Didn't think of that!
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jon81uk
TS Member
I don’t think Rameses got as many riders as it did spectators though.
I think a thrilling ride or two would be okay in the park. But not sure this is the right choice, mainly around capacity though more than thrill level.
RicketyCricket
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- Taron
Yeah that's fair but Rameses was a different beast. Genuinely quite intimidating even for veteran thrill seekers.
DistortAMG
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- POTC Disneyland Paris
Something this does demonstrate, that I do not think anyone has mentioned. Is this development gives an early but promising insight into how a private Merlin could operate.
ALOT of people were critical of Merlins privatisation, some were adamant the RTPs would be neglected while all the effort went to midway and Legolands.
Given that this is probably one of their first projects fully under private hands, it looks very promising indeed. Too early to say for sure, but I eagerly wait their next project.
But installing a B&M of all manufactures, in their most neglected park, shows clear intentions in my oppinion.
ALOT of people were critical of Merlins privatisation, some were adamant the RTPs would be neglected while all the effort went to midway and Legolands.
Given that this is probably one of their first projects fully under private hands, it looks very promising indeed. Too early to say for sure, but I eagerly wait their next project.
But installing a B&M of all manufactures, in their most neglected park, shows clear intentions in my oppinion.
AT86
TS Member
Yep the planning documents state 1.4m ‘family thrill coaster’.
I agree and this is one of the reasons I was talking about multi ride deals with B&M. Although this is a different private Merlin to the last it isn't completely. Blackstone is back in the picture and kirkbi has been a shareholder in Merlin for a long time. They know how the company operates and know that it was almost certainly better under private ownership as they bought them out.
This is a big leap for Merlin and something that really is a turning point. If Merlin can get back to what they where when they acquired Tussauds, we could see massive improvements in all the resort theme parks. The RTP have always been more of a risk in terms of investment which means that under public ownership they had less flexibility when doing it however know privatised they can focus on growing this section of the business that used to play such a key role.
When Blackstone owned Merlin beforehand they made massive investments in the RTP and if this is going to be repeated then we are in for some great times at Merlin. Of course Merlin is very different to what is was then.
Chessington hasn't received anything like this under public ownership as it was just to risky. This is clearly showing that Merlin are taking risks again particularly investing in something like this during a pandemic.
DistortAMG
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Someone said:
I love reading old messages after stuff is announced..especially when people are so adament It cannot be something based on old and now outdated precedents.
Interesting how we humans work sometimes.
Also 3.5 million doesnt sound out the realms of possibility if they have just quoted the fide hardware itself. Remeber they still need to lay foundations, landscape, build station, theme it and what not else, which all add to the cost and do not get covered by B&M.
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Craig
TS Administrator
Personally I'm not surprised by the choice of B&M. Their traditional business of big, headline coasters is being eaten into by the likes of (relative) newcomers Mack, a resurgence of wooden/hybrid coasters and Vekoma producing some decent stuff these days too. Like all businesses, the pandemic has likely made them reassess what they offer and we're now seeing smaller scale rides such as this cropping up. Considering their past of working with Merlin/Tussauds it makes sense for something to be done for them.
However, whilst the new hardware is great there's plenty of other stuff to address at Chessington and the wider Merlin group that I'd want to see before we start singing their praises about a massive turnaround. There needs to be a real focus on quality as well as the addition of new attractions. That is, look after the existing stuff they have and refurbish it to a decent standard where needed. Then of course the big one - make sure the new stuff is of sufficient quality with a decent budget provided so that it lasts longer than a year (I'm looking at you Walliams and CBeebies!).
However, whilst the new hardware is great there's plenty of other stuff to address at Chessington and the wider Merlin group that I'd want to see before we start singing their praises about a massive turnaround. There needs to be a real focus on quality as well as the addition of new attractions. That is, look after the existing stuff they have and refurbish it to a decent standard where needed. Then of course the big one - make sure the new stuff is of sufficient quality with a decent budget provided so that it lasts longer than a year (I'm looking at you Walliams and CBeebies!).
Nor am I and I think it's a great choice for Chessington's new signature ride(?)
100% Merlin are no where near what they had before at all of there parks but things like this can be a turnaround. I would presume Walliams world was designed and planned before Merlin went private and so this may not be up to the new standard. What I am trying to get at is that Merlin could be much better if they sort out there parks and start giving them decent quality additions. As much as I have concerns about capacity for this new coaster the choice of B&M proves to me that they are again having that little extra in the budget for the hardware, something Merlin had lost in later years of public ownership. I really do hope I am right and this proves to be the turning point that has been well overdue.
DistortAMG
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The fact we are seeing this, as well as a big focus on guest satisfaction and hugely revised park hours at AT, are a clear sign that the winds are a changing at Merlin.
