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Park Hours: Updates and Discussion

Lneeno said:
It’s not really worth visiting on Saturdays with a 5pm close unless you get there bang on opening, It feels like a real rush to get everything done.
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I was on park today and it was a pretty poor do. I was through the gates by 10:15 am and there till close and had to miss out on 13 and Rita. Pretty much impossible to fit in all the rides in without paying for fast-track today.
 
Should be 6pm minimum every weekend, it’s not like they’re struggling for numbers, I haven’t visited on a Saturday for a while now.
 
I think what's most frustrating about this situation is that there's clearly money to be made in that final hour, right? Just demonstrates the absurdity of the budgets the park are having to work with. I can swallow a 4PM midweek close if it's dead, although, Alton is basically just too big of a park to truly justify that. But closing at 5PM on a weekend in which you're relatively slammed? Absolutely nonsensical stuff.
 
Plastic Person said:
I think what's most frustrating about this situation is that there's clearly money to be made in that final hour, right?
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There's revenue to be had, but some days it will not offset the increased costs associated with staff, utilities, wear and tear etc that are incurred for every operating hour.

I think the decision to reduce the operating hours is based on a number of factors:
  • It doesn't affect your lunch spend
  • People buy merch in the final hour, or just after irrespective of where it is
  • People's spending largely conforms to the hours they have available - last night I needed milk and the local shop shuts at 11 so I went at half 10, if it closed at 10 I'd have gone and picked it up earlier.
Those are assumptions on my part, but the people making the decision have access to the numbers.

Same with operating days, if you close Monday and Tuesday, most people will come on Wednesday. There will be some that don't, but a tiny proportion.

That said, there are sometimes situations whereby you need to demonstrate a low cost base regardless, to offset risk and the like.
 
I don't think today's opening hours needed to be any longer, It's mostly Saturdays when opening longer would benefit Alton Towers.
 
If Alton really want to get the numbers in to justify the additional opening (plus money off the extra guests), they need to offer a little bit more, something more to keep me there or stay over night that I'll spend two days in the park. Secondly vastly improve how people can get there by other modes of transport other than car because from what I gather it's a complete nightmare and has been for a while.

It's a catch 22 though, if the park was open until 7/8 I'd be more inclined to drive to the park later and enjoy it into the evening and very potentially, stay over and make a second day of it but there needs to be a little something extra in the park for me to do that. I do however think they're nearly there in delivering this. They need to look at additional entertainment like live entertainment in the evening as part of a package or something, something to keep people there and get them there in the first place.
 
Problem with extending is they it seems to depend what manager is on that day and if they want to extend or not.

I’ve had days when it’s not felt too busy but ride close has been extended, yet other days (such as the other Saturday a what ever manager was in that day needs to get himself out the office and look how busy the park was that day) they haven’t extended.

They often only seem to extend when they have issues on park, such as big queues to get in or broke rides, not actually if the park is really busy.
 
Am I oversimplifying things or is it not just a matter of extending park close to a set time once visitor numbers exceed a certain amount? That figure is surely registered by the turnstiles.

Maybe an adjustment if there are school groups, which they’ll know about, because they’ll be pre booked anyway. Add a bit more time if there’s a power cut.

Surely this stuff is in the instruction manual...
 
venny said:
Am I oversimplifying things or is it not just a matter of extending park close to a set time once visitor numbers exceed a certain amount? That figure is surely registered by the turnstiles.

Maybe an adjustment if there are school groups, which they’ll know about, because they’ll be pre booked anyway. Add a bit more time if there’s a power cut.

Surely this stuff is in the instruction manual...
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To continue to be open you need to have the staff to do so. Whilst I presume that Alton towers do expect a certain amount of flexibility this isn't always possible. Under 18s in particular have strict rules about how long they can work, and when they need their breaks. Adding an hour or two onto their shift won't always be possible.

I imagine securing staffing, and staffing costs are the most difficult part of the decision to extend.

Also another difficult decision for the park will be profitability. The park might only be profitable if they have the right type guests in the park (family's without season passes would be my assumption of the most profitable demographic). If towers are just making a profit with a 4pm close, extending to 5 could make the day a loss maker. I go to the park and spend very little (2 or 3 drinks refills at 75p a pop), I'm sure there are many pass holders who are the same. So if there is an influx of season pass holders, perhaps it's still not profitable to open longer. So it might not purely about people in the park, more about how much profit they are turning.

Everything written above is purely my assumptions. I've no idea how the park really run and what factors they use to decide. But I'd imagine "do we have enough staff to keep it running?" And "will we be making a profit or a loss?" Are two extremely important factors to remaining open.
 
What I hear there is.... Season passes are too cheap.

It would be interesting to know how many times the average season pass holder uses that. I bet it is around 4x a year (£14 per visit) and that in park spending falls each time, after the repeat visitors understand the food and beverage options are often poor value.

The financial scenario you describe has been created by Merlins overall approach on cutting the offering, and undervaluing the entrance pricing.
Compare that to the big international parks, where they desperately want you to stay there spending on meals and merchandise, and so invest in the offering.
 
have visited 4 times with my season pass so far this year. I pay to park, I buy food and drinks. The mark up on food and drinks is vast and probably does cover the loss of gate ticket monies, particularly when most people use BOGOFs anyway
 
Lurker said:
To continue to be open you need to have the staff to do so. Whilst I presume that Alton towers do expect a certain amount of flexibility this isn't always possible. Under 18s in particular have strict rules about how long they can work, and when they need their breaks. Adding an hour or two onto their shift won't always be possible.
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Working on the rides at Towers is generally 2hrs on, followed by a 30min break. This way exceeds any statutory break requirements.

One of the big deciders on extending park opening is the staff transport. The provider has to be notified by a set time if the park wants to extend hours & thus the times of the staff transport.
 
Just thinking but its not also just about staff working the extra hours and getting home, its about paying them! I wonder if Towers can tell in real time what their income is for the day from ticket sales, food and drink sales through digital checkouts, and so on. Then they may be able to look at how much money has been taken for the day, against how many staff are working and what the wage bill will be for the extra hour or two, and if it exceeds a certain ratio then they keep it open another hour.

Who knows, but no doubt finances must come into the equation as to whether or not to keep the park open longer. Its one of the only reasons I can think of why they didnt the second weekend in September when it was so busy, given they did the one before and after. Maybe everyone that weekend chose to take a packed lunch, and didnt spend any money in the park!
 
So I thought that given the season is nearly over, I'd look at how the average day for each month compares.

To do this I took the posted opening times from the AT app, and stuck them in a spreadsheet. I appreciate there are probably better ways to do this (using ride times, so it includes small extensions) but I wanted a lazy average.

Just incase anyone is interested.

aC7BxD9_d.jpg


Please be aware that 6.5 represents 6 hours and 30 minutes and so forth, again, lazy to convert into actual time.
 
Lurker said:
So I thought that given the season is nearly over, I'd look at how the average day for each month compares.

To do this I took the posted opening times from the AT app, and stuck them in a spreadsheet. I appreciate there are probably better ways to do this (using ride times, so it includes small extensions) but I wanted a lazy average.

Just incase anyone is interested.

aC7BxD9_d.jpg


Please be aware that 6.5 represents 6 hours and 30 minutes and so forth, again, lazy to convert into actual time.
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The park is open 6 days in november
 
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