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TBC: SW9 Speculation

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I think they will look to put a coaster in the area as its the quietest part of the park and it'll be some worlds first

"The worlds first vertical drop start coaster" where the vertical drop is at the beginning of the ride.

They will call it something like "abyss" and the tag line will be Fall into the Abyss

there will be a light theme to do with the dungeons


Where as they should just close the area and give it a proper re-theme and loosen the purse strings a tad
 
Tibble said:
I think they will look to put a coaster in the area as its the quietest part of the park and it'll be some worlds first

"The worlds first vertical drop start coaster" where the vertical drop is at the beginning of the ride.

They will call it something like "abyss" and the tag line will be Fall into the Abyss

there will be a light theme to do with the dungeons


Where as they should just close the area and give it a proper re-theme and loosen the purse strings a tad
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Time Traveller took that record already. :p;)
 
What I wouldn't give for a hint of what SW9 might be or even a close to official nod, that it has entered the early planning stages.

I just hope that we are not being too optimistic. With Merlin's stated reduction in RTP's Capex budgets, I fear that SW9 may not happen within the timescales to which we have become accustomed. :(
 
2 things are for sure.

1. The next SW will not be built in the location of CCL. The issues around noise complaints and the swift demise of Coaster Corner in the early 90's are well documented and have been discussed on here many times.

2. The next SW will not be a b+m. This is a park that can't keep food outlets open, closes the gates at 4pm on a regular basis and has had to scrape around for change down the back of the sofa to buy a Gerst and the smallest GCI possible as it's last 2 SW projects.
 
Matt.GC said:
2. The next SW will not be a b+m. This is a park that can't keep food outlets open, closes the gates at 4pm on a regular basis and has had to scrape around for change down the back of the sofa to buy a Gerst and the smallest GCI possible as it's last 2 SW projects.
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To be fair, The Smiler is a nearly 4,000ft long, 14 inversion custom Gerstlauer that required a fair bit of groundwork to get into the Black Hole's former site; it's not like it's a Rage-style stock Euro-Fighter. It might not be a B&M, but I'd imagine that the hardware still cost a fair amount. The ride budget was £18m!

With regards to Wicker Man, a lot of money was spent on the theming (out of the £16m budget, I'd almost imagine that the theming cost more than the ride) and the ride itself is fairly thrilling and not that short, in my opinion. In terms of "bigness", I'd certainly say that there are GCIs that look "smaller" than Wicker Man; rides like InvadR and the White Lightning clones certainly do, in my opinion!

If Alton Towers can invest nearly £20m into rides like The Smiler and Wicker Man, they can certainly afford a B&M.
 
Matt N said:
With regards to Wicker Man, a lot of money was spent on the theming (out of the £16m budget, I'd almost imagine that the theming cost more than the ride)
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I mean no offence but this is a complete delusion

Also, you can never use the advertised budgets. Project budgets are complex and it matters where the value has gone for each aspect of the project, not necessarily the higher the price-tag the better. The advertised budgets are just used for promo and take into account all sorts like marketing and overheads etc.
 
The Smiler and WIckerman are as great as they are. Personally, I'd love an out and back coaster at Alton, but planning would never allow it.

A B and M is a quality investment that should provide smooth, trouble free running for decades with an unrivalled safety record. The quality of the engineering is off the scale. There is some short termism at Merlin, however.

Still want a massive log flume more than anything. Still want to know what John Wardleys world first water ride that he mentioned a a Towersstreet event a few years ago Was all about. That guy doesn't do humdrum.

We may get a B and M prototype when they create their next new style coaster, but much bigger models will follow soon after

Personally, I think it will be a long time before we get an out and out thrill ride. Merlin want each pound that they spend to attract the biggest demographic and that is family thrill.
 
I don't think Matt was saying that Wickerman or Smiler were necessarily bad, but they were cheaper hardware by far. A B&M is off the cards but I'd even argue it's unnecessary.

I think Wickerman proved you could get a lot of solid fun and a good coaster out of simpler hardware, if you do it right. And they could have done Wicker Man much better still had it been less hurredly planned.
 
TakeYourMedicine said:
I don't think Matt was saying that Wickerman or Smiler were necessarily bad, but they were cheaper hardware by far. A B&M is off the cards but I'd even argue it's unnecessary.
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You're absolutely right.... and that's exactly why Merlin won't buy another one. They'll happily blow millions on DBGT but I'd donate my testicles if they ever buy another B&M.
 
I don't understand the suggestion that they won't build another B&M based on cost when they have put them in smaller RTP divisions. In fact, the six most recent steel thrill coasters in RTP have been B&Ms, bar Smiler, haven't they?

Agree with @TakeYourMedicine in terms of being able to build smaller rides and succeed in creating a great overall experience - that's what Disney has been doing since Matterhorn.
 
