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Coke Freestyle Now Launched

rob666 said:
We need to encourage people to consume fewer calories, especially the dead ones in soft drinks.
It's not "relentless curtailing of personal choices", you can still choose sugar, and pay more in most instances.
Our population, national and worldwide, is getting fatter and fatter, sad fact.
Obesity is now a massive problem for the NHS...should we just stand by and let the nation get even more obese?
Government needs to do something to make the nation healthier, wouldn't you agree.
Never seen so many oversize people in theme parks, the problem is getting worse, very quickly.
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I have to disagree.
There are many establishments where the option to buy sugary drinks has been removed entirely. KFC for example now only serve Pepsi Max. I went to a restaurant in Liverpool where I asked for a coke and was told they only do diet, or zero.
All that while serving lashings of deep fried fatty, carb heavy food?
The government could do anything to help the situation, but as usual, they add a tax on to it.

Let's also not forget the impact it has on other areas, such as Lucozade reducing their sugar content and filling it with sweeteners, and the impact this has had on diabetics who used to use Lucozade to quickly combat a hypoglycaemic episode.

If that isn't curtailing, then I don't know what is.

GooseOnTheLoose said:
It's a decision by Coca-Cola, more than Alton Towers or Merlin, and is part of Coke's long term strategy to remove and reduce sugar in their drinks offering.

This article is a little dated, from 2019, but it reports on the direction that Coca-Cola is taking to offer "healthier" options in Freestyle machine.
www.beveragedaily.com

Coca-Cola cuts back on sugar with bubbler beverages

Shifting consumer taste is causing major beverage companies to adapt, make ‘healthy’ drinks taste better and be more accessible. Coca-Cola is using its Freestyle machines and new bubbler dispensers to highlight its ‘craft, elevated’ drinks in the market.
www.beveragedaily.com www.beveragedaily.com

I'd suggest that this is part of a strategy to self-regulate, lest the government decide to do it for them.

Edit: It's also worth highlighting that the sugar tax, in the UK, is paid by the manufacturer. It's not paid by the consumer and it's not paid by the retailer. Quite simply Coca-Cola have removed the options slowly over the years to pay less tax.

The UK sugar tax, officially called the Soft Drinks Industry Levy (SDIL), has a two-tiered system:
  • Tier 1: Drinks with 5 to 8 grams of sugar per 100ml - Taxed at 18 pence per liter
  • Tier 2: Drinks with more than 8 grams of sugar per 100ml - Taxed at 24 pence per liter
Exemptions
  • Drinks with less than 5 grams of sugar per 100ml are exempt.
  • Pure fruit juices.
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I don't think coca-cola will be reducing their sugar content as they already offer diet and zero sugar variants.
I think the majority of people are too young to remember this, but they tried changing the recipe to coke in the 80's and it didn't go down well, and they quickly backpedaled.
Pepsi have reduced their sugar content in the regular drink, and it tastes awful now, so it's another brand I have parted ways with.
Ribera did the same, and I no longer buy that either.
I guess the tax/levy is working in some ways, but not in any way that makes a big difference for me, other than saving me money. I don't adore coca-cola, so I drink a lot less fizzy drinks at home now and tend to stick to water, hot drinks, and cordial at home these days, with the occasional glass of orange juice.
 
Craig said:
Coca Cola still make "full fat" coke and so far haven't amended the sugar content, and as people have mentioned it's still available for Freestyle machines. Just like Maccies changing Fanta and Oasis to "zero" versions, it's more for cost reasons more than anything else. No matter how much they want to push the health side of things, they'll happily dish out your fries, greasy burgers, nuggets and Flurries.

Regardless of the specifics who pays the sugar tax to the HMRC, that tax is passed onto the business (i.e. Merlin) and ultimately onto the customer though as the wholesale and retail costs are higher as a result. It's a margins reasoning more than anything else - much less hassle to pay for the cheaper, sugar free versions than muck about with lower margins for sugared drinks or specific cup activations.
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I never said that Coca-Cola were going to reformulate Coke Classic / Coca-Cola or remove it. They'll leave their flagship product alone, but as they're the ones paying the sugar tax and have to administrate it, it makes financial sense for them to limit the full sugar options they produce in the first place.

Simply put, I don't think Coca-Cola are producing sugar versions of their other products, outside of Classic Coke, for Freestyle machines in the UK anymore. Outlets don't want to stock them, because Coca-Cola are passing on the price increase, so there's less demand, and slimming down a product line keeps things lean for Coke.
 
GooseOnTheLoose said:
I never said that Coca-Cola were going to reformulate Coke Classic / Coca-Cola or remove it. They'll leave their flagship product alone, but as they're the ones paying the sugar tax and have to administrate it, it makes financial sense for them to limit the full sugar options they produce in the first place.

Simply put, I don't think Coca-Cola are producing sugar versions of their other products, outside of Classic Coke, for Freestyle machines in the UK anymore. Outlets don't want to stock them, because Coca-Cola are passing on the price increase, so there's less demand, and slimming down a product line keeps things lean for Coke.
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Wellcoke didtry in the past to adjust coke but it didn't exactly end well..

