I'm worried...

[delta79]

There are problems that are of merlins own making. My daughter requires RAP unfortunately we can not get pre booked rap tickets.

The last time we went, there was little bits that damaged the 'magic'
Food offering that were below par at theme park prices.
Bits of old theming colours showing though old paint.
General lowing of cleaning standards throughout the park, maybe less cleaning staff or lowest quote wins.
A general feeling that staff moral is low.

 

[GooseOnTheLoose]

So Merlin don’t provide the park a large enough budget to keep attractions open or maintain the Gardens, but that’s entirely the park’s responsibility, not Merlin’s…

We’ll agree to disagree.

Make a business case, or ask, and you're more than likely to get the money, as it is for any industry.

I do not know you need money for something until you tell me. How you budget the money I give you is not my responsibility.

 

[shakey]

Easier said than done to make a business case.....

Dear Merlin, can we have some more money to upkeep the gardens. They will look really nice and visitors will appreciate them.

Will it bring any more revenue in ?

No.

Well you cant have any more money then.

 

[GooseOnTheLoose]

I

Easier said than done to make a business case.....

Dear Merlin, can we have some more money to upkeep the gardens. They will look really nice and visitors will appreciate them.

Will it bring any more revenue in ?

No.

Well you cant have any more money then.

We're not quite at Blackpool Pleasure Beach levels yet.

 

[shakey]

I

We're not quite at Blackpool Pleasure Beach levels yet.

They are getting there slowly

 

[venny]

Merlin are renowned for providing generous budgets for park upkeep, it’s just none of the parks have asked for the money before…

 

[rob666]

The Gardens are maintained they just finished refurbing a bridge and did several projects on pagoda and conservatories

If by maintained you mean kept to a certain standard...they haven't.
They have gotten worse, gotten a lot worse, without doubt, each decade for the last five decades.
Weeds, overgrown pathways, brambles, weed trees, weed shrubs, silting of waterways, failure to maintain garden drains and fountains, fencing off the bottom third of the gardens and walkways.
I could go on.
And do.

 

[Thameslink Rail]

I think the issue we have here is Alton Towers is spending a lot of money to stand still. Whilst the park hasn't had a big new ride in seven years, they have spent a decent amount on keeping Hex, Nemesis and the Skyride going even if the average punter can't really tell. It also doesn't help that the park (outside Cbeebies Land) was downsized post Smiler so more pressure is being put on the remaining rides. Looking forward, I think the park is going to have more scrap or renew questions as Oblivion, Galactica and Rita get older and I'm not sure which way they will go on each ride.

 

[Ash]

The Gardens are maintained they just finished refurbing a bridge and did several projects on pagoda and conservatories

I’m sorry but absolutely disagree

The gardens are in an appalling mess

They look nothing like they did 10 years ago

It’s Alton history and Staffordshire history that has been maintained for decades that now is a complete state. I’m sure they’re listed I’d consider reporting them to heritage England or SMDC if it would make a difference.

Despite everything else how they’ve mistreated the gardens at towers themselves is by far the worst act.

To chip on everything else id say the park has gone through arguably the perfect storm from around 2002. (I’d argue the last of the quality years)

Look at their subsequent “major” investments…

1999 - Tussauds sold to Charterhouse (subsequent record profits)
2002 - Air added (one of the most recent projects to see major budget cuts)
2003 - Duel added. Splash Landings opened.
2004 - Spinball Whizzer/Splash Karts added
2005 - DIC buys Tussauds
2005 - Rita added
2006 - CATCF/Driving school added
2007 - Blackstone buys Tussauds
2007 - Haunted Hollow/Dung Heap added
2007 - Alton 35 year leasehold sold to Prestbury group
2008 - Mutiny Bay/Heave Ho added
2009 - Sharkbait reef/CCL added
2010 - CVC acquires 28% of Merlin & Kirkbi (Lego) buys in at 36%
2010 - Thirteen added
2011 - Go go show
2012 - nemesis sub terra/Ice age 4d added
2013 - Merlin floats 30% of company on LSE
2013 - The smiler added
2014 - CBeebies added
2015 - CVC and Blackstone sell shares in Merlin
2015 - Octonauts added
2017 - Go jetters
2018 - Wickerman added
2019 - Kirkbi, Canada Pension Fund & Blackstone buy out the company taking it private again
2020 - Dungeon added
2021 - TWODW
2022 - Varney leaves
2022 - CBeebies attractions
2023 - TCAAM
2024 - O Neil leaves
2024 - Nemesis reborn

The 90s were a huge time for the park, and the park is about to go into a decade with ageing attraction hardware all on borrowed time. Alton lacks timeless hardware unaffected rides (shows, boat rides, cinemas, walkthroughs etc) to get it through times like this but as the timeline above shows. I can’t help but feel the parks are in no way to run to provide an “excellent theme park experience” in any way. Particularly since the early 00s where I’d argue the only 90s quality attraction installed in this time is Wickerman.

