Thorpe Park: General Discussion

[DistortAMG]

How many times has this valleyed? It doesn't seem like it's in new terrolitory for large coasters. These things will valley due to being more sensitive to the weather.

I think the issues with this are heightened for a few reasons, one being that many enthusiasts following this have never witnessed a large scale coaster and it's teething issues.

 

[Blackhole_Sun]

Has anyone got Werner Stengel’s phone number?

 

[djransome]

Oh no... They can't catch a break on this. I know yesterday it was reasonably windy as they were playing the "poor weather conditions" announcement from 4:30pm and the ride batcher was saying they were doing what they can to keep it operating. The winds gusts were 25-29 mph. Enough to cause Vortex to go down from 2pm.

How long will it take them to sort? Surely they need to re-design or re-calculate what conditions it can run in.

 

[Danny]

A re-design would be too costly. The Smiler wasn't re-designed when it repeatedly valleyed on the batwing. It'll just involve an operational procedure analysis and change.

 

[DJM]

Was there today down for my birthday got on it when it opened then i got a fast pass for my birthday so went on at noon then sat having my dinner and my wife said oh its going backwards and i said that's not good anyway was planning on staying all day but left at 2.30 still had a good day.
Thought it was pretty busy today and on a side note seems like kids don't spend much time at school.

 

[flyingguitar]

Surely the easiest solution to this would be redesigning the outerbank so it's a bit lower? Obviously easier said than done, but I don't really see any other way to solve this stalling issue. Unless a wheel change would do it, but surely they would have done that by now?

I know it's only happened when empty so far, but surely Merlin aren't going to want to run the risk of it stalling with riders on (if only to avoid the press headlines...)?

I still haven't ridden yet, as it has felt like too much of a gamble so far, as I live 3.5 hours away, and don't want to make the journey for it to then be closed

there are many ways to reduce the drag on the train, redesigning the ride would require new support structure, new track, a lot of work, and it could be extremely difficult, rollercoasters (in fact most buildings) are designed to be built one way, I can't recall how hyperia was built, but there will have to be a full assessment on how to disassemble the track, then reassemble it without causing potential structural problems.

the ways you can reduce drag are many:
wheel compound: similar to F1 rollercoasters have differnt compounds from cold wether (harder, less rolling resistance to combat the more thicker cold grease) to hot (softer, but able to withstand the hotter temperatures)
wheels compressment: there are adjustments on the train to adjust how much the wheels are pressing into the track, if to tight it will introduce too much drag.
the wheel grease being used,
and so much more

you also have to remember a lot of stuff is wearing in at the start of the season, after a bit of running it will naturally reduce its drag and it is a new ride, it has only vallied what 3 times now, the second time they got it back running very quickly if I recall correctly, they will be working out new operating procedures to prevent this, valleying isn't a new issue with hyperia, the smiler struggled with it and it is primarily based on the layout of the track.

 

[rob666]

.. redesigning the ride would require new support structure, new track, a lot of work, and it could be extremely difficult, rollercoasters (in fact most buildings) are designed to be built one way...

They did exactly that with the Big One within the first few seasons...completely reprofiled first drop, and the high hairpin above the National station.
Puters are clever enough to make changes.

 

[Spark]

Surely they could lower the track, it was done on JO in 2003 on the cobra roll due to it valleying

 

[Benjsh]

For all your Hyper Coaster needs.....Try B&M.

 

[flyingguitar]

They did exactly that with the Big One within the first few seasons...completely reprofiled first drop, and the high hairpin above the National station.
Puters are clever enough to make changes.

I wasn't saying it wasn't possible, just that it would be very difficult (and costly) for them to go back and redo that section of track, so they may do it but only if there aren't any other options.

 

[LordOfDarkness]

I mean a simple solution is maybe stop running it without water dummies when testing in windy conditions?

 

[Skyscraper]

Crane is on site already, they might as well install a permanent one at this rate.

 

[Smiley]

As above, no issues at all today even though there were high winds (I wouldn't call it high winds, it was more gusty at poi

Waiting for the inevitable “why not just fit LSMs”.

Here I am!! Whenever you design "near stalls" ultimately you will get a stall. Stealth, for example. Calculating the velocity of a coaster and then utilising a small LSM to "get it over the hump". Not talking launch kind, just a bump.

Very simple technology.

 

[Poisson]

Structural loading calculations, power draw in an area that seems to have power issues, ride vehicle redesign etc seem to disagree with you.

 

[Benzin]

Structural loading calculations, power draw in an area that seems to have power issues, ride vehicle redesign etc seem to disagree with you.

But aside from that what have the engineers ever done for us?

 

[Smiley]

Structural loading calculations, power draw in an area that seems to have power issues, ride vehicle redesign etc seem to disagree with you.

Where you see problems, I see stalls. Should have been done in the design - "ooh, let's make a coaster that almost stalls...." I hate to look to musk, but he has done on 10 years what NASA/Boeing couldn't do in 25. Meanwhile Airbus created the A380....

 

[Poisson]

Where you see problems, I see stalls. Should have been done in the design - "ooh, let's make a coaster that almost stalls...." I hate to look to musk, but he has done on 10 years what NASA/Boeing couldn't do in 25. Meanwhile Airbus created the A380....

Yet the problem is here, past the original design process so would need process to make sure your small launch could happen. You can't just ignore safety and/or physics because it's inconvenient.

You're also confusing scope with ability in your analogy.

 

[flyingguitar]

I hate to look to musk, but he has done on 10 years what NASA/Boeing couldn't do in 25.

I hate to distract a bit but everything he has done has been done before, self landing rocket boosters McDonnell Douglas did that in the 90's.

Nasa is slow due to poor funding and their extremely good saftey rating, if Nasa lost rockets at the rate of space X they would be shut down.

there is a quote from a us general about the development of one of their fighter jets, and it comes across very well the complaint was that they cost a large amount and time for developing their new fighter, which unlike the previous fighter had very low deaths during development and it went like this:
if I can spend $xm more and take an extra couple years to prevent having to tell their family about their loss then I will do it.

but elon seems to be playing kerbal space program.

 

[Leigh]

Where you see problems, I see stalls. Should have been done in the design - "ooh, let's make a coaster that almost stalls...." I hate to look to musk, but he has done on 10 years what NASA/Boeing couldn't do in 25. Meanwhile Airbus created the A380....

Because a company that operates the way they do is one to be looked up to.

You can’t just strap LSMs onto a coaster after the fact when it wasn’t designed to have them. It’s been explained ad nauseam as to why that is.

 

[Josh555]

I’m meant to be going on Saturday, if it’s valleyed is it just a case of them removing the train then testing again with water dummies to reopen or is it likely to be more to it than that?