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The World of David Walliams: General Discussion

AstroDan said:
Let's hope £10m+ ride investments get back in town sooner rather than later, Alton can't afford this hand-me-down approach for much longer.
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And hopefully not just £10m rides but also the cash to develop the area around the ride as well.
A quality retheme of a whole area with no new rides (Ug Land) is possibly better than shoe-horning a new ride in without decent supporting work.
 
AstroDan said:
RANT ALERT.

Top job Towers? Are you having a laugh?

Please step back a little from the 'chamber of hype & delight' and assess this project properly. It may well be a perfectly palatable ride alone for young families. But compare this with the dark rides that Alton Towers have installed in the past! Around the World in Eighty Days / Toyland Tours, Haunted House. Hex... even the quality of Sharkbait Reef!

This is a cheap-end attraction with nowhere near the budgets of the rides that have gone before, in an area that has, quite literally, got rotting buildings that have been re-painted and painted again into different themes over 30 years because the park has a complete aversion to actual construction. Behind the paint-job, the interior of the theatre is still Ice Age themed. The driving school is right there and totally unlinked!? God forbid a budget to do things properly. The start of Walliams' segment on Midlands Today and he's stood in front of those ancient Cred Street facades. My god... it's like the Oktoberfest Stella goblets all over again. This area is incomplete. It doesn't even have a proper food outlet. Even Cloud Cuckoo Land boasted that! The poor planning and delivery in a brand new area resulting in a hired in ride to top it up - before it's even opened? What the hell! CCL even 'boasted' a live show at one stage even! Nick Varney continues to allow these resorts to scratch about for pennies down the back of the sofa and it's an embarrassing state of play when you have Paultons doing what they're doing.

All this said, as a small, minor dark ride, the ride itself will be adequate, even if it fell off the back of a lorry and was designed for a waxworks... I am sure, but the rest? Please. It's anything but rocket science and high-end investment. And that queue line - well. God knows how long it will be with a capacity under 400/hour. What are the park thinking?

Alton added Th13teen and couldn't properly afford to do anything with the area.
Alton added Gangsta Granny and couldn't properly afford to do anything with the area.

Recurring theme.

Let's hope £10m+ ride investments get back in town sooner rather than later, Alton can't afford this hand-me-down approach for much longer.

That was nice, though. Been a while since a good old ATR rant.
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First off, I sincerely apologise if I’ve offended you in any way. I never intend to offend anyone with my opinions on here, but I seem to have made you pretty angry, so for that, I apologise profusely.

The reason I applaud Towers on this job is because for what it is, I think they have done a great job. As much as it might be easy to compare it to some of Alton’s past investments, this ultimately isn’t intended to be on the same scale. Some of the rides you mention were almost comparable to the SWs back in the day; the likes of Around the World in 80 Days and the Haunted House were almost certainly considered major investment years for the park at the time, whereas TWODW/Gangsta Granny is intended as more of a filler year.

Think of this project as more akin to something like Storybook Land in 1996; that was more of a filler year, with a small children’s ride as its main attraction, and the area wasn’t that huge. Didn’t it only have Squirrel Nutty and the ice show, or am I wrong on that? I know that Gangsta Granny is a dark ride as opposed to a pedal rail, but if anything Gangsta Granny on its own probably cost slightly more than Squirrel Nutty did back in the day, what with all the additional theming needed for it (what with it being an indoor dark ride). In that regard, the two projects are arguably quite similar to one another; both are rethemes of a smaller area of the park, both are intended for the younger guests, and both are intended to be low years to fill gaps in between the major, big-ticket years. The only glaring difference is that TWODW uses an IP, whereas Storybook Land was a home-grown idea. Wicker Man didn’t come all that long ago, so we’re probably not due another major year just yet.

I’m sure there will be another £10m+ investment before you know it; I personally reckon 2023/2024 is the sort of time to keep an eye on, and I’m sure that whatever the park and Merlin Magic Making cook up will be absolutely amazing!

So my point is; yes, Gangsta Granny may not be a major ride on the scale of some of the park’s past dark rides, but for what it ultimately is (a minor, filler dark ride), I think the park have done a pretty good job, personally! This is the type of ride that will function as more of a filler than a major attraction, and I think it’s quite well suited to that, personally, even if the capacity admittedly isn’t that high.

I hope this helps you understand my slightly controversial opinion, and I hope I’ve redeemed myself a little.
 
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Matt N said:
First off, I sincerely apologise if I’ve offended you in any way. I never intend to offend anyone with my opinions on here, but I seem to have made you pretty angry, so for that, I apologise profusely.

The reason I applaud Towers on this job is because for what it is, I think they have done a great job. As much as it might be easy to compare it to some of Alton’s past investments, this ultimately isn’t intended to be on the same scale. Some of the rides you mention were almost comparable to the SWs back in the day; the likes of Around the World in 80 Days and the Haunted House were almost certainly considered major investment years for the park at the time, whereas TWODW/Gangsta Granny is intended as more of a filler year.

