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Universal GB - Archived Pre Announcement Discussion

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jon81uk said:
Why wouldn't they be?
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I’m not sure, but my feeling was that the Conservatives’ whole mission statement and mentality is generally somewhat more supportive of large-scale infrastructure projects, foreign investment and big business than Labour’s. Part of me wonders whether Labour will be considerably less keen to be friendly with a big corporate giant like Universal.

They may also be somewhat less forthcoming to open the public purse for Universal than the Conservatives.

I don’t know that for certain, though. My point is that we simply don’t know whether Labour’s stance on the project would be the same as that of the Conservatives.
 
They are meant to be supportive of business and enterprise these days.
Just had a big suck up to businesses in the last few days...promised to keep corporation tax down and support enterprise.
This is a "young and pretty" project, they will support it.
Somebody/thing has to bring in the income to government as old traditional industries collapse.
 
rob666 said:
They are meant to be supportive of business and enterprise these days.
Just had a big suck up to businesses in the last few days...promised to keep corporation tax down and support enterprise.
This is a "young and pretty" project, they will support it.
Somebody/thing has to bring in the income to government as old traditional industries collapse.
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This is a point. Universal would pay an astronomical amount of corporation tax!

Well, they’ll certainly pay more tax than the current vacant brickworks is bringing in, anyhow…
 
Matt N said:
This is a point. Universal would pay an astronomical amount of corporation tax!

Well, they’ll certainly pay more tax than the current vacant brickworks is bringing in, anyhow…
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It’s not just corporation tax, it’s employer NI contributions and business rates then all the extra tax revenue from employee income tax, NI, VAT on tickets, hotel stays, merch, food etc.

There is no way they wouldn’t back this venture.
 
AT86 said:
It’s not just corporation tax, it’s employer NI contributions and business rates then all the extra tax revenue from employee income tax, NI, VAT on tickets, hotel stays, merch, food etc.

There is no way they wouldn’t back this venture.
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When you put it like that, it does increasingly sound like any government would be mad not to back it, particularly given the current ailing state of the UK’s public finances.

While the aforementioned ailing public purse is often used as a reason why this project won’t go ahead, I actually think that the project could do quite a bit for the UK’s public finances if it did go ahead, particularly when considering the benefits that you and others have outlined.

On a separate note, I just had a thought regarding the potential planning process for this project, if it gets that far.

The London Resort was given status as an NSIP (Nationally Significant Infrastructure Project), which bypassed the local planning system and took the planning process straight to central government. Do we feel that similar status would be granted to this project to fastrack its progression through the planning system a little, if it gets that far? Or would we likely see things remain within the local planning system, with Bedford Borough Council calling the shots?
 
Matt N said:
I’m not sure, but my feeling was that the Conservatives’ whole mission statement and mentality is generally somewhat more supportive of large-scale infrastructure projects, foreign investment and big business than Labour’s. Part of me wonders whether Labour will be considerably less keen to be friendly with a big corporate giant like Universal.

They may also be somewhat less forthcoming to open the public purse for Universal than the Conservatives.

I don’t know that for certain, though. My point is that we simply don’t know whether Labour’s stance on the project would be the same as that of the Conservatives.
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Have the Conservatives not just spent the last few years destroying large scale infrastructure projects that were started under the last Labour government, though? One of Labour's biggest pitches at the moment is to make it easier to build things including major infrastructure.

They've also been meeting with heads of major media companies recently to promote British film and TV and indicate that they're going to continue incentives for filming in the country -- I've not seen that they've met with Universal yet, but I don't really see why they'd be any less supportive when they're talking a big talk about growth.
 
The local MP is a Labour guy and he seems very positive towards the project. I don't see any reason Labour would.not welcome this level of investment. The bulk of the development will be funded by Universal so the government will need to help with infrastructure and potential tax incentives. It's not like they will be building the park.
 
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A vast vast oversimplification but an example:
Universal: "We're building a new theme park, bringing loads of investment and jobs into the area"
Government/political figures: "Fantastic, we fully support that sort of thing!"

