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Controversial Alton Towers Opinions

jon81uk said:
What flat rides were removed or in any way contributed to the park getting more coasters?
Flume was replaced with Wickerman, Black Hole with Smiler, Corkscrew with Thirteen. Meanwhile Ripsaw, Boneshaker, Submission, Twirling Toadstool all replaced with nothing.
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I’ve heard it said that while no flat rides were directly replaced by coasters, certain lost flat rides may have been indirectly “replaced” by coasters, from the standpoint of things like maintenance bills and staffing bills.

By that, I mean that the installation of a coaster meant that the park had to sacrifice a flat ride.
 
Matt N said:
I’ve heard it said that while no flat rides were directly replaced by coasters, certain lost flat rides may have been indirectly replaced by coasters, from the standpoint of things like maintenance bills and staffing bills.

By that, I mean that the installation of a coaster meant that the park had to sacrifice a flat ride.
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I think that’s only due to the Smiler incident causing cost cutting. If the accident hadn’t happened then things would have been different.
 
jon81uk said:
I think that’s only due to the Smiler incident causing cost cutting. If the accident hadn’t happened then things would have been different.
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Flat rides were removed without replacement before the Smiler incident. I certainly think that the Smiler incident substantially accelerated things, but rides like Submission (under Merlin) and Boneshaker (under Tussauds) had already gone without replacement long before The Smiler crashed.
 
Matt N said:
For instance, I know that many say that removing The Flume in favour of Wicker Man was a regrettable action, but I absolutely think that losing that ride was a price worth paying to get Wicker Man.
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I know Wicker Man is popular (not for me thankyou) but the park could’ve chosen somewhere else to put the ride. I’m not going to get into the debate of where because that could be long.
zeock said:
I agree with that. Whenever a flat ride has been lost to make way for a new coaster, the price has been worth paying.
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Most of the time yes, but let’s look away from Towers for a moment. Down at Thorpe Park, they cleared Model World and took out the Flying Fish to put in Stealth. Then the Flying Fish came back, revamped. Nobody saw that coming in Stealth’s opening year, although many enthusiasts did seem to know the Fish had been put in storage.

Then let’s look to the present day, where as we speak, Canada Creek or Old Town has been completely cleared, along with Loggers Leap which is currently being ripped out. The new Mack coaster for next year might be taller than Stealth and personally I’m not sold on the whole thing yet, but it can’t be denied they’re getting rid of one of the parks original legendary rides in favour of something tall - and it could turn out to be not everyone’s cup of tea. There are some memories gone from there, especially for me - many will miss it and there will be probably be many who will wonder if removing Old Town and Loggers Leap for a tall new coaster is the price worth paying. It’s a divisive decision.
 
jon81uk said:
I think that’s only due to the Smiler incident causing cost cutting. If the accident hadn’t happened then things would have been different.
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No way. I can think back to about 2003 / 2004 - more likely the latter as 2003 would have been the "honeymoon year" after Air opened. Tussauds were notably running the park into the ground even then with cutbacks on staffing & food & drink offer (admittedly not on the scale we have seen lately), but the park was looking tatty. (Air queueline "gum tree" that existed for months until they found a chainsaw...!)

Then they got rid of some of the "deadwood" layers of management & put Russell Barnes & James Paulding in charge. They really made a difference and started to turn the place around under DIC ownership. Sadly they didn't have long before Tussauds was acquired by Merlin and the rest is history, especially when Merlin had shareholders to please - shareholders first, park guests last was the mantra.

The omens for the new season don't look brilliant. Ride line-up is almost as short as ever (remember the days when Alton Towers advertised "over 100 rides and attractions"?). Hotel / accommodation standards continue to take a nose-dive to make Travelodges look good. As to food & beverage under Aramark, enough said.

Having said the above, I look forward to the return of Nemesis in 2024 & Project Horizon hopefully in 2025. I cannot see 2023 being a particularly good season for Towers due to inflation / cost of living. If you're charging top dollar prices, people expect the price to reflect the service & product. Early TripAdvisor reports from February half-term alone suggest they are failing on this front.
 
jon81uk said:
I think that’s only due to the Smiler incident causing cost cutting. If the accident hadn’t happened then things would have been different.
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Yes, but we have to remember the pandemic has also hampered things. Towers of all parks have had a double whammy.
 
And yet during the pandemic, we had extended open hours up until 8pm, a sudden focus on events and entertainment, and better utilisation of the Gardens. Even before the crash, these all seemed like pipe dreams.
 
Kraken27 said:
Then they got rid of some of the "deadwood" layers of management & put Russell Barnes & James Paulding in charge. They really made a difference and started to turn the place around under DIC ownership. Sadly they didn't have long before Tussauds was acquired by Merlin and the rest is history, especially when Merlin had shareholders to please - shareholders first, park guests last was the mantra.
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There was no turnaround in fortune in the latter years of DIC ownership, and Barnes got rid of the themed music on towers street. I did like Paulding however and he pushed big for Scarefest. But the latter years of DIC were “in the dung heap” and “haunted hollow” so not exactly turning around.

Merlin actually started really well, we got the sky ride refurb, monorail refurb, shark bait reef and Mutiny bay which where all improvements on what was there previously. It was 2010 when things started going a bit “meh” for Merlin.
 
After my recent visit, I would like to bump this thread with what is seemingly quite a controversial opinion… I much prefer the new Nemesis Reborn soundtrack by IMAScore to the old Nemesis soundtrack by Graham Smart.
 
Matt N said:
After my recent visit, I would like to bump this thread with what is seemingly quite a controversial opinion… I much prefer the new Nemesis Reborn soundtrack by IMAScore to the old Nemesis soundtrack by Graham Smart.
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I have to agree with you. Whilst I’m not a fan of certain bits in the new soundtrack, there are bits that I really like and I think overall it feels like a more exciting track than the previous one
 
Whilst they are ok rides I think the park could comfortably lose nearly half of its coasters (Spinball, Thirteen, Galactica, Rita, and even The Smiler) and I don’t think I’d miss them at all so long as they were replaced by modern equivalents with better reliability and throughputs.
 
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