2025: General Discussion

[Dave]

I’ve noticed quite a few parks are prominently advertising that their rides operate in winter. Obviously Energylandia and Phantasialand are famous for it but Paultons are doing the same which suggests an increasing appetite for it.

What is it that differentiates the rides. Why can Taron operate and not Rita? Black Mamba and not Nemesis? And so on.

The two big issues are:

1) You often have to move all the coasters to winter running wheels which takes time away from maintenance.

2) You have to move winter maintenance into the main season which requires more maintenance resource. Towers struggle to keep the staff they have never mind increase it.

To be fair to Towers they also have the issue of their location, they are high in the hills so first to get sub- 5 degree temperatures (it could be 2 degrees at Towers yet 6 degrees at Paultons at the same time), and even a little snow causes the roads to snarl up, it’s a big risk for them.

 

[Bowser]

Don't forget it's not just the operation of the ride itself to take into consideration but evacs too. I suspect that since The Smiler, they've become ultra-sensitive to the safety of guests in the event of an evac so the last thing they want is to operate Oblivion in -5C only to have guests evac'ing from 100ft up descending down an icy metal staircase, or evac'ing from from a icy Wicker Man wooden lift hill.

Baron 1898 at Efteling operates in snow. Not minus 10C of course but it's a 365 ride.

How the European parks get around this, I don't know - maybe they aren't so ultra-sensitive on the safety of guests when evac'ing.

There's definitely a lower level of H&S from the European parks that i've experienced. Not that they feel dangerous or reckless in the slightest but the appetite is notably different, be it on-ride filming, weather operations or height restrictions.

 

[Mick]

The weather this Friday just gone, where there was heavy rain literally all day made me reflect that only one week earlier it was fireworks and how that would’ve been completely KO’d by the weather we had.

It also made me think just how completely unappealing I’d find a UK winter theme park visit, the confidence that I’d have even a half-decent day would be so low.

 

[rob666]

... Oblivion in -5C only to have guests evac'ing from 100ft up descending down an icy metal staircase, or evac'ing from from a icy Wicker Man wooden lift hill.

How the European parks get around this, I don't know ...

Many many years ago, I did a brief post graduation job in the steel industry...
Heavy tread galvanised aludip footways and stairs sir.
Bit like heavy duty cheesegrater.
Made for the job.

Flipping expensive though.

 

[Blackrock]

Problem is in winter it’s going to be an absolute dog and pony show getting there isn’t it. Those country roads aren’t going to experience much if any snow/ice clearance, they are bad enough in rain.

The others down south are all conveniently just off the M25 so don’t have this geographical Achilles heel.

The roads aren’t too bad tbh, they’re school runs so always kept clear by the council. At least the side coming from Stoke, Cheadle, Alton, Oakamoor.

 

[NuttySquirrel]

The roads aren’t too bad tbh, they’re school runs so always kept clear by the council. At least the side coming from Stoke, Cheadle, Alton, Oakamoor.

I would beg to differ. I had a nightmare journey one Fireworks weekend when it took me an hour to find a passable route to my accommodation because most of the local roads were flooded. It was actually pretty terrifying.

Mainland Europe does experience cold winters and there'll be some days at EP for example where rides close due to icy spells, however the UK is particularly susceptible to stormy winters due to its proximity to the Atlantic. It's much less pleasant to be at a park during a winter storm than on a cold but otherwise dry and clear day.

Losing the winter maintenance period would also cause problems as you've then got to fit scheduled maintenance for all your rides into the main season. Efteling often closes attractions in shoulder seasons like May and October and that can be pretty disappointing if you want to experience everything (on my last two visits I've missed out on Pagode due to scheduled maintenance). Efteling are pretty good at advertising scheduled closures in advance but sometimes they slip by a few days (as happened on Baron recently). Imagine Merlin trying to implement a similar system, it would be a disaster.

 

[Blackrock]

I would beg to differ. I had a nightmare journey one Fireworks weekend when it took me an hour to find a passable route to my accommodation because most of the local roads were flooded. It was actually pretty terrifying.

Mainland Europe does experience cold winters and there'll be some days at EP for example where rides close due to icy spells, however the UK is particularly susceptible to stormy winters due to its proximity to the Atlantic. It's much less pleasant to be at a park during a winter storm than on a cold but otherwise dry and clear day.

