Ride Plans

Discussion in 'Talbot Street' started by Jb85, 20th Jul 2017.

  1. DistortAMG

    DistortAMG TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    907
    Likes Received:
    2,061
    Location:
    The Knights Templar
    Favourite Ride:
    Pirates of the Caribbean (DLP)
    I think both were 'real' designs, but both would not have had a realistic prospect of approval. John himself has said in numerous interviews including the one linked below, that coasters have been designed for every inch of the park. I think back at the height of Tussauds, they liked to have a sea of designs they could chop and change and pick from or draw inspiration from for future projects. Even given that though, they could be fake, but very very good fakes. I think the fact the broomstick coaster has a Vekoma ref at the bottom, makes it less plausible, but hey, that could just be me.

    The source for Stampedia being originally designed for the Nemesis site comes from a transcript on the TT SW5 minisite, from an interview with him at the ECC AGM in 2001. See the answer under the question titled 'Is there a main reason why a woodie hasn't been built at Alton Towers?' Obviously this is not concrete evidence but strong evidence and interestingly, overlaying Stampedia onto the Nemesis site gives a good fit, further supporting this. Although I agree, that there was the strong possibility of it being modified to compensate for the very different topography of the area at Portaventura.

    https://www.towerstimes.co.uk/history/from-the-archives/sw5/jw2001.htm

     
    Last edited: 8th Apr 2019
    b2311e, Bert2theSpark, Brad97 and 2 others like this.
    Posted 8th Apr 2019
    #41
  2. Brad97

    Brad97 TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    1,077
    Likes Received:
    1,715
    Location:
    Barnsley
    Favourite Ride:
    Montu
    I wonder how the park would be today if the cross valley woodie was built? It's a bit of an enthusiast's wet dream but from looking at the plans and recreations it seemed a little underwhelming outside of the two huge drops.

    I'd love to see a more modern take on the cross valley concept.
     
    Posted 8th Apr 2019
    #42
  3. Matt N

    Matt N TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    8,457
    Likes Received:
    7,156
    Location:
    Forest of Dean
    Favourite Ride:
    Mako (SeaWorld Orlando)
    To tell you the truth, I actually think Wicker Man looks better than the cross valley wooden coaster would have been. As much as the cross valley wooden coaster would allegedly have had 200+ft drops, it only really had those, whereas Wicker Man has a little more to it, if you get what I mean. The cross-valley wooden coaster would also likely have had the not especially comfortable PTC trains like you have on Megafobia, whereas Wicker Man has those fantastically comfortable GCI Millennium Flyers, which I reckon make a positive impact on the experience.
     
    Alsty likes this.
    Posted 8th Apr 2019
    #43
  4. OilyWater

    OilyWater TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    1,562
    Likes Received:
    3,589
    Location:
    Crawley
    Would be very interesting to know what all the wooden coasters planned for Alton Towers were over time, and how far they got before they got the marketing block.
     
    Brad97 likes this.
    Posted 9th Apr 2019
    #44
  5. Plastic Person

    Plastic Person TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    1,601
    Likes Received:
    2,979
    The Gloomy Wood and 'Jazzland' plans were both 100% elaborate fakes.
     
    DiogoJ42 likes this.
    Posted 9th Apr 2019
    #45
  6. DistortAMG

    DistortAMG TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    907
    Likes Received:
    2,061
    Location:
    The Knights Templar
    Favourite Ride:
    Pirates of the Caribbean (DLP)
    Interesting, could you elaborate?
     
    Posted 9th Apr 2019
    #46
  7. DiogoJ42

    DiogoJ42 TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    13,292
    Likes Received:
    20,072
    Location:
    Under your bed...
    Favourite Ride:
    The Metropolitan Line
    I'm pretty certain I remember someone on TTF owning up to faking them years ago. Can't remember who, annoyingly, but it was someone with a lot of time on their hands!
     
    Posted 9th Apr 2019
    #47
  8. DistortAMG

    DistortAMG TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    907
    Likes Received:
    2,061
    Location:
    The Knights Templar
    Favourite Ride:
    Pirates of the Caribbean (DLP)
    Fair enough, well they are great to look at, if nothing else.

