Climate Change

[Thameslink Rail]

Hi all, Climate change is something that has been playing on my mind for a long time, at times it has frustrated me and angered me (especially when there are people denying it on social media or big oil companies 'greenwashing'). But I would like to know what everyone else is doing and whether I can do more to prevent climate change. I feel I'm already some things but not enough: I managed to persuade my family to switch to a 100% renewable tariff (however some news outlets have said that many of these tariffs are not actually as they claim). Transport is a problem as I can't drive and I have to rely on my parent's diesel car. I am trying to cut down my meat consumption but as I'm not usually cooking I don't have much choice.
What do you people think about climate change?

 

[pluk]

I think Pleasure Beach shutting Valhalla for a couple of seasons is sufficient to offset the theme park communities emissions.

 

[Thameslink Rail]

I think Pleasure Beach shutting Valhalla for a couple of seasons is sufficient to offset the theme park communities emissions.

Whilst Valhalla certainly requires a lot of electricity to operate, it certainly wouldn't be enough to offset the theme park communities emissions.

 

[DistortAMG]

Whilst Valhalla certainly requires a lot of electricity to operate, it certainly wouldn't be enough to offset the theme park communities emissions.

 

[D4n]

I switched from being vegetarian to vegan a couple of years back to help to offset my carbon emissions (as well as animal welfare concerns I suppose). I found this relatively easy to be honest as the options are there if you look for them. The meat and dairy industries make up a shocking proportion of carbon emissions.

If any of your family or friends are like-minded then getting charity gifts for birthdays or Christmas is a great idea. The WWF has a fantastic selection ranging from adoption packages to socks.

I had also intended to cut down on flights in the next few years (probably by combining European trips into one longer trip rather than actually visiting less places) - I was going on four or five trips a year through 2018-19 and felt that this was excessive from an environmental point of view. Covid has forced me into a total emissions cut in that regard but I'll still aim to be efficient with my trips going forward.

 

[pluk]

Whilst Valhalla certainly requires a lot of electricity to operate, it certainly wouldn't be enough to offset the theme park communities emissions.

You didn't think about the gas though, did you?

 

[DistortAMG]

I switched from being vegetarian to vegan a couple of years back to help to offset my carbon emissions (as well as animal welfare concerns I suppose). I found this relatively easy to be honest as the options are there if you look for them. The meat and dairy industries make up a shocking proportion of carbon emissions.

As does growing exotic fruit and vegetables and them getting them across the planet to markets quick enough to be eaten. Worth pointing out that due to our climate and location, most of of our fruit and veg come from abroad. Apart from the ones we can natively grow here and grow them all year. Which is not many compared to what we eat.

Totally understand the animal welfare part, but as for going vegan to go greener. It is not as clear cut as you think. Then you have the points of say the shocking amount of energy and water required to grow say avocados. Which arguably a vegan could potentially be eating more, or more of different high energy/ water needed vegetable.

The case could be made, and certainly people have made strong cases based on science and data, that being vegan has the potential to be more environmentally unfriendly than being meat eaters. For a whole host of reasons.

 

[Thameslink Rail]

I switched from being vegetarian to vegan a couple of years back to help to offset my carbon emissions (as well as animal welfare concerns I suppose). I found this relatively easy to be honest as the options are there if you look for them. The meat and dairy industries make up a shocking proportion of carbon emissions.

If any of your family or friends are like-minded then getting charity gifts for birthdays or Christmas is a great idea. The WWF has a fantastic selection ranging from adoption packages to socks.

I had also intended to cut down on flights in the next few years (probably by combining European trips into one longer trip rather than actually visiting less places) - I was going on four or five trips a year through 2018-19 and felt that this was excessive from an environmental point of view. Covid has forced me into a total emissions cut in that regard but I'll still aim to be efficient with my trips going forward.

This response is very helpful, I agree with this and I will try some of these ideas, I don't fly much and veggie options are definitely becoming more prevalent, when spoons is back open I will be trying their veggie breakfast and curry.

As does growing exotic fruit and vegetables and them getting them across the planet to markets quick enough to be eaten. Worth pointing out that due to our climate and location, most of of our fruit and veg come from abroad. Apart from the ones we can natively grow here and grow them all year.

Totally understand the animal welfare part, but as for going vegan to go greener. It is not as clear cut as you think. Then you have the points of say the shocking amount of energy and water required to grow say avocados.

Eating seasonal foods is also very important, I do love some root veg in the winter and some apples and pears in the summer. Last summer I found a very lovely crate of Kentish black cherries in my local supermarket which lasted a good week!

 

[D4n]

As does growing exotic fruit and vegetables and them getting them across the planet to markets quick enough to be eaten. Worth pointing out that due to our climate and location, most of of our fruit and veg come from abroad. Apart from the ones we can natively grow here and grow them all year. Which is not many compared to what we eat.