Think of this project as more akin to something like Storybook Land in 1996; that was more of a filler year, with a small children’s ride as its main attraction, and the area wasn’t that huge. Didn’t it only have Squirrel Nutty and the ice show, or am I wrong on that? I know that Gangsta Granny is a dark ride as opposed to a pedal rail, but if anything Gangsta Granny on its own probably cost slightly more than Squirrel Nutty did back in the day, what with all the additional theming needed for it (what with it being an indoor dark ride). In that regard, the two projects are arguably quite similar to one another; both are rethemes of a smaller area of the park, both are intended for the younger guests, and both are intended to be low years to fill gaps in between the major, big-ticket years. The only glaring difference is that TWODW uses an IP, whereas Storybook Land was a home-grown idea. Wicker Man didn’t come all that long ago, so we’re probably not due another major year just yet.

I’m sure there will be another £10m+ investment before you know it; I personally reckon 2023/2024 is the sort of time to keep an eye on, and I’m sure that whatever the park and Merlin Magic Making cook up will be absolutely amazing!

So my point is; yes, Gangsta Granny may not be a major ride on the scale of some of the park’s past dark rides, but for what it ultimately is (a minor, filler dark ride), I think the park have done a pretty good job, personally! This is the type of ride that will function as more of a filler than a major attraction, and I think it’s quite well suited to that, personally, even if the capacity admittedly isn’t that high.

I hope this helps you understand my slightly controversial opinion, and I hope I’ve redeemed myself a little.
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Despite what some people like to suggest in the world disagreement does not cause offence and doesn’t need apologising for.

Regarding the ride, the theming in the attractions looks fine, the outside theme is ok. The ride is short, it’s got a low throughput yet has a relatively big IP attached to it.

I have no issue with big operators recycling attractions across parks and this ride clearly had as Dan mentions a Tussauds attraction as its original destination. If Towers had installed it as a minor IP free filler attraction with the quality of theming we can see here I think that would have been fine. But to add it as a major installation assigned to an IP and no support rides is just idiotic. It’s the shortsightedness of it all that is so depressing.
 
Dave said:
Despite what some people like to suggest in the world disagreement does not cause offence and doesn’t need apologising for.

Regarding the ride, the theming in the attractions looks fine, the outside theme is ok. The ride is short, it’s got a low throughput yet has a relatively big IP attached to it.

I have no issue with big operators recycling attractions across parks and this ride clearly had as Dan mentions a Tussauds attraction as its original destination. If Towers had installed it as a minor IP free filler attraction with the quality of theming we can see here I think that would have been fine. But to add it as a major installation assigned to an IP and no support rides is just idiotic. It’s the shortsightedness of it all that is so depressing.
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I agree, It wouldn't be so bad if the IP it's themed to was less popular! Instead, we've got a tiny little dark ride with a low throughput that's themed to an enormously popular children's IP that will amost certainly swamp it out on opening day with a 60 min+ queue...
 
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You didn't offend me, Matt. I just profusely disagreed with your assertion. Worry not.

RE: Gangsta Granny - the issue isn't with the ride itself. It's the overall area. I cannot tell you just how BAD the state of a lot of those buildings are. Alton keep repainting over old, rotten facades. They won't remove delapidated buildings - they'll just throw some paint at them and keep them clinging on for another couple of years. You could say they're thrifty, I guess. But where's the café? Where's the live show? Where's the integrated re-theme of all rides in the area? We're getting a massive marketing push for a ride that handles 1/4 what Duel can deal with? What the hell?

The ride is clearly not on the same scale as the Haunted House or Toyland Tours. But its job is the same - relative to its time. It's of course a much smaller ride, but the requirement of this to boost guest figures in the resort is exactly the same. The ATR of 2021 would NEVER in a million years add a ride to the construction level and scenic detail of the Haunted House or Toyland Tours.

Alton has not added a dark ride for this market in 15 years. Charlie's budget was several times greater than this, even. Was Charlie more major than this area in terms of what it's supposed to be doing? This area is getting significant marketing across TV, radio and online. It's got the UK's biggest children's author involved. It's hardly Snorri Touren.

Alton Towers are, in 2021, expected to do more - for less. This area is CHEAP. The resort have NO money to properly deliver these projects to a level we'd expect for a resort of the standing of ATR.
 
If you take GG in isolation, it's a new family dark ride at Towers. There's nothing not to like about that after the last 5 years we've been through. It looks like a long overdue family filler dark ride at the park and in that sense, it's fine.

It's IP is solid, some of the theming looks ok and I'm surprised that the outside of the building looks the best it has in years.

GG can't be anything but welcomed if viewed as a standalone addition as part of a wider project, although, like the fairground flats, the debate of how we got to this stage that anyone is applauding this has to be questioned in the long term

However, as a main attraction, it fails terribly. It won't be able to offer anywhere near reasonable capacity. It's being billed as the next best thing (and I'm sure it'll be perfectly decent) but is really little more than a tiny track tour of TV screens.