Losing the winter maintenance period would also cause problems as you've then got to fit scheduled maintenance for all your rides into the main season. Efteling often closes attractions in shoulder seasons like May and October and that can be pretty disappointing if you want to experience everything (on my last two visits I've missed out on Pagode due to scheduled maintenance). Efteling are pretty good at advertising scheduled closures in advance but sometimes they slip by a few days (as happened on Baron recently). Imagine Merlin trying to implement a similar system, it would be a disaster.

Which roads were flooded? Sure if you’re going the absolute back roads which locals use or satnavs can take you down then that occasionally happens but the ‘main’ routes say coming from Stoke, through Cheadle, through oakamoor up to Towers that’s not an issue and they’re the ones that are always attended too when we have bad weather.

More chance imo of multiple downed trees making roads impassable which we’ve had this weekend, or power cuts which are a regular occurrence round this way which we’ve also experienced this weekend. Not sure if Towers would be impacted by local power cuts though.

 

[NuttySquirrel]

Which roads were flooded? Sure if you’re going the absolute back roads which locals use or satnavs can take you down then that occasionally happens but the ‘main’ routes say coming from Stoke, through Cheadle, through oakamoor up to Towers that’s not an issue and they’re the ones that are always attended too when we have bad weather.

More chance imo of multiple downed trees making roads impassable which we’ve had this weekend, or power cuts which are a regular occurrence round this way which we’ve also experienced this weekend. Not sure if Towers would be impacted by local power cuts though.

On that evening the main road between Leek and Ashbourne was closed, as were several other local roads including the one that goes past Peak Wildlife Park.

Granted I was not travelling directly to Towers but to my accommodation in Ipstones, but many others visitors would have been doing similarly and staying locally nearby especially given the price vs quality of onsite hotels. Alton Towers is in a rural location, it's very different from Thorpe Park for example which is well connected by motorways and suburban thoroughfares.

That was an extreme weekend but it did make me realise how unsuitably located the park is for 365 operations. It's quite easy to get snowed in in that valley as well. People visit in the summer and think it's all very green and pleasant, they don't realise how harsh it can be in the depths of winter.

 

[Blackrock]

On that evening the main road between Leek and Ashbourne was closed, as were several other local roads including the one that goes past Peak Wildlife Park.

Granted I was not travelling directly to Towers but to my accommodation in Ipstones, but many others visitors would have been doing similarly and staying locally nearby especially given the price vs quality of onsite hotels. Alton Towers is in a rural location, it's very different from Thorpe Park for example which is well connected by motorways and suburban thoroughfares.

That was an extreme weekend but it did make me realise how unsuitably located the park is for 365 operations. It's quite easy to get snowed in in that valley as well. People visit in the summer and think it's all very green and pleasant, they don't realise how harsh it can be in the depths of winter.

Ah fair enough, the north side of the park and the locations you’re talking about are heading more towards the moors and the Peak District itself and it’s a lot higher than towers so will be a bit more treacherous, huge snow drifts etc. but where I’m located it’s not too bad and the same goes for Towers itself really.

Being snowed in isn’t something I’ve experienced yet but I wouldn’t say no to a few days off work tbf the council are hot on keeping the main roads clear because school buses use the main roads around Alton/Oakamoor but that wasn’t always the case.

Anyone coming from the north in that kinda weather should just stick to the main roads and come through Stoke or the back end M1/A50 Derby/Uttoxeter way if they were travelling to Towers.

I guess if you’re staying somewhere like Ipstones you’re even more in the sticks there than Alton itself so could be an issue during bad weather.

 

[havaska]

When I went to the park yesterday, travelling from from Bolton through Leek and Macclesfield, a lot of roads were flooded and there was a lot of downed trees.

 

[Blackrock]

When I went to the park yesterday, travelling from from Bolton through Leek and Macclesfield, a lot of roads were flooded and there was a lot of downed trees.

To be expected which is why it’s not the way I’d advise people to travel if you’re coming from that direction this time of year and I’d just stick to the motorways. Leek whilst not being far is quite high with roads that have huge dips which make it more prone to flooding.

