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Crime and Punishment

Oh you know, the usual.

Holding for terrorist organisations and drug cartels, making huge profits off the suffering of millions and funding evil.

Not to mention getting away with it completely.
 
Blaze said:
Oh you know, the usual.

Holding for terrorist organisations and drug cartels, making huge profits off the suffering of millions and funding evil.

Not to mention getting away with it completely.
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If you were in a place to make a decision, what punishment would you hand down to HSBC (be realistic :) )
 
The sort of money they made from this is so vast it's hard to think of a way to get them to repay it. Nothing less than putting them in a disgusting cell and given as hash a treatment as we lawfully can until the day they die.

If a working class person did just a fraction of what these people do, do you think they'd get away with it? No. They'd be lucky to ever see daylight again. There's one law for us and one law for the elites.
 
Blaze said:
The sort of money they made from this is so vast it's hard to think of a way to get them to repay it. Nothing less than putting them in a disgusting cell and given as hash a treatment as we lawfully can until the day they die.

If a working class person did just a fraction of what these people do, do you think they'd get away with it? No. They'd be lucky to ever see daylight again. There's one law for us and one law for the elites.
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Exactly, I had an answer prepared but now I need not use it :D
 
Blaze said:
Oh you know, the usual.

Holding for terrorist organisations and drug cartels, making huge profits off the suffering of millions and funding evil.

Not to mention getting away with it completely.
Click to expand...

Nice, being busy this week must of missed that bit of news but if that's the case then the ideal punishment would be to send them to live with the despots that they have been funding.
 
I'm a bit late to the party, and the debate has sort of moved on from the OP, but that's not going to stop me wasting time that could be spent revising A Levels on a long post about my views on Crime & Punishment.

I do believe that criminals deserve punishment for their crimes. If it's nothing serious like stealing a £1 drink or a 16 year old trying to buy alcohol, I think no action should be taken first time. Second time round, it should be a small punishment, and so on...

For major crimes such as murder, rape etc. then I think Norway's system is spot on. They focus entirely on the rehabilitation of the criminals and turning them back into capable members of civilized society. Their prisoners get much better conditions than in UK/US jails and one could argue they get too many luxuries, but put it this way. Who is more likely to re commit a crime? A institutionalised & deranged nervous wreck thrown out back on the streets, whose just spent years in a stinking hell hole, or an educated Norwegian prisoner who spent their time in an environment not too dissimilar to the real world, learning skills, receiving lessons about humanity and getting exercise and free time? Exactly. ;)

Norway has a low recidivism rate because of this system so in my opinion it's the logical way of dealing with convicts. I'm not saying so because I'm a caring person in regards to the criminal's right, but because it's better for society as a whole, and the criminals can be introduced back to society much more easy and effectively than the UK prison system. :)
 
A rather excellent blogger, inspector gardget, provides a good insight into how policing works, or more often doesn't, in the UK today. Well worth a read if you are interested in such things. http://inspectorgadget.wordpress.com/

This is his most recent entry which covers exactly what is happening to me and my force at the moment, which I can't go into in any detail, but is concerning to say the least. As of tomorrow my role title has changed, along with most of my remit, meaning it much less likely I'll be (or in fact any one will be) out on the beat. Oh dear.

To report a crime, wait in (the post office) line.

January 9, 2013 by inspectorgadget

If you asked police officers in the Metropolitan Police whether they would base local officers in Supermarkets and Post Offices for operational reasons; they would probably say ‘no’.

If you asked the Met if they wanted to close their specialist teams and send everyone back to local uniformed policing roles to make crime fighting more effective, they would probably reject the idea.

We, along with most of the County forces have tried this and it doesn't work. The new so-called ‘local police officers’ simply spend their whole time case-file-building on the phone, prisoner handling in custody or running about trying to get their hands on CCTV, statements and forensic exhibits. They never actually get out on patrol.

If you asked County police officers if they thought it was a good idea to run the new ‘response hubs’ from miles away, with less emergency response staff and vehicles, they would say ‘no’.

But all these things have, or are about to be done.

They are happening because of huge budget cuts. It is time that senior police officers stopped trying to sell this nonsense as some kind of ‘new and effective way to police communities’. They are doing it because the government has taken away their money.

Let’s have some of the honesty & integrity which senior officers are always hectoring us about please.