The area around it is indeed a repainted and rebranded old area, so insufficient and dilapidated that they needed to do what they did in other areas of the park and add a fairground flat to give it some more life. Like the ride itself, the area now has a strong IP but doesn't have the goods to back up the hype.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed David standing in front of the old CCL buildings, the same as before just painted in even brighter and more garish colours.

Both entrances to the area are also a total disaster. Enter from the Hex end and you have Cuckoo Cars, clashing with the new theme. Enter from the Skyride end and you're greeted with a beautiful looking tree and landscaped green area in front of a vomit coloured burger kitchen, clearly designed and built in the same style as the rest of the land. This is then broken up by a rediculous looking shorehorned in Dungeon entrance complete with black painted warehouse, cheap wicker fencing and travelling fun fair ghost train style plastic facade. Then you're greeted with a nicely designed theater facade that houses absolutely nothing, painted in bright primary colours.

GG will be fine on its own. But it really should have opened as part of a wider IP investment, even if it was over a couple of years, that included a retheme of the Burger Kitchen, a new Dark ride and façade for the Charlie Building, a new experience in the 4d cinema, a minor retheme of Driving School and maintenance/theme work on the CCL building façades.

Towers probably did do their best with a freebie ride and change jar given by Merlin, but I don't think that's the point. It would be like chucking a cheap, incoherently themed flat on the path between Kantanga Canyon and Gloomy Wood whilst renaming both areas, doing nothing else to them and calling it a day.

This current Walliams World looks like it's Towers version of that wild woods/Cheap Green Netting On The Side Of a Corrugated Building Land or whatever they call it these days, at Chessington.

Sent from my VOG-L29 using Tapatalk
 
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We've just got to hope the Dungeons is rethemed to fit in, Cuckoo Cars are rethemed to fit in, something goes in the theatre and they add a couple more family flats to the area - it might start to look a little bit more like a packaged area then.
 
Danscott22 said:
We've just got to hope the Dungeons is rethemed to fit in, Cuckoo Cars are rethemed to fit in, something goes in the theatre and they add a couple more family flats to the area - it might start to look a little bit more like a packaged area then.
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Only trouble is the headline attraction NEEDS to be the Dungeons replacement, and it's weird to have the area launch without a standout, high throughput ride. Especially when they're putting a lot of effort into marketing.
 
Dave said:
Despite what some people like to suggest in the world disagreement does not cause offence and doesn’t need apologising for.

Regarding the ride, the theming in the attractions looks fine, the outside theme is ok. The ride is short, it’s got a low throughput yet has a relatively big IP attached to it.

I have no issue with big operators recycling attractions across parks and this ride clearly had as Dan mentions a Tussauds attraction as its original destination. If Towers had installed it as a minor IP free filler attraction with the quality of theming we can see here I think that would have been fine. But to add it as a major installation assigned to an IP and no support rides is just idiotic. It’s the shortsightedness of it all that is so depressing.
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@Dave which Madam Tussauds was Gangster Granny The ride originally going to be located?
 
Was a Walliams retheme of Cloud Cuckoo Land always planned for the future, or did they quickly have to find a suitable theme when the ride system was dumped on them?
 
Alsty said:
Was a Walliams retheme of Cloud Cuckoo Land always planned for the future, or did they quickly have to find a suitable theme when the ride system was dumped on them?
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A David Walliams IP was rumoured for quite some time, even to the point of Walliams and Cowell mentioning it in an April 2018 interview. It was referred to as a bit of a joke, but I'd imagine talks had taken place considering rumours about it from elsewhere were also floating around way back then too.

Budgets likely put the idea to rest until the ride from NYC came up, resulting in the idea being revisited - just unfortunately without the money to support a full scale revamp of the area.

I have to say I wholly agree with Dan's comments about the area. When you attach such a well known IP to a new ride, the expectations for the ride and the demand for people who want to ride it instantly increase. IPs of this size and popularity simply aren't suitable for such a low throughput ride, even when you throw in further low throughput support attractions.

I've said earlier in this topic that I fear they'll really regret not going all out with a fully considered proper retheme of the area. No cafe for parents in a kid's area is a massive mis-step, and a theatre standing empty despite the people that will be attracted to the area is incredibly disappointing.
 
Would it be fair to guess that Gangsta Granny was originally intended to be a retheme of CATCF as opposed to a brand new ride system?

Only saying this because I seem to remember that TWODW was originally strongly rumoured for 2019 (Bradley Wynne had a project listed as “Alton Towers 2019 Attraction” listed on his LinkedIn page that had allegedly been in planning since October 2016 that suddenly disappeared midway through 2018; I feel like the Dungeons probably wouldn’t have been in planning for that long), and I’ve always heard it said that the Dungeons was intended more as a temporary stopgap until the park could craft a more permanent successor to CATCF. In the early stages of the CCL retheme rumours, I seem to remember a lot of people saying about how a rethemed CATCF was to be the area’s headline attraction. The boat ride system would also arguably fit with Gangsta Granny, as Granny and Ben do actually go into the sewers at one stage of the book.

Do you think I’m onto something, or am I reading too much into this?
 
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