirements are in international law for where you have to go. People feel that immigrants from other countries are taking the p**s out of us and they don't like it. Just thought I'd clear it up for you.
 

pluk

TS Member
We’ve got space for white Europeans fleeing from war in Ukraine, but no space for Black and mixed refugees fleeing from war in Syria, so they can be shipped off to Rwanda. I don’t know though I’m sure it’s nothing to do with appeasing the core Brexit voter base or anything

With Ukraine we've got people using a legitimate asylum route, one of many that facilitates asylum for people from all sorts of ethnicities and nations when there is genuine need, rather than a non legitimate one which kills scores of people annually.

It does make absolute sense that the attractiveness of making that dangerous crossing from one safe place to another needs to be removed. I don't think this is the right way to go about it, but then again I don't have many other ideas to achieve it.
 

BarryZola

TS Member
To be honest, I think Patel must have nicked my idea because I proposed similar on the tinternet about a year ago somewhere or other. The idea is that if you turn up here and then are swiftly whisked off to another country that you have no interest in living in, over time it will deter others from turning up here illegally as they will be back to square one. It's about making it pointless to enter our country illegally. Go about entering our country legally from whichever country you want to, or end up having to do the same from another country that you don't want to be in. The idea that anyone can just rock up here illegally and then stay here from day one needs to be shown to be not possible in any way shape or form.

I have other wonderful ideas too that I'm sure Priti would be interested in. Alas, I doubt the discussed scheme will ever come into fruition for various reasons.
 

AstroDan

TS Team
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Steel Vengeance, Cedar Point
I really enjoyed jumping on a train in Cologne yesterday and arriving in Paris 3 1/2 hours later. Called at Brussels on the way.

Lovely lark this freedom of movement, gotta say.

Funny arriving into the Gare du Nord to see the Eurostar travellers in line upstairs in their separate area waiting for their stamps before they can leave.

Sent from my SM-G991B using Tapatalk
 
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BigT

TS Member
To be honest, I think Patel must have nicked my idea because I proposed similar on the tinternet about a year ago somewhere or other. The idea is that if you turn up here and then are swiftly whisked off to another country that you have no interest in living in, over time it will deter others from turning up here illegally as they will be back to square one. It's about making it pointless to enter our country illegally. Go about entering our country legally from whichever country you want to, or end up having to do the same from another country that you don't want to be in. The idea that anyone can just rock up here illegally and then stay here from day one needs to be shown to be not possible in any way shape or form.

I have other wonderful ideas too that I'm sure Priti would be interested in. Alas, I doubt the discussed scheme will ever come into fruition for various reasons.

Anything that can be done to stop rubber dinghy’s crossing the worlds busiest shipping lane has to be a good thing.
My plan to stop this would be create a place in France where people could go and apply for asylum, trouble is most of those crossing (fit young men) would not be successful so would still try and cross in rubber dinghy’s.
Maybe sending them to the middle of Africa is not such a stupid idea after all.
 
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