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Merlin 2015?

It's hard to get excited about a retheme of an area of Chessington Zoo!

If rumours are to be believed and Alton Towers only gets a CBeebies addition next year, then it's two years in a row without a thrill (or even family thrill) addition to the park, which would be worse than 2011.

2015 is looking a bit grim for theme parks :(
 
Indeed, 2015 is not looking like a good year for the UK theme park industry. It's not very often that no park gets a major addition. A pity but a telling sign of how our industry is right now.

:)
 
The biggest addition to a UK park in 2015 looks set to be Drayton Manor's Thomas Land expansion, which is bigger than first thought. Apart from the ray of hope that is The Smiler, we're in the worst period for UK theme parks for a long, long time.
 
TheMan said:
Don't give me that rubbish about the holiday village, that's a money making pure revenue generating investment. Yes it does look good, but let's not mistake that for an attraction. Resort capital high return investment is what that is.
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It's not 'rubbish'. The village at Alton Towers is a pure revenue generating investment, but what do you think the rest of Alton's large scale investments have been? I'm not saying Merlin don't make the odd shoddy choice, but do you think The Smiler or Cbebeebies land were somehow charitable?
 
Plastic Person said:
It's not 'rubbish'. The village at Alton Towers is a pure revenue generating investment, but what do you think the rest of Alton's large scale investments have been? I'm not saying Merlin don't make the odd shoddy choice, but do you think The Smiler or Cbebeebies land were somehow charitable?
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Yes, of course I do o_O

Enjoy riding around on the roofs of the log cabins.

Seriously. I refuse to accept those as being in the same pot as attractions. I like the concept and idea, but this will be a goldmine for Merlin, let's not pretend it isn't.

I want to see the resort hit a high standard, the lodges are cute, the treehouses really looking forward to seeing - however, it is infrastructure/attractions on park which I am interested in.

:D
 
I think in that case, then perhaps what you personally want from Alton differs from the resort's overall vision. I'm not denying that infrastructure on park needs improving, but accommodation options are now seen as equally vital to development, and given what a huge success they have proven to be over nearly two decades, reasonably so.
 
So, what I want from Alton Towers, which is rides and attractions primarily, with back up additions added on top not instead of because of their revenue generating potential, is not acceptable?
 
All rides and attractions added at Alton Towers are done so to generate revenue, by virtue of bringing repeat visitors in (The Smiler), or establishing a new audience, as has been the case with CBeebies. The park exists in a market with huge money to be made in short-stay visits, a market that they arguably pioneered in the UK. For comparison's sake, here's a comparison between what the park has added recently, and under the much more optimistic reign of Tussauds in 1996:

90s:

1994: Nemesis
1995: Energizer (replacing 1001 Nights) and Old Mcdonald's Farm
1996: Alton Towers Hotel and Squirrel Nutty
1997: Ripsaw (replacing Thunder Looper)

2010s:
2012: Ice Age 4D and Nemesis: Sub-Terra
2013: The Smiler (replacing Black Hole)
2014: Cbeebies Land (replacing Old McDonal's Farm)
2015: Lodges

Sorry to be so dry, but the notion the park are under-investing, or out to make a cheaper buck than before is in my view, false.
 
Plastic Person said:
Sorry to be so dry, but the notion the park are under-investing, or out to make a cheaper buck than before is in my view, false.
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We aren't going to agree on this. I am not saying they shouldn't invest in lodges, it's a sound business model to invest further and they will be generating revenue for a good while. IF they do it right, the area will be a great addition to the resort.

What I am saying is, as Merlin, 2nd biggest blah blah blah, I would expect to see bigger investments in an attraction in at least a couple of their parks. I don't count adding wooden houses as an attraction, I class it as adding another PURE revenue stream.
 
Everything that every profit-making business in the world invests in is a "money making pure revenue generating investment". All the rides and attractions, all the theming, all the shops, all the park music. That's what a business does. This is a slightly baffling conversation.
 
TheMan - That's suggesting that there's nothing to be added on park. We don't have confirmation that there isn't going to be anything next year. Rumours there will be. If we have something Squirrel Nutty style (so.. small) to go with the lodges then they're essentially getting the same investment as the old tussauds years got.
 
I'd like to see a cost comparison of building a full scale, well themed hotel, and creating the associated initial infrastructure, with some pre-fab wooden lodges.

No seriously.

I am also not the only one that has mentioned about the lack of investment in British parks next year. The big thing that is wrong with this country is a resignation for second or third best, something I cannot abide.

Invest properly, bring quality infrastructure, new attractions, and tidy up what's gone wrong.

Or do I need to you point you all in the direction of the 55,000 people Europa Park thread where you can disagree in there instead...