    Anyway, enjoy some pics of the 'real' cross valley woodie. We've all seen these, it is nice to have them in a single thread though.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    That final picture, it is worth mentioning, the valley drops appear far more compressed in that picture because the valley and drops are viewed at an angle compared to the camera. So while they do appear correct in the plan, they won't be as compressed in reality.
     
    Last edited: 9th Apr 2019
    b2311e, OilyWater, Brad97 and 4 others like this.
    Posted 9th Apr 2019
    #48
  9. MaxPower

    MaxPower TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    573
    Likes Received:
    1,277
    Location:
    London
    It would be brilliant if this was just a massive trolling excercise on the Ropers by the park...

    I bet they sh*t kittens seeing those plans :tearsofjoy:
     
    ThisGuy likes this.
  10. DistortAMG

    DistortAMG TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    907
    Likes Received:
    2,061
    Location:
    The Knights Templar
    Favourite Ride:
    Pirates of the Caribbean (DLP)
    While not strictly a ride plan, it fits the bill.

    Found this excellent image on that other Alton website, I thought I would share as I am sure there are people who will not have seen this. The Grand Canyon rapids at Alton Towers nearing completion of construction, looking brand spanking new. Long before Katanga Canyon was built in the middle.

    There are certain features on the land that can be seen in that picture, that still exist to this day. Such as the large tree near the rides new second entrance once Katanga Canyon was built. (Look above the left side of the large lake, the queue today runs between the tree and the lake, with the entrance from Katanga Canyon to the left of the tree)

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: 24th Apr 2019
    Mi-Nigle, WillPS, Rob and 7 others like this.
  11. AT86

    AT86 TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    2,656
    Likes Received:
    7,287
    The scale of that construction project seems so huge. Nothing like that is ever undertaken today.
     
    James, b2311e and DistortAMG like this.
  12. DistortAMG

    DistortAMG TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    907
    Likes Received:
    2,061
    Location:
    The Knights Templar
    Favourite Ride:
    Pirates of the Caribbean (DLP)
    I also noticed there is also no Monorial cutting through the ride like there is today. You are right about the scale of construction though!

    You can clearly see the huge amounts of 'new earth' showing the sheer amount of soil that was terraformed to fit the ride into.
     
  13. OilyWater

    OilyWater TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    1,562
    Likes Received:
    3,589
    Location:
    Crawley
    What about Wicker Man? That was very big but more confined to one space. Or going back some, Oblivion and Nemesis? Huge amounts of earth were moved and some very complex construction in those.

    Rapids cover a large footprint but only a small proportion of that is actually ride construction. It's mostly the trench for the trough and the lakes. It was certainly one of the park's biggest ever projects but not too different from their big coaster projects.

    I just think it's a slightly arbitrary line to draw. The real shame is how you'll only see new developments like this for coasters now, not family rides anymore.
     
    DistortAMG likes this.
  14. Matt N

    Matt N TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    8,457
    Likes Received:
    7,156
    Location:
    Forest of Dean
    Favourite Ride:
    Mako (SeaWorld Orlando)
    I'd imagine The Smiler must have been a fairly complex construction project; fitting nearly 4,000ft of coaster track in the old Black Hole site can't have been easy, and I'd imagine a fair bit of earth was moved for it!
     
    DistortAMG likes this.
  15. Rob

    Rob TS Forum Team Team Member

    Messages:
    11,123
    Likes Received:
    15,562
    Location:
    Leicestershire
    Favourite Ride:
    Steel Vengeance
    Indeed. The Smiler was an incredibly complex project made harder by planning and groundwork incompetencies.
     
  16. DistortAMG

    DistortAMG TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    907
    Likes Received:
    2,061
    Location:
    The Knights Templar
    Favourite Ride:
    Pirates of the Caribbean (DLP)
    Once again, some excellent images I have found from another Alton Towers fan website. Sharing again as they should be seen. People may not have seen these.

    Moving along slightly from the last photo we still see the Grand Canyon Rapids, although looking slightly more settled into the landscape than before. We also see the monorail sidings and a huge open space of land which would later become Gloomy Wood and The Haunted House.