Further down the line:

Universal: "So that theme park, we can build it but we can only do it if you can provide £xxx million for rail and road improvements and drop the VAT for the tourism industry. We'll be bringing in hundreds of jobs don't forget"
Government: "That's far too much. We can only provide £xx million for roads, we're spending rail money elsewhere and there's no budget to reduce VAT across the industry"
Universal: "Then we'll have to reconsider our investment"
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I have no doubt any government will be extremely positive regarding such an investment in the UK. But as with anything, the devil is in the details. Yes, the project will bring large benefits in terms things like tax to the country's finances - but the return on that could be far slower than the money that would be lost in the short term from infrastructure spending and things like potential tax incentives.

As has already been pointed out, things like HS2 etc sounded great on paper to many, but once you get into the nitty gritty of finances the appeal has started to wear off with those who hold the purse strings. It's also got to be justified with the wider public - Someone in Alnwick wonders why all this money is being spent on a theme park when he's still waiting for the A1 to be dualed where he lives which would bring economic benefit to the area. Someone in Huddersfield wonders why all these rail improvements are being made for a theme park despite her commute to Manchester frequently being delayed or cancelled.

So while general support right now is fantastic, I don't think we should necessarily believe that support is a given once the details are revealed of the conditions Universal require in order to go ahead with a potential park. Governments have spending rules they want to stick to, and a wider public image to uphold across the whole country.

Of course, Universal could ask for nothing - but they're a business at the end of the day and I'd be surprised if they didn't require something with all the outlay they're putting in. So I'm merely suggesting attitudes can change as more details of requirements are revealed. That could all go swimmingly in the best case, cancellation at the absolute worst or delays while discussions take place. I think it'll be the middle ground personally, and it's one of the reasons I see 2030 as being overly keen, and why I don't think it's just smooth sailing through to it opening.
 
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Relife said:
I live near Preston but the weather is slightly better further south. South East in general has some of the best of the UK weather
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You said the UK though ;)

As a fellow northerner you should know we have two types of weather up here. Normal rain and that fine rain that soaks you through.

But you're right......it's definitely better in the SE.
 
Matt.GC said:
This naive "but all the politicians support it" argument was mentioned pages ago without question. I would suggest the Thoosie goggles be taken off for a re-evaluation.
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I would suggest the cynic goggles be taken off for a moment, too. I'm very much of the opinion that this country is incapable of building anything currently unless the stars align, too, but here everything so far is aligning as well as they possibly could. There's no need to be renew cynicism every couple of pages unless negative news comes out.

It's brownfield land that was previously approved for industrial development, that has approval of government and the local MP.
 
benpicko said:
I would suggest the cynic goggles be taken off for a moment, too. I'm very much of the opinion that this country is incapable of building anything currently unless the stars align, too, but here everything so far is aligning as well as they possibly could. There's no need to be renew cynicism every couple of pages unless negative news comes out.

It's brownfield land that was previously approved for industrial development, that has approval of government and the local MP.
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What if the optimism was renewed every couple of pages without positive news coming out? Not sure I understand the one way logic there.

First point taken. I do wear them a lot. However, my point is if this was any kind of project other than a theme park that everyone really really really wants being suggested, I doubt many people, if any at all, would be applying the same logic to it. Politics never has worked like that and probably never will. I'm sure rail enthusiast forums thought that HS2 was a dead cert no-brainer a long time ago when it had initial widespread political support.

This is a free lunch to local politicians at this stage.
 
Matt.GC said:
What if the optimism was renewed every couple of pages without positive news coming out? Not sure I understand the one way logic there.

First point taken. I do wear them a lot. However, my point is if this was any kind of project other than a theme park that everyone really really really wants being suggested, I doubt many people, if any at all, would be applying the same logic to it. Politics never has worked like that and probably never will. I'm sure rail enthusiast forums thought that HS2 was a dead cert no-brainer a long time ago when it had initial widespread political support.

This is a free lunch to local politicians at this stage.
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The difference between the HS2 and this is that this park has some competent people involved in actually making it happen.

The HS2 required government money which eventually it became obvious wasn’t going to be invested, this is Universal’s money which they can look good by giving their backing to.

It may or may not happen, my hunch is it will, but it’s nothing like the HS2 for the simple reason that we don’t have to rely on the government to build or fund it
 
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