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2017/18: SW8 Speculation

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EuroSatch said:
Like for like replacement would be replacing a flume ride with a flume ride. There's no dressing up with a 'family audience'. Members of the public see that Alton Towers has a lot of roller coasters. Adding another whilst removing a family water ride - and critically *not* a coaster - to replace with yet another coaster is not *like for like*
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I did not mean "like for like" with respect to the ride choice - merely target audience. It is possible to maintain the target audience whilst changing ride type. If Alton Towers want to go for a 'Seven Dwarfs' type coaster that appeals to children and adults alike I have no issues with that - a ride with a fairly simple layout that can act as a 'first rollercoaster' is an area I think the park needs to move into.
 
Martin said:
Looking at the plans and wondering where the cattlepen is going to go.
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It looks like the queue is going to do something near the old flume station, unless "Q" means something else on plans? The only thing making me doubt it's the actual queue is that fact they've marked the haunted hollow as "Super Peak Q", unless I've got my geography wrong and the path marked isn't the haunted hollow?
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Also, it looks like it will have an elevator transfer system based on:
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"workshop below"
 
Good spot. Seems rather far from the station though. I'm guessing the entrance will be around there, then sort of follow the Flume path in reverse to the station? I believe that is Haunted Hollow so we could be seeing the end of that.
 
Don't mind them calling it SW8, it's just what Alton Towers do. They like to keep things secret and it's a nice way to link new developments in with the past. Besides, it's not the first family ride to have the tag and Air was hardly secret so it's not like it's that sacred a term.
 
The smokehouse is listed as a theme structure in one of the other documents, so maybe we could be seeing an elaborate queue that winds past points of interest, kind of like Wodan with the Norse gods.
 
rightbackgranty said:
I did not mean "like for like" with respect to the ride choice - merely target audience. It is possible to maintain the target audience whilst changing ride type. If Alton Towers want to go for a 'Seven Dwarfs' type coaster that appeals to children and adults alike I have no issues with that - a ride with a fairly simple layout that can act as a 'first rollercoaster' is an area I think the park needs to move into.
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Really fail to see how you can refer to 'target audience' with no reference to the hardware. People didn't ride the flume because it was a roller coaster, they rode it for the exact opposite. A family coaster will not please people who wanted to ride a gentle flume attraction
 
Leah said:
Looks like that'll be going soon then. Anyone remotely upset about this
Might actually serve a purpose now, other than confusing people by being called a "shortcut" ;)
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It's listed as an attraction so yet another loss to the line up lol

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Hmmm, all very interesting! Got to admit I wasn't expecting an EIA screening opinion request for this, funnily enough it looks like this was submitted pretty much exactly a year after the one they submitted for the original (and likely better) SW8 over in Forbidden Valley.

Clearly they've decided to stick with a wooden coaster. I'd imagine the final layout will be similar to what is seen in these plans but changes are quite possible, especially as the coaster does sit on land covered by permitted development rights. The layout at present does look a little short which is a shame, a few more twists and turns wouldn't go amiss.
EuroSatch said:
This is clearly a wooden coaster. And it's also clearly a very small scale coaster that does not take advantage of the space around it. There is an unused old coach park the other side of the path crying out for development, and there are the woods where the extended part of the flume currently resides waiting for something else. But no, instead of having a woodie swooping over the paths in Katanga and intruding into the space of where the flume used to sit, we see a very reserved footprint barely leaving the current flume queue/station area, with a drop followed by about 4 turns before arriving back at the station.
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I agree that it would be great to make more use of other space. However I think there are valid reasons for them not, especially the woodlands beyond the deer wall where the Flume is situated. As soon as you start building a coaster in there the chances of receiving planning permission fall dramatically (in my opinion). It is a very sensitive area of the park and the Concept Plan for Alton Towers in the Churnet Valley Masterplan actually zones this area as part of the Gardens. I was in an area of the Gardens the other week looking up at where the Flume is and did think if a wooden coaster was in that area the noise would really intrude on a relatively peaceful part of the park.

At a pinch you could get a quieter steel coaster in there which requires less supporting but a densely supported wooden coaster would be pushing it I feel. The fact they aren't going to remove the Flume's footers from this area shows how sensitive it is.

I personally feel all of this is very similar to InvadR at BGW. Both parks are crying out for a world class wooden coaster yet both are getting what will no doubt be good fun woodies, but not as good as each park really should be getting.

It is a real pity that the original SW8 plans fell through as they sounded so much better! I'm not passing any real judgement on this for now though. We barely have any details and what we do have is subject to change. The full planning application later this year will tell us much more!

:)
 
Ryan B said:
I am optimistic, but we really need to see proper plans before judging in my opinion. Works out at around 800 metres.
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Although 800 metres is long enough for a truly great coaster, I would have thought that for their long awaited wooden coaster, and a SW project to boot AT would want a longer ride than The Grand National, The Big Dipper and Megafobia in the the UK and competitive with current projects such as Wildfire and Lightning Rod.

I'm hoping that the 3 lines represent 2 circuits following the same route but with different elevations, banks? rolls and drops.

1600 metres would beat the length of wooden coasters than other world class theme parks are getting this year and next.

On the other hand 800 metres could easily beat any of the others if the amount of imagination that went into Nemesis goes into its design.
 
This.

"I personally feel all of this is very similar to InvadR at BGW. Both parks are crying out for a world class wooden coaster yet both are getting what will no doubt be good fun woodies, but not as good as each park really should be getting.

It is a real pity that the original SW8 plans fell through as they sounded so much better! I'm not passing any real judgement on this for now though. We barely have any details and what we do have is subject to change. The full planning application later this year will tell us much more!"

sums it up perfectly, I would have happily waited til 2020 for a world class woodie, but it seems like after 10 years searching for a wooden coaster to rival nemesis and they settle on this. while I'm sure itll be good, look at what could've been.
 
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Good and fair points in your post Rob. It's a bloody shame though.

When you look at the plans (which may or may not even happen, I know), the Flume would be going and the footprint that it had would be almost halved in area for the new attraction. As you have said, the area below the 'Deer Wall' would no longer be used and the large piece of land into the wooded area would mostly be unused. It's always hard when viewing plans such as these, knowing that with a slight bit more leniency on planning (if it's not that AT actually want a ride in a much smaller footprint) that they could potentially produce a much better, and longer, ride. To be honest, I think most things would seem like a bit of a let down in recent times given that the plans for the Cross Valley weren't that long ago (relatively), then supposed plans for a non-valley that would be stationed in FV. Then people eventually learn of an SW replacing the Flume, then it will only take up pretty much half of that site (give or take a bit). Without seeing actual plans, it just potentially seems a bit underwhelming, and I honestly don't want to be negative for the sake of it. I really want this to be a great ride :)
 
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