 

[flyingguitar]

I was at the park today, and noticed something, they had actors in TCAAM area and some phalanx (and I think some guards at David Walliams) with the doll character out, phalanx army people etc cheering people the people running. I didn't bump into them throughout the day, however I wasn't really walking round like I normally would and was mostly in areas that didn't have actors (X-sector, wicker man, and a small amount of time in FV)

 

[havaska]

I was at the park today, and noticed something, they had actors in TCAAM area and some phalanx (and I think some guards at David Walliams) with the doll character out, phalanx army people etc cheering people the people running. I didn't bump into them throughout the day, however I wasn't really walking round like I normally would and was mostly in areas that didn't have actors (X-sector, wicker man, and a small amount of time in FV)

Yes I noticed that too yesterday. They had the guards for Walliams, teletubbies, curse characters and a host of Phalanx people along the course of the run.

 

[NuttySquirrel]

To be expected which is why it’s not the way I’d advise people to travel if you’re coming from that direction this time of year and I’d just stick to the motorways. Leek whilst not being far is quite high with roads that have huge dips which make it more prone to flooding.

Just stick to motorways...

That only makes sense if you actually live near a motorway to begin with.

Travelling to the park from Macclesfield via Leek is 24 miles and takes 48 minutes. Going via the M6 and Stoke doubles that distance and takes an hour and a half. If it's clear (which it won't be!).

You can see why people don't want to bother. Makes perfect sense for the park to close.

 

[Bowser]

You can see why people don't want to bother. Makes perfect sense for the park to close.

The park doesn't close though, they're open all of December and the start of January, just with a limited ride offering so that makes it very much a separate issue from transport. The Water Park/hotels also remain open in this period and i believe reopen in February half term.

Interesting that Chessington are opening Dragon Fury this winter.

 

[Blackrock]

Just stick to motorways...

That only makes sense if you actually live near a motorway to begin with.

Travelling to the park from Macclesfield via Leek is 24 miles and takes 48 minutes. Going via the M6 and Stoke doubles that distance and takes an hour and a half. If it's clear (which it won't be!).

You can see why people don't want to bother. Makes perfect sense for the park to close.

I get what you’re saying but you could say the same thing about anything, I wouldn’t go down the roads you’re talking about during winter and I live here. So if I knew I wanted to go towards where you are I would venture out of my way to do so even if it was longer.

 

[John]

Alternatively, you might choose not make a non-essential journey at all. Which brings us back to the original point being made.

Similarly, whilst parts of the resort are open over winter it's still a pretty low-key affair aimed to give people a bit of extra incentive to stay over and boost the occupancy rate a bit. Having stuff like Sea Life and Marauders open costs then very little but it's a big jump from that to something that would appeal to a day visitor.

As for Chessington, it has much better access (both by road and public transport) and given the high overheads for the zoo it makes more sense to try to stay open. Thorpe OTOH with basically no resort and no similar overhead costs just doesn't bother at all

 

[Ash]

Just stick to motorways...

That only makes sense if you actually live near a motorway to begin with.

Travelling to the park from Macclesfield via Leek is 24 miles and takes 48 minutes. Going via the M6 and Stoke doubles that distance and takes an hour and a half. If it's clear (which it won't be!).

You can see why people don't want to bother. Makes perfect sense for the park to close.

If only it had a station nearby

 

[Poisson]

If only it had a station nearby

Even heritage lines close over winter, that's their engineering period. The isn't many January major events I can think of outside GCR Winter Gala.

 

[djtruefitt]

Yes I noticed that too yesterday. They had the guards for Walliams, teletubbies, curse characters and a host of Phalanx people along the course of the run.

The always have these ou during the run days, usually you’ll find actors in CBeebies, valley, gloomy wood, Walliams and the hotels. I believe even the traffic patrol were out yesterday, who haven’t been seen on park for years!

I’m guessing RunThrough probably pay to have ents on park or ask for it, as I don’t see why towers would randomly just bring the Walliams characters out for no reason, when they haven’t been used for a good 3 or 4 years.

These will also be the same actors who I assume are permanent towers staff (not RWS) who now just work in CBeebies land, so they’ll all just be staffed in for the run weekend.