Don't come have a with and without sugar option for some drinks (fuze for example) on freestyle?
 
Real shame, I'm down to be doing two trips this year so was debating grabbing a freestyle cup... However, I'm really sensitive to the aftertaste of drinks and coke zero/diet coke has the worst aftertaste for me - so if there's no full sugar coke, I won't be buying a cup.
 
STEJENT said:
Ribera did the same, and I no longer buy that either.
I guess the tax/levy is working in some ways, but not in any way that makes a big difference ...
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Ribena passed itself off as a health drink for a great many years, thus rotting many kids teeth in the past.
It was pretty much pure sugar, in different forms.
STEJENT said:
I don't adore coca-cola, so I drink a lot less fizzy drinks at home now and tend to stick to water, hot drinks, and cordial at home these days, with the occasional glass of orange juice.
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Sounds like that government policy is working then!

As a kid we got one bottle of cordial between five of us, to last a week.
After that, it was water, milk or tea.
No other alternatives.

Overall, average weight has shot up, as lifestyles have become more sedentary, and calorific intake has shot up.
We have to do something, what else, other than taxing fat at retail harder too, do you suggest.
Better a sugar tax than compulsory jogging in my eyes.
 
rob666 said:
Ribena passed itself off as a health drink for a great many years, thus rotting many kids teeth in the past.
It was pretty much pure sugar, in different forms.

Sounds like that government policy is working then!
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I never viewed Ribera as anything but a soft drink. I remember when they came out with that "tooth kind" rubbish, that literally tasted like you were drinking it after brushing your teeth.

I'm not not drinking sugary drinks because of the government policy. We still have cans of coke in the house, I just choose not to consume very much of it at home as I have gotten older.

My point still stands about the Lucozade though and the impact it has had on people with diabetes.
 
I’m one of those uncommon people who actually prefers the diet versions of Coke and Pepsi to their full-fat alternatives, so if I were to use a Freestyle machine in the parks, I actually wouldn’t mind this for me personally. I love Diet Coke and Pepsi Max, but I never liked their full-sugar equivalents, as I always found them to taste a bit weird and overly syrupy.

In terms of whether they should sell full-sugar drinks; I’m in two minds. I agree that something probably needs to be done to combat the obesity crisis, but at the same time, I’m not sure on the complete removal of the full-sugar options from sale. Maybe it would have been a better compromise to just continue to sell them, but make the person pay a higher price for them to cover the sugar tax? Perhaps an extra, say, 50p or £1 or whatever per refill of Coca-Cola versus in extra money per refill of Diet Coke? That would disincentivise the consumption of Coca-Cola, but not ban it outright.

I’ve been drinking far less soft drinks in general in recent times, though; in the parks these days, I mainly take a water bottle. Despite once being a fiend for it, I don’t drink Pepsi Max at all at home anymore, and I mainly save it for when I’m in a restaurant. At home these days, I mostly drink water, with the odd glass of very weak orange squash.

On the subject of these Freestyle machines, do Merlin allow you to refill a water bottle with water through them for free? When we went to Universal Orlando last June, we got brilliant use out of their Freestyle machines from simply refilling our water bottles with fresh water for free.
 
Don't really have an opinion either way on the sugary drink subject, I do however find it slightly odd that you can't get sugary drinks but you can get alcohol. Probably just me, but I find serving pints at places like Legoland weird.
 
TPick said:
Don't really have an opinion either way on the sugary drink subject, I do however find it slightly odd that you can't get sugary drinks but you can get alcohol. Probably just me, but I find serving pints at places like Legoland weird.
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I’m pretty sure you can get bottles of regular Coke from shops in the park, it’s just not included in the refillable cup option - and sadly, neither is beer.
 
Matt N said:
On the subject of these Freestyle machines, do Merlin allow you to refill a water bottle with water through them for free? When we went to Universal Orlando last June, we got brilliant use out of their Freestyle machines from simply refilling our water bottles with fresh water for free.
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No, this functionality was switched off during the summer of the 2022 season without a replacement provision. In 2023 the Merlin parks installed free water refill stations, but they are the slowest fountains known to goose. I've been in a faster moving queue for The Smiler than I have for water at Thorpe Park.
 
GooseOnTheLoose said:
No, this functionality was switched off during the summer of the 2022 season without a replacement provision. In 2023 the Merlin parks installed free water refill stations, but they are the slowest fountains known to goose. I've been in a faster moving queue for The Smiler than I have for water at Thorpe Park.
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At least the Thorpe ones are easy to find. chessington seem to hide theirs to the point even their staff don’t know where they are. The Warwick ones don’t stop, causing huge lakes of wasted water. But I’m straying into pet hate territory now so I’ll stop…
 
GooseOnTheLoose said:
Simply put, I don't think Coca-Cola are producing sugar versions of their other products, outside of Classic Coke, for Freestyle machines in the UK anymore. Outlets don't want to stock them, because Coca-Cola are passing on the price increase, so there's less demand, and slimming down a product line keeps things lean for Coke.
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Dr Pepper alongside the Zero variant is absolutely still in the ones at AT or was at least a month or two ago when we went. Whatever passes as "full sugar" Fanta is still in them as well. The special drinks are always the best ones though. Just after Nemesis launched there was some sort of Nemesis drink available at the bottom right corner, I think it was just essentially some Fanta variant but it was quite tasty.