To early to sing praise for sure, might not be anything to praise full stop. But something Is certainly occurring. That is against the grain of the last ten years.
To early to sing praise for sure, might not be anything to praise full stop. But something Is certainly occurring. That is against the grain of the last ten years.
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Rick
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- Crux
Interestingly, Dollywood negotiated 1.27 m for Wild Eagle, but I forget the circumstances.
dazza4783
TS Member
Surely if it is a B&M, and it certainly looks that way from the track shape, then it will be a prototype 4D wing coaster. That helix/spike will be way too uncomfortable banked at 90 degrees like that unless there is rotation of the seats. Remember the train is slowing to a stop and then reversing so you will be in that position for a fairly long time. Only makes sense if the seats rotate. Also means that the Inversion in the track doesn't necessarily mean that you will go upside down.
And if it is that prototype, we can probably expect to see a larger scale version at another Merlin park in the future. SW9 maybe.
And if it is that prototype, we can probably expect to see a larger scale version at another Merlin park in the future. SW9 maybe.
I would have thought if it had rotating seats or anything radically different to a standard wing coaster this would have been mentioned in the noise report. The report mentions that the similar ride in Italy is bigger and has a lift which creates more noise. If it did have rotating seats I would expect that to have been highlighted as a difference, possibly increasing screams etc from riderrs.
it is a possibility but I am not so sure, I think more than likely it will be standard wing trains. I also doubt Merlin would install a prototype in the same country that they then add a bigger version a few years later.
who knows what Alton are planning for SW9, but even if it was a B&M surf coaster or other anything else B&M come up with, I am sure It will be a completely different model/ride type to what chessington are installing.
the fact this ride is already different enough and nothing like it in the UK or anywhere else for that matter. The first wing boomerang, beyond vertical spike, backwards, chessington first launched coaster, inversion over the enterance area (great marketing image) and possibly film IP, I doubt the ride needs to have anything else such as spinning/rotating seats. The ride fits all the criteria that Merlin like a project to have in order to give it the green light.
it is a possibility but I am not so sure, I think more than likely it will be standard wing trains. I also doubt Merlin would install a prototype in the same country that they then add a bigger version a few years later.
who knows what Alton are planning for SW9, but even if it was a B&M surf coaster or other anything else B&M come up with, I am sure It will be a completely different model/ride type to what chessington are installing.
the fact this ride is already different enough and nothing like it in the UK or anywhere else for that matter. The first wing boomerang, beyond vertical spike, backwards, chessington first launched coaster, inversion over the enterance area (great marketing image) and possibly film IP, I doubt the ride needs to have anything else such as spinning/rotating seats. The ride fits all the criteria that Merlin like a project to have in order to give it the green light.
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dazza4783
TS Member
Maybe using a coaster with a lift to compare it with was to compensate for the possibility of more noise due to the seats rotating. Bare in mind that Thunderbird would have been more suited to compare it to if it was just a standard Wing train with a launch. Although, I guess it is possible that they wouldn't want to "advertise" a coaster not owned by Merlin in the planning application.
They said the Italy ride would be more noisy due to the lift so wouldn’t have been to compensate for spinning seats. Also much easier and cheaper to do a ride assessment on a ride you already own than one in America- made even more complicated due to Covid.
it’s always a possibility but I think it is highly unlikely to have rotating seats.
Islander
TS Member
This is being massively overthought - bear in mind that the noise assessment is for the planning application, which will be reviewed by the local planning authority, who will more than likely have no knowledge at all of differing ride types/variations/possible future innovations.
This development will be quieter than a similar development in Italy - realistically, all you can deduce from that is that the similar development in Italy is a coaster of similar size, with similar sized trains (in this case winged). Really is nothing further that can be deduced from the noise assessment.
This development will be quieter than a similar development in Italy - realistically, all you can deduce from that is that the similar development in Italy is a coaster of similar size, with similar sized trains (in this case winged). Really is nothing further that can be deduced from the noise assessment.
Tom
TS Member
One thing that confuses me slightly about the noise assessment is does it relate to an installed ride or not? The grammar suggests it is a mooted project for Italy, but how could that be the basis for a comparable noise assessment if it isn't in operation? In Italy, are they using Chessington's ride as a comparison in their noise assessment?
Matt N
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I think they’re using Raptor at Gardaland as the reference in Italy. It matches the description perfectly.One thing that confuses me slightly about the noise assessment is does it relate to an installed ride or not? The grammar suggests it is a mooted project for Italy, but how could that be the basis for a comparable noise assessment if it isn't in operation? In Italy, are they using Chessington's ride as a comparison in their noise assessment?