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[2025] Project Ocean: New Forbidden Valley Flat Ride

Many points about less is more in trying to tie themes together but always this is never the case and of you think new look Forbidden Valley is the worst example of too much explaining then the worst example of less is more is Thirteen in which even after all these years I still don't know what it's theme is truly about other than it looks like a half baked themed ride with a weird name that all reeks of those daft early 2010 marketing stunts and that God awful scaffolding theming which I utterly despise more than shipping containers as theming.

So when one wants to say less is more, I point to Thirteen in how you can botch less is more. At least with new look Forbidden Valley no matter if you like it or not or even follow all the full story you at least have a a basic idea of what's happening when Dark Forest in contrast is just a mess from top to bottom but I'm going off topic. So in truth, it seems Towers has extremes of either too much lore or too less lore...you can't win sadly.
 
QTXAdsy said:
Many points about less is more in trying to tie themes together but always this is never the case and of you think new look Forbidden Valley is the worst example of too much explaining then the worst example of less is more is Thirteen in which even after all these years I still don't know what it's theme is truly about other than it looks like a half baked themed ride with a weird name that all reeks of those daft early 2010 marketing stunts and that God awful scaffolding theming which I utterly despise more than shipping containers as theming.

So when one wants to say less is more, I point to Thirteen in how you can botch less is more. At least with new look Forbidden Valley no matter if you like it or not or even follow all the full story you at least have a a basic idea of what's happening when Dark Forest in contrast is just a mess from top to bottom but I'm going off topic. So in truth, it seems Towers has extremes of either too much lore or too less lore...you can't win sadly.
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The theme isn't what's wrong with Thirteen. It makes no excuses, and explains next to zero. If the park didn't already have a Gloomy Wood and an attraction centred around a haunted tree, it would be fantastic if it were done properly in my opinion. Haunted woodland with vines taking over everything, a creepy girl with no name that no one ever sees, wraiths, and a crypt. It all exists for no good reason. No rhyme, reason or explanation.

The problem (other than the terrible engineering and lacklustre layout) is the theming itself. The area itself is terrible. The scaffolding is terrible. The shipping container which makes up it's gift shop, which you failed to mention, also terrible. It's not a story or overall theme problem, it's an implementation one.

You don't have to know what it's about, so I'm struggling to see your point here? You appear to be pointing to the fact so much of the theming is half baked and crap. Which I agree with. I don't see how this is related to the lack of story? You can't make out what it's supposed to be because it's not supposed to make sense. 2d Leek signs in the queue line and audio spoon feeding excuses for scaffolding and a big fence would probably make matters worse rather than better. Like a cheaper way of excusing why it wasn't finished.
 
The point is that "less is more" isn't always a positive if the idea and execution are incredibly half baked.

Not helped by having a crap Intamin wedged awkwardly next door. Meaning that a lot of the design impact has always been lost.

Show don't tell has certainly been lost in media over the years.
 
See, I actually don't think that Nemesis Reborn does go too overboard with the exposition. They have nice little bits around to build the story, but it's not necessarily boring you to death with it or telling you too much. People on here are saying that they do too much explanation, but within the actual product itself on the park, where do they actually do excessive explanation?

As far as I can see, most of the exposition people seem to be referring to is on the website and in the promotional emails, which is hardly like shoving loads of exposition in your face on the ride when it isn't needed.
 
Matt N said:
See, I actually don't think that Nemesis Reborn does go too overboard with the exposition. They have nice little bits around to build the story, but it's not necessarily boring you to death with it or telling you too much. People on here are saying that they do too much explanation, but within the actual product itself on the park, where do they actually do excessive explanation?

As far as I can see, most of the exposition people seem to be referring to is on the website and in the promotional emails, which is hardly like shoving loads of exposition in your face on the ride when it isn't needed.
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I agree. In that way, the current storyline is fairly similar to the original storyline.
 
I agree with @Matt N that the new Nemesis/FV doesn't really say much more than the old one. Except maybe the video in the lab? We see the monster, there's a paramilitary organisation controlling the area, and there's some undefined 'resistance' movement thing that mostly just gets hinted at to imply the paramilitary are Bad and Up To Something with the alien, which I think is quite effective.

The problem with Dark Forest is there's like three related but different themes going on. To look at Thirteen's building, the stalls being called things like 'crypt games', you'd think the theme is 'spooky haunted/evil church found in the woods. It explains the scaffolding and shipping containers and fits with the Towers, even implying a potential connection to the witch in Hex. Rita and "you must eacape" suggests its place is 'you're trapped in the haunted woods, found this race car that somehow still works, it's your last chance to get out' which is consistent in terms of story if not in terms of tone and aesthetic. But also, looking at the buildings in the area and Rita, and how they're all just what they were before painted green and covered in vines, it suggests the theme is 'theme park area being taken over by haunted forest, provoked by the Thirteen building being unearthed' which is really quite meta and fits in with the Towers thing for having 'living' areas like the new FV. A great idea but they lacked the creativity to pull that off, which would have required them actually blending the old theme into the new one instead of just blanketing everything with green.
 
A bit of an update to this application, with a heavy emphasis on 'bit'.

Firstly a new document has been added to the application, this time via the Environmental Health department of the council rather than the park. Interestingly, other than EH having no objection to the proposed development, this document states:
The proposed ride is a relative like for like replacement according to the site management. Noise source measurements have been derived from a similar ride at another Merlin Theme Park and can be considered appropriate for noise impact predictions.
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Secondly, the status of the application on the planning portal has been updated and now says 'Recommendation entered - Pending decision'. With this being listed as a Minor application, this will be a delegated decision (rather than going through the planning committee like Horizon was last year). So we could theoretically find out the fate of this application any day now.
 
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Dobba said:
A bit of an update to this application, with a heavy emphasis on 'bit'.

Firstly a new document has been added to the application, this time via the Environmental Health department of the council rather than the park. Interestingly, other than EH no objection to the proposed development, this document states:


Secondly, the status of the application on the planning portal has been updated and now says 'Recommendation entered - Pending decision'.
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Interesting! Do we know what the recommendation is?
 
Skyscraper said:
Interesting! Do we know what the recommendation is?
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As far as I can tell, not yet. The document that has been added today (it definitely wasn't there last night) is dated last Thursday so I can only assume that recommendation is in a document not yet uploaded to the planning portal.

The recommendation will have gone directly to the person who is making the decision, so I don't think there will be a hold-up in regards to it not being public yet.
 
Jb85 said:
I’m more interested in the other similar ride
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The noise assessment (Cahill Design Consultants P2260 Rev.1.0 Dec23) that this new document refers to for that, as far as I can tell, isn't on the planning portal either.

Other documents that we went through when the application first appeared make reference to it as well.
 
the wording is really intresting, the like for like replacment implies it is a new huss topspin but I don't think merlin are operating one at another park, also after reading it says from 10 meters it will be quieter than 80dB, could this limit the ride selection?
 
I think ‘like for like replacement’ could easily mean ‘replacing one flat ride with another flat ride’ I.e we aren’t sticking a new rollercoaster in here Mr/Mrs Planner, so I wouldn’t read too much into that.

The reference to another Merlin ride is interesting though, must narrow it down somewhat?
 
Unless it is an S&S Screamin' Swing. The air tanks are outlined, they have another for noise calculations. They won't as 80 dB is probably too quiet but I've heard of sillier things.
 
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