We cruise on Royal Caribbean who have the good-olde-USA Freestyle variants and it's a night and day difference though all their drinks are the HFCS variants so taste different.
 
The government we have had for past 14 years is the worst, in my opinion, that there's been in my lifetime for various reasons. But if I had to be honest and had to name some of it's achievements, I would mention the upcoming phased smoking abolition (not legislation yet so will be interesting to see how they mess that up), same sex marriage, and the sugary drinks levy.

At the turn of the millennium, Classic Coke was the best selling soft drink in all UK nations, apart from Scotland where it was Irn Bru. Coca Cola sold Diet Coke (which I've always thought tastes like foamy dishwater) as their main sugar free alternative, and it's now their best seller and has been for many years. Pepsi Max (my favourite cola actually) is by far and away the best selling Pepsi branded cola and has been for a long time. Coke Zero has gone through many formulations and various branding revisions and Coke have attempted for it to replace their classic as their main headline brand as the brand leader, hence the red packaging made to look like the full sugar variant. Drinks such as Sprite, Fanta, and Dr Pepper were reformulated to lower their sugar content so that the sugar tax did not apply.

Pepsi Max was launched in the early 90's to much success, the push towards Coke Zero and lowering the sugar content of other brands they make all preceded the sugar tax. The industry knew it was coming, innovated and changed their behaviour voluntarily ahead of this. There is no limit to the amount of sugary drinks manufacturers can make and sell, or the amount people can buy and consume (I enjoy a full sugar Classic Coke now and then). The retailer, wholesaler, and manufacturer can choose not to pass the levy on to consumers if they wish. It's an example of good legislation to encourage industry and consumers to change their behaviours in the interest of public health, rather than dictating what they must and must not do. All are still free to do as they please as long as they pay their taxes.

Contrast that to the poorly timed and poorly implemented HFSS legislation, which demands compliance with a list of complicated rules that not a single business has been prosecuted for breaking yet, and there's a marked legislative quality difference.

It's likely Merlin's choice not to have Coca Cola Classic on their freestyle machines for simplicity reasons. No one is stopping them. Although I don't understand why Mezzo Mix isn't available? It's available in most other Freestyle machines and as far as I'm aware it's just Coke syrup mixed with some Fanta syrup. Delicious too and reminds me of european park trips.
 
Well Mezzo Mix can get in the bin for starters.

I think the issue a lot of people have is the removal of choice - which I guess makes sense for things like this where you have essentially unlimited sugar on tap and you don't want kids just pouring it down their throats. What I don't agree with though is everyone who isn't Coca Cola reforumulating their products and claiming that they taste better than ever and so on, when they actually taste anything but. See also the Cadbury Dairy Milk 30% less sugar bars that they discontinued pretty sharpish because no one was buying the things.

I always used to be a Pepsi person for my full-sugar drinks kick but the new Pepsi just tastes rancid now so it's Coca Cola (cherry for preference) or Irn Bru where available.

I'm probably also an outlier in that I don't object to my kids having sweets and drinks in reasonable moderation. They go to the dentist every 6 months who is happy with them and play sports 4 times a week so its all balanced. Full denial of treats ends up with eating them in secret anyway.
 
A reminder this is the Coke Freestyle topic. Although the sugar tax comes into the choices available, please try and keep discussion on the range available in the machines and the potential reasoning. For the rights and wrongs/general discussion of the sugar tax policy we have the off topic forums for that :)
 
I’ve hardly used my freestyle cups since they took away the full sugar coke option. I don’t drink it at home and stick to sugar free drinks but occasionally when I go out I do like to ‘treat’ myself with an original Coca Cola. This is what made freestyle worth it for me, as I refuse to pay what ever ridiculous amount they charge for a 500ml bottle from their outlets. Now I bring my water bottle and fill that up for free, and I might add some flavour to it using one of those little squeeze containers you can buy (I forget the proper name for them now). So I guess you could argue that the sugar tax is doing what is intended in a way.

No skin off my nose, I can always bring my own sugary drinks or pay through the nose for a single bottle on park if I want to, although it’s not quite the same as Coca Cola from the ‘tap’ imo. But sadly I’ll rarely consider freestyle as an option now (what to do with the cups I’ve amassed from the different parks, I’m not sure).

That’s another bugbear of mine, how you have to buy a cup for each of the merlin parks rather than having one singular merlin cup that can be used across all merlin attractions. It just seems like a needless waste of plastic to make a quick £.
 
The money they make on these Freestyle machines is astronomical. Even considering maintenance, cleaning, electricity, gas, and syrup, it's a few pence per serving to produce. They don't even have to make it, bottle it, and transport it en masse like they do for shop bought stuff. Any Burger King or Pub Manager will tell you selling soft drinks on tap is where the money is at. They'll be absolutely raking it in through these machines.
 
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