Otherwise we’ve seen no “new” greenfield lands, few greenfield attractions, many removed, many different types of attractions removed, lack of maintenance, worse food, worse hotel offering (rooms/ents), worse on park entertainment and general upkeep lacking across the board.

It would be simple for me to point out private equity, pension funds and land leasehold as drains on meaningful capex but make your own minds up.

Has the resort gotten better or worse since the Tussauds takeover? By any metric you care to use? Quality of attractions, queues, variety, food, maintenance, immersion, audio, towers and gardens, built environment, all year round offering, accommodation, events.

I’d argue in very, very few ways at all.

It’s not a difficult equation. Same as we’ve seen in many other parts of the UK economy.

 

[Hid]

The 90s were a huge time for the park, and the park is about to go into a decade with ageing attraction hardware all on borrowed time. Alton lacks timeless hardware unaffected rides (shows, boat rides, cinemas, walkthroughs etc) to get it through times like this but as the timeline above shows. I can’t help but feel the parks are in no way to run to provide an “excellent theme park experience” in any way. Particularly since the early 00s where I’d argue the only 90s quality attraction installed in this time is Wickerman

I would disagree with this Charlie and the Chocolate Factory the Ride was a clever ride combining two rides in one.

The Smiler is a quality ride 14 inversions is something that only it holds

Curse at Alton Manor was also a great addition

Toxicator is great addition very fun.

The 90'a did have quality additions but so did the other years after

 

[Bowser]

Curse at Alton Manor was also a great addition

A ride i went on in 1993 is not an addition, it's a well done refresh of a peak 90s ride.

Toxicator is great addition very fun.

A replacement of a peak 90s vibe.

Charlie and the Chocolate Factory the Ride was a clever ride combining two rides in one.

Another 90's ride but re-themed.

The 90'a did have quality additions but so did the other years after

Listing 90s rides as examples of post 90s quality additions is not a particularly compelling argument.

Personally i somewhat agree with the original point that WickerMan is the best addition in the discussed period (post 2000) although i think Thirteen was also very good. The list didn't include Air/Galactica in 2002, not sure if that was deliberate as i think that deserves inclusion too. And i'd also say Splash Landings was an excellent investment.

 

[Hid]

Another 90's ride but re-themed

Technically Charlie's ride system is from the 80's.

However Toxicator is a modern ride as its floorless version different to the original we wanted a flat ride and got a flat ride yet still complain

 

[Ash]

I would disagree with this Charlie and the Chocolate Factory the Ride was a clever ride combining two rides in one.

The Smiler is a quality ride 14 inversions is something that only it holds

Curse at Alton Manor was also a great addition

Toxicator is great addition very fun.

The 90'a did have quality additions but so did the other years after

Although a partly agree with the point.

CATCF felt like something different but the execution was meh at best. The lifts and the soundtrack became the best bit and they were badly maintained. At least it felt like a “beginning/middle and end” and told the story in a reasonably cohesive way. But was it any better than the bare minimum? Not really.

Smiler is similar, great concept, executed terribly. Broken effects, badly maintained, stood for hours in an ungodly, flooded concrete prison mess. Entering an uninspired and unfinished station with little theming to speak of. Compare that to Paultons fit and finish to attractions, or even Draytons recent additions.

Curse I agree all round is great, but let’s see how long it lasts and it’s basically built on the 75% of the foundations already laid out. Merlin haven’t built a “new” similar type or quality of attraction in the 30 years since at AT.

Toxicator, see smiler…

Thirteen is ok, considering it’s meant to be Alton’s answer to expedition Everest it had an uninspired layout and again imo lacked the overall theming to deliver as seen in Forbidden Valley, X Sector, KC etc. Granted Rita hampers it but it could have been done so much better. See Danse Macbre.

 

[Benzin]

The most telling thing to me is the amount of dead space within the actual ride areas of the park currently usually where rides used to sit. Like Blade, Enterprise, etc. Which of course then leads to the issues with lacking capacity across the board, or in our case having to sit around with child doing not a lot. Our fortunate part of RAP use there meaning its not often too long but that's a different issue entirely.

Walliams Land is usually a ghost town itself. Everyone stuck in an awful looking queue for Gangsta Granny. There's zero atmosphere or feeling in that area.

We spend most of our day at CBeebies Land or Nemesis. What will we do when the child has outgrown CBeebies but isn't quite 1.2m?

The offering from a family perspective is so bad now. CatCF wasn't particularly the best dark ride ever (cheaply budgeted presumably down to the lifts) but at least it was something to do for all family members. Not every kid can do Hex or Alty Mans.

With money being tighter than ever at home people are wise to the tricks and more aware of what they're spending on. Why spend £400 a night for Towers when you could travel to Efteling or Europa instead? Edible food, clean, decent opening hours and minimal downtime makes such a difference to the day out. Those are the issues well within control and seemingly little is done to resolve them.

The revolving door of management is telling.