Crime is bound to fall even further when future cuts to police call-centres are announced. No victim of crime wants to wait in a post office queue with the local busybodies listening while they tell the old bill what has happened to them. In some areas of London, being seen and overheard talking to the ‘Five Oh’ at a supermarket desk could be fatal.

Have we really reached the stage in this country where if you have had your head kicked in and your wallet stolen, and you can’t get through on the phone, you have to wait behind someone buying stamps before you get to relay your story? I detect the insanity of Blair Gibbs behind al of this.

When your local police station is closed due to lack of funds, you might comfort yourself in the knowledge that Pakistan with its nuclear missiles is set to receive the most aid from Britain by 2015; £446m. Ethiopia with all those armed militias is expected to get the next highest amount, £390m, then our old friends Nigeria, being the richest country on the continent, at £305m, India with her space programme and nuclear bombs receive £264m and finally Afghanistan at £178m, not including the blood & treasure we are losing in defending them from themselves.

No one came to power promising to cut 15,000 police jobs, close front counters and abolish specialist police teams while maintaining £446m aid payments to a country which can afford to run a nuclear arsenal. Think about it.
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I am getting a little tired of mis-management being blamed on budget cuts all of the time now.

This is poor management, if they can't run a police force on the budget they are given they want sacking without fat pensions.
 
Indeed. Or I'd say more to the point, if they can't be honest about what is happening and why then they should go. It's all too politicised, you can't do the same with less money but no one has the balls to say so. So be honest and tell the public, and the police themselves, what to expect. Because right now no one knows.
 
I was with that article right up until it started getting racist and anti-foreign aid. Cause it's the starving children of India's fault that Britain has an ideological far-right anti-spending government who cut public services while reducing taxes for the very richest. Greedy little foregin poor people.

That's not even mentioning the international politics of western countries funding evil governments in those countries so that they maintain cheap price for labour amongst other global plutocratic interests.
 
I agree MeatPie, I don't think that was the best example of huge waste within government and the tax system to go for, even if I do think that some of our aid may be well misplaced.

Although to call it racist is stupid, pulling out that argument every time someone mentions sensitive foreign subjects is what stops meaningful discussion. It makes people scared to challenge and you know it, so don't abuse it. To challenge something you don't think is right even if it involves foreigners is not racist in the slightest.
 
Meat Pie said:
I was with that article right up until it started getting racist and anti-foreign aid. Cause it's the starving children of India's fault that Britain has an ideological far-right anti-spending government who cut public services while reducing taxes for the very richest. Greedy little foregin poor people.

That's not even mentioning the international politics of western countries funding evil governments in those countries so that they maintain cheap price for labour amongst other global plutocratic interests.
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Without getting into the argument on foreign aid, I dont think there is a racist comment in there, anti foreign aid comments yes but racist?
Also I wouldnt say this govenment is far right, just completly incompetent.
 
I just have the nerve to call out cloaked racism for what it is. People who are happy to see spending in this country but begrudge giving vital aid to those out of view in far-away foreign lands is at the very least cowardice and xenophobic but also generally racist in it's origin.
 
Yes, you have all the nerve with your blanked out face and anonymous internet name. ::)

It is not racist, you are wrong. Just because you can't see you are wrong does not make you right. Get over yourself. How about discussing some crime and punishment instead, eh?
 
Pluk - Oh sorry have we not been introduced? My name is Thom Pizzey, I am 19 and I live in Kent. I stand by what I say with full commitment and you will see me at all kinds of protests and being an activist for the Green Party. I am no coward and am always transparent about my views, who I am and why I think them. I resent the acccusation that I'd do or be anything other than that.

It is racist, you are wrong. Just because you can't see you are wrong does not make you right. :)

And I agree let's move from this topic to something more relevant. I've had my say on what was a very dodgy article and you've had yours, now we can move on.
 
You can not just decide what words mean, they have a meaning that needs to be stuck to or nothing makes sense.

racist
a person with a prejudiced belief that one race is superior to others.
wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn
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Or if you prefer

rac·ism
/ˈrāˌsizəm/
Noun
The belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, esp. so as to distinguish it as...
Prejudice or discrimination directed against someone of a different race based on such a belief.
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Show me anything in that article that fits those definitions.

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We can move on, but I doubt it will because as per usual when any even slightly emotive topic comes up you jump in with your extreme views and stifle any possible discussion with diversions to your own agenda, worded to belittle anyone with opposing views. Who is going to agree with that article now it is wrongly labelled as the words of a racist? Lets not bother.
 
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