Totally understand the animal welfare part, but as for going vegan to go greener. It is not as clear cut as you think. Then you have the points of say the shocking amount of energy and water required to grow say avocados.

It isn't really a clear cut choice between eating meat vs eating fruit and vegetables though? Everyone *should* be eating similar quantities of fruit and vegetables regardless, the switch to a vegan diet is more about getting proteins from different sources such as beans, chickpeas, tofu, seitan and lentils - all of which can be produced within Europe.

I agree that eating locally produced fruit and vegetables is an additional positive and that is something that I will always try to do. That's a choice that all of us can be making, regardless of whether you're trying to cut down on your meat consumption.

 

[DistortAMG]

It isn't really a clear cut choice between eating meat vs eating fruit and vegetables though? Everyone *should* be eating similar quantities of fruit and vegetables regardless, the switch to a vegan diet is more about getting proteins from different sources such as beans, chickpeas, tofu, seitan and lentils - all of which can be produced within Europe.

I agree that eating locally produced fruit and vegetables is an additional positive and that is something that I will always try to do. That's a choice that all of us can be making, regardless of whether you're trying to cut down on your meat consumption.

I think I edited the post to post a bit more, but the gist was, there is a strong case towards eating just vegetables can potentially be more environmentally unfriendly than friendly.

Totally get that about the proteins. But there are also types of fat and proteins than are only found in certain types of meats that are especially essential for the brain. Which is often something missed when this topic comes up.

Totally get, understand and sympathize with people who do choose to be vegan, it is not for me personally and I will never put someone down for doing it.

But what it does do, is create some very interesting talking points..

 

[rob666]

Eat local, think global.
Reuse and recycle, avoid buying needless new stuff.
Eat nothing that has to be flown in for freshness.
Try to fly less, that is a massive needless use of carbon fuels.
Try not to drive a 3.2 V6 Chelsea tractor.

 

[Jonathan]

I have to admit I think I'd probably struggle to go vegan (yay for some sensory issues with food), though we're trying to eat less meat at home anyway. More for variety in diet than anything, and some vegetarian dishes are excellent. It's amazing what the Slimming World cook books have in them! I do have issues with militant veganism and the likes of PETA, but that's for another thread.

I do make a point of trying to buy as much British produce as possible, whether it be fruit & veg or meat (if there's no British beef available, as an example, then Irish is usually readily available). Not just to reduce food miles, but also to support British farmers, which I guess is partially down to my family's background in farming. As others have raised, trying to buy seasonally is also one way of reducing one's carbon footprint.

I don't fly much anyway, and like to take the train as much as possible when going to/from London. Plus I like trains anyway. I went on an InterRail trip around Europe in November 2019, and thoroughly enjoyed it. Yes, it may take longer than flying, but you can often go from city centre to city centre quicker, you see some absolutely stunning scenery (especially in the Alps - seriously, put it on your bucket list), and it's better for the environment. I'd really encourage rail travel in Europe as an alternative to flying, though there may be some cases where flying is the only realistic option.

 

[Danza91]

The state the world is in concerning climate change is close to being irreversible and the science agrees with it. I keep seeing Governments and businesses pledging to be 'carbon neutral' or whatever by 2050, that is simply too late. Drastic change needs to happen in the next 10 years or so or we are going to be in big, big trouble. We have all the renewable energy we need but people like money...

Over the last couple of years I've started to do more to reduce my carbon footprint since waking up to the situation. My intention is to keep doing a bit more every few months and try going full vegetarian and eventually vegan. I've stopped eating red meat and cut down my meat intake overall. Beef in particular is hugely damaging for the environment. 50 bathtubs of water is required to produce one steak! Now the meats I mostly eat are chicken and turkey - beef contributes 4-5x more emissions than chicken. One easy thing people can do to make a difference is stop wasting food! On average, a third of food is wasted by households.

Pre-pandemic I had started to get the train when I was freelance working near Chiswick, as opposed to driving. It took longer, cost more, and was really more hassle, however I actually preferred it as I could read on the commute. Public transport needs to become more affordable and accessible if we're to cut down the number of cars on the road.

The fashion industry is a massive contributor which often gets overlooked. Fast fashion (Primark, Next, H&M to name a few) is a massive problem but people don't seem to care. These are cheap clothes not designed to last and are generally manufactured in poor conditions with high emissions. Moreover, clothes shed microplastics when washed. These ultimately end up in our oceans (35% from clothing) which is contributing to killing them. Our oceans do a huge job in protecting the planet, if they die...we die.

Right now the future looks bleak. COVID is really a minor problem. Sure emissions may have been reduced, but everything is single use and so much more plastic is being used. No one seems to have considered the environmental impact. Home testing kits for example - each one has five bits of plastic in, how many billions have been produced? Masks too.