The 3 B&Ms opened at a time when they were the top option for parks around the world in terms of new coasters. Really the only other options were Arrow, Vekoma and in the case of SW1 and SW2, Schwarzkopf. Back then you totally got why Towers would go for a company who just built a world class coaster on their soil for SW4 and it was the same with SW5 too. However times have changed, nowadays for steel coasters you also have Intamin and Mack who can deliver top tier rides too. B&M meanwhile have stagnated a bit, because honestly a lot of their current coaster models don't really fit Towers' agenda at the moment:

Stand Up - One hasn't been built for 20 years so no lmao

Sit Down/Floorless - Would have fitted Towers nicely, but Smiler does the job of being a looping coaster at the park (mile may vary...)

Hyper/Giga - Would actually be a good fit, but unless they want to dig a lot it ain't happening

Wing - In its current state it just wouldn't have a huge "wow" factor like Oblivion and Air did.

There's also the family inverted but obviously that's not a huge investment, I do agree that a B&M for SW9 is not a necessity. Intamin and Mack in particular can offer just as good of stuff, but a lot lower. It's obviously a pipedream but if SW9 was a new launch to replace Rita, a Mack or a Blitz would provide a better investment than what B&M could do. Even Vekoma have been great lately so they could rock up something really soon as well.

However I do think Towers could do with a break from thrill coasters. It needs some large family attractions, especially a log flume type ride of course...
 
Rick said:
I don't understand the suggestion that they won't build another B&M based on cost when they have put them in smaller RTP divisions. In fact, the six most recent steel thrill coasters in RTP have been B&Ms, bar Smiler, haven't they?
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But times have changed have they not? And you also have to bear in mind that a lot of money spent on a coaster at Towers goes on landscaping such as blasting the Nemesis pit or digging the Oblivion hole. Even without strict height restrictions, The Swarm, a relatively recent Merlin B&M addition is over quicker than a 16 year old lad loosing his virginity.

Even if we pretend for one minute that Merlin are prepared to fork out £20m for a new coaster at Towers (which they won't), without an incredibly unique Oblivion style USP, they'd struggle to fork out much beyond the installation of a B&M lift hill.
 
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As I’ve said earlier in this topic - B&M are designing a surf coaster - we know merlin like worlds firsts and have a history of prototypes at AT..... just saying

Nobody really knows what this is yet.... but put Wardley rumoured world first water ride mixed with AT history and now a need for a water ride, I think we may have some answers

Of course without seeing images this may not be a water ride. But just be the sheer name surf coaster it points to riding in a surfing position which points to water coaster...

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp....k8vx/new_product_coming_from_bm_surf_coaster/
 
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Jb85 said:
As I’ve said earlier in this topic - B&M are designing a surf coaster - we know merlin like worlds firsts and have a history of prototypes at AT..... just saying

Nobody really knows what this is yet.... but put Wardley rumoured world first water ride mixed with AT history and now a need for a water ride, I think we may have some answers

Of course without seeing images this may not be a water ride. But just be the sheer name surf coaster it points to riding in a surfing position which points to water coaster...

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp....k8vx/new_product_coming_from_bm_surf_coaster/
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Great detective work. It likely adds up to nothing, but if this is the first manifestation of John Wardleys mysterious water ride in association with B and M, then it could be the most exciting news to me since NEMMIE.

A lot of maybes though!
 
Based on the Merlin's recent B&M additions I'd rather they choose someone else for the next AT coaster. None of them have been that great really (full disclosure - I'm yet to do Oblivion:TBH).

I don't think Towers really need a new coaster in the next few years though, they have more now than at any time in the park's history but there are very few decent support rides (I only really do Duel and Hex these days, and of those the former is mainly out of habit and the fact it never has a queue).

If it wasn't for the fact that Merlin's recent track record in terms of non-coaster additions to their parks is so appalling, I'd be pushing for more indoor rides or family-thrill rides. Maybe they should look to the legoland division for some ideas - rides like Ninjago, Atlantis and the lego movie world at LLF show that there's no reason why Merlin can't pull off a major ride that's not a coaster. Just as long as it's not completely half-hearted like Sub Terra
 
I agee with John, it would not be sensible for the next major investment at Towers to be a coaster. It is not needed at this moment in time and the park is in desperate need of rides to support the existing coasters.

I would like to see significant investment in water rides. The Rapids need money spending on them to bring them back up to standard and a Flume replacement is badly needed. So some sort of log flume style ride with plenty of theming would make for a welcome addition.
 
Agree with the last two posts....two decent £10m investments over a £20m coaster are what is needed right now.

However I think Merlins marketing brains will push for a coaster all day long, especially after the failure the is DBGT
 
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