Any reason at all Towers shouldn't be as good? No.

Carry on accepting sub standard, personally, I would like better for Alton Towers and I make NO apology or concession on that.
 
Don't really understand the arguments in here.

As far as things go in Alton Towers timeline, 2015 should see a similar amount of investment we have seen in 1996 and 2003.

1996
  • Alton Towers Hotel
  • Storybook Land
  • Squirrel Nutty

2003
  • Splash Landings
  • Cariba Creek
  • Ribena Berry Bish Bash
  • Haunted House rethemed to Duel

2015
  • Enchanted Village
  • CBeebies Land Roller coaster (rumoured)

For Alton Towers the investment in 2015 is pretty much in line with the previous hotel addition years. Of course they are "money making pure revenue generating investments", that's what every single thing has and always will be at Towers or any other business in the world. I think we're getting all this mixed up with the execution of additions, rather than the price tag.

If this CBeebies Land coaster is true then Alton Towers is getting pretty decent investments next season.
 
I don't have any issues with the investments at Alton Towers for 2015.

I do trust that the 2016 investments will be large.

:)
 
I don't see the problem with the CBeebees potential coaster - it may not be a family thrill ride, but it's something that Towers has desperately needed since The Beastie was scrapped. We've also known for a while that CBeebees would have a second phase in 2015, so this shouldn't be a disappointment. Couple in the rather huge investment of the cabins, and I wouldn't call it a weak year for Towers at all.

Truthfully, I'm concerned with Thorpe and Chessie. As much as I love the sound of a major dark ride for 2016, it's concerning that this may be the third year in a row of minimal investment for Thorpe. I also have no idea what Chessie will offer, apart from work on the zoo and the theming for Dragon Falls, it's likely they will have another quiet year too.

I'll say this: if 2016 is going to be big (and all three parks look set to have funding for big plans by then anyway), then I'm happy with a quiet 2015.
 
On the one hand, the Enchanted Village is a big investment. On the other, resort investment should arguably be kept totally separate from theme park investment and thus we should see things on both sides.

If all we see next year at Towers is a CBeebies coaster I won't be concerned. Ideally I would like to see some kind of thrill or family thrill addition like a flat too but it's not essential.

What is most interesting is that it points to 2016 being a huge year for Thorpe, Alton and hell maybe even Chessie. Which would be odd considering the staggered investments in the past.
 
Also 2013 was big investment in the Smiler, 2014 big investment in CBeebies, why is it a problem if 2015 brings smaller investment.

Does seem odd if all three parks are going to get big investment in 2016. Although currently we don't know what AT and CWoA have planned, only that Thorpe are getting a dark ride.

Hopefully Chessington will continue to see big refurbishments next year and then they will get a proper investment in 2016, currently they still have the most potential I think. Alton Towers doesn't need to develop much more it has a pretty good selection of family, kids and thrill rides (although Duel needs a refresh). Once Thorpe gets a dark ride then it is getting more sorted too.
 
I agree, I think Alton's balance of rides is by far the best of any park in the UK, PBB maybe excepted (although the hardware itself isn't as strong, unfortunately) A beginner's kids coaster is something they're sorely lacking, though, so here's hoping we see one next year, and with decent capacity too.
 
TheMan said:
I'd like to see a cost comparison of building a full scale, well themed hotel, and creating the associated initial infrastructure, with some pre-fab wooden lodges.

No seriously.

I am also not the only one that has mentioned about the lack of investment in British parks next year. The big thing that is wrong with this country is a resignation for second or third best, something I cannot abide.

Invest properly, bring quality infrastructure, new attractions, and tidy up what's gone wrong.

Or do I need to you point you all in the direction of the 55,000 people Europa Park thread where you can disagree in there instead...

Any reason at all Towers shouldn't be as good? No.

Carry on accepting sub standard, personally, I would like better for Alton Towers and I make NO apology or concession on that.
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I agree.

If Alton Towers had continued to build in the way it did through the 80s and 90s we should have a park that is at least on par with Europa Park quality wise by now.

Instead we have had over a decade of stagnation and arguably decline as a result of short-sighted investment, poor management and penny pinching. There is simply no desire to make Alton Towers into a truly escapist destination which places equal importance on immersive themed experiences and a good range of entertainment just as much as new rides.

Also why do people feel the need to create lists of rides added in previous decades to compare to the number added recently? On paper, the 90s saw only a modest selection of new attractions added to the park but that doesn't take into account all of the themed areas that were more or less created from scratch during the decade in a desire to create a well rounded theme park.

Alton Towers need to get out of the mentality of "what can we do for the next big ride?" and start thinking "how can we turn ourselves into a world class destination?"or they will never get the growth and long-term profits they want.

:)
 
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