    [​IMG]

    This masterplan below is what would later become of the areas in the above photo. The first project undertaken at Alton Towers by Pearson Tussauds, and boy was it a large one! Developing a new land in the center of the Grand Canyon Rapids, which was to become Katanga Canyon, complete with a Mack powered rollercoaster. Alongside the development of a second area, Gloomy Wood. Anchored with a large scale dark ride, The Haunted House. The transit system of which was also coming from Mack rides. This development marked the beginning of a decade of serious, well thought out and executed large scale developments, that quite literally transformed Alton Towers into the market leading theme park of the UK and one of the top parks in Europe. The golden era if you will, started with these family areas and finished with the world's first flying roller coaster in 2002.

    For reference, the orange arrow on the picture below was added by me, to give people an approximate idea of the area and direction the photo above was taken from.

    [​IMG]

    The 'large tree' that I mentioned in the first post of the Grand Canyon Rapids construction can clearly be seen in this masterplan. Also, notice the lone tree on that large open undeveloped area, then look on the masterplan and see where it is in relation to the Haunted house. Is sits just behind the Haunted House show building. Gives a good idea of where things are.
     
    Last edited: 27th Apr 2019
    Rob, WillPS, DiogoJ42 and 5 others like this.
  17. OilyWater

    OilyWater TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    1,562
    Likes Received:
    3,589
    Location:
    Crawley
    Looks like the top one was taken after the clearance to build Haunted House and paths started to be built for Katanga Canyon, kool!
     
    DistortAMG likes this.
  18. DistortAMG

    DistortAMG TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    907
    Likes Received:
    2,061
    Location:
    The Knights Templar
    Favourite Ride:
    Pirates of the Caribbean (DLP)
    I did not even notice that actually. Nice!
     
  19. OilyWater

    OilyWater TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    1,562
    Likes Received:
    3,589
    Location:
    Crawley
    Actually looking at it again, maybe not! Maybe Haunted House really was just a big yard for the monorail depot and those roads in Katanga just access routes. Some of them later became public paths but the main route in from the Flume isn't there at all. Interesting picture though, the park really did change a lot
     
    DistortAMG likes this.
  20. Matt N

    Matt N TowersStreet Member

    Messages:
    8,457
    Likes Received:
    7,156
    Location:
    Forest of Dean
    Favourite Ride:
    Mako (SeaWorld Orlando)
    Sorry for the thread bump, but I have done a little digging on Attraction Source (formerly TowersTimes) and I found this interesting topic regarding the cancelled 2008 wooden coaster: https://www.attractionsource.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=14725

    Basically, a member named boozed claimed to have an uncle who’d seen the plans for the 2008 wooden coaster, and he said that the ride was to be like “the Scooby Doo wooden coaster in America”, and that the ride’s stats were as follows:
    • 43.45ft tall.
    • 3 trains, with “one in shed”.
    • Behind a “big building” (based on other speculation I’ve heard, this building was the Cred Street Theatre)
    • Brown or black in colour.
    • Themed to Wallace & Gromit.
    Now admittedly, this should be taken with a pinch of salt, as many members rubbished the claims later on in the thread, but certain elements of this member’s claims do make sense, in my opinion.

    For instance, the member states that the ride was “behind a big building”, and given that Alton Towers doesn’t have too many “big buildings”, I’d say it’s fair to infer that they were referring to the Cred Street Theatre, meaning that the ride would have been built in the elusive Coaster Corner. Tales from the Towers’ brief insert about this ride also mentioned it being built in Coaster Corner, so seeing as Tales from the Towers was a fairly well-researched book, I’d say that anything published in it is likely to be true.

    As outlandish as it might sound, the Wallace & Gromit theme would also make sense. John Wardley later said in an interview that he had designed a W&G-themed woodie for Alton Towers in the past, and he was said to be working on the 2008 woodie, so even though I’m not the most lateral of thinkers, I think it’s a fair assumption to say that the W&G woodie proposal John mentioned might well have been what was originally planned for the 2008 wooden coaster under DIC. Of course, Merlin came in and scrapped the proposal, and we instead got Mutiny Bay in 2008.

    Does anyone else know anything about the 2008 wooden coaster, or Project Shark as it was apparently known? Is it known whether this member’s suggestions were true? I know it’s not the cross-valley woodie, but it’s still a project that’s always really intrigued me!
     
    TheAverageNerd likes this.
    Posted 4th Jul 2021
    #60

Share This Page