There is, however, lots people can do without it costing anything, or on the cheap at least. I recently read a book called How to Save the World for Free by Natalie Fee, I'd definitely recommend it if you're wondering what you can do to help. It's not too preachy and does a good job in highlighting the issues we have.

 

[Alsty]

Controversial opinion: the best thing you can do is not have kids. The average human in the UK generates 10,000kg of CO2 per year. That's about 800,000kg in a lifetime.

I'm not vegetarian and don't propose to become one. However I do try to eat less meat, especially red meat (beef is the worst, whereas things like chicken are much better). Just cutting out red meat reduces your CO2 significantly.

In terms of other stuff, I try not to buy unnecessary crap, I reuse and recycle things where possible. Increasingly I'm trying to avoid single use plastic also.

I buy my shopping a week at a time so avoid most food waste. I turn off lights when not in use etc.

In reality most of these things only make a marginal difference, but I like to think of the butterfly effect and hopefully they help.

 

[BarryZola]

Yep, can't have it both ways. If you're having kids you're purposely adding to the climate problem in a major way. No way anyone doing so can rightfully feel smug about making small sacrifices like changing their diet etc when in reality they will in no way really offset the damage your children and the countless generations coming after them will do to the planet. Sorry, but it's true. If you don't think so then you're doing a very good job of deluding yourself.

 

[D4n]

Yep, can't have it both ways. If you're having kids you're purposely adding to the climate problem in a major way. No way anyone doing so can rightfully feel smug about making small sacrifices like changing their diet etc when in reality they will in no way really offset the damage your children and the countless generations coming after them will do to the planet. Sorry, but it's true. If you don't think so then you're doing a very good job of deluding yourself.

I have no intention of having children for this reason.

I work with children every day, love it and would consider adopting, but having kids of your own is (sadly) a hugely selfish act.

However, I do think having the attitude of "you're doing this so you might as well not bother", as you're almost suggesting, is disappointing and counter-productive. Whatever steps people are willing to take, no matter how small, to combat climate change do help.

 

[Rob]

I buy and drink Brewdog beer. Brewdog are a carbon negative company, which means they take more CO2 out of the atmosphere than they put in. I have also invested in Brewdog to help with this! Drink beer, save the planet. Sounds good to me!

 

[pluk]

This response is very helpful, I agree with this and I will try some of these ideas, I don't fly much and veggie options are definitely becoming more prevalent, when spoons is back open I will be trying their veggie breakfast and curry.

I'd love to know the combined airmiles of a spoons curry! Which comes out of a plastic container. In a building which burns energy for fun.
Just eating green things without considering source and circumstance is unlikely to be helpful to your goal, compared to staying at home and eating locally produced steak and chips this probably comes out rather poorly.

Yes, doing something is better than not doing anything at all, small changes add up, but this conversation on a theme park forum full of people churning through energy for their frivolous hobby feels a bit shallow.

 

[Plastic Person]

Yes, doing something is better than not doing anything at all, small changes add up, but this conversation on a theme park forum full of people churning through energy for their frivolous hobby feels a bit shallow.

Eh, this feels like whataboutism to me. Doing something is better than doing nothing at all. I suppose people object to the perceived 'virtue signalling' of lifestyle changes as flaunted on social media, which can obviously be toe-curling, but a lot of people are beginning to take this seriously. Theme park energy use is very small change compared to hundreds of other industries, far from perfect and some world argue as ethically dubious as anything under capitalism, but incomparable to the motor industry or factory farming. On a tangentially related note, I refuse to be dragged into absolutism by either extreme of opinion on this matter. The idea that there's no point doing anything unless you're doing everything is as daft as the ignorance of doing absolutely nothing.

Personally, I've massively reduced my meat intake thanks to learning to be a little more of a creative cook and also really enjoying the veggie options that have proliferated the mainstream in recent years. Living in mainland Europe, I'm intending to work and travel almost exclusively by train in the 'new normal', aided by many of the new and restarted night train routes upcoming across the continent. I've resolved not to own a car. Nothing worth shouting about, but all minor increments that I'm happy to undertake.

 

[D4n]

I'd love to know the combined airmiles of a spoons curry! Which comes out of a plastic container. In a building which burns energy for fun.
Just eating green things without considering source and circumstance is unlikely to be helpful to your goal, compared to staying at home and eating locally produced steak and chips this probably comes out rather poorly.

This isn't comparing like for like.

The vegan curry (delicious!) will be one of the least polluting items on the menu on Spoons.

If you're going to the pub anyway, then this is a small choice that you can make to minimise your footprint. Sure, you could stay at home to eat every night but that's a very different choice - but good for you if that's a sacrifice you're willing to make (I get the impression that it isn't).

What exactly is your point? That none of us should bother making any changes because some of the things that we do will harm the environment regardless? Why are you even bothering with this thread then? It feels like you're judging people for not making big enough changes whilst proudly beaming about being unwilling to make any changes at all yourself.