Coronavirus

[Jonathan]

There really is an XKCD comic for almost every occasion, isn't there?

 

[Skyscraper]

The important thing is that everyone will get the opportunity to be vaccinated eventually, and I think that the vaccine will become more widely available to the young and non-vulnerable by the spring based on what the government is saying.

Always take what the Government says with a large pinch of salt.

 

[Jonathan]

Always take what the Government says with a large pinch of salt.

And, if you drink, a slice of lemon & a shot of tequila?

 

[RoyJess]

All your points are correct

But the priority list doesn't end once all the vulnerable have been vaccinated. The goal is 100% vaccination (or at least high enough that we achieve heard immunity). Once all the vulnerable have been vaccinated there still has to be an order to who's vaccinated next.

Yes I know, see my earlier post

Everyone will be offered the vaccine

My point is that teachers would still unfortunately be quite far down the list.

So if you are a teacher and fall within the criteria, then yes, you will be on the priority list. The whole point of the priority list is not to have a free for all approach and to ensure that the most vulnerable gets the vaccine and not squeezed out. The end goal is to get to back to as much normal life and will only happen once everyone has been offered the vaccine. However, the short term goal is to ease some of the restrictions and to get the whole country back into tier 2 as soon as possible and to end any potential future harsh lock downs. The priority list was put together by an independent panel of experts designed to reach the short term goal as quick and effectively as possible.

You only have to look what happened to the flu vaccine this season, those that are vulnerable and are in need of it and have regularly received it for the past years have been squeezed to the bottom of the pile.

This debate on here regarding the priority list is because of members expressing an opinion that key workers should be a priority and should have it now. As much as I feel that key workers have done a great job in keeping the economy going throughout this pandemic, I do find it is an insult that people have put key workers on the same par as the NHS health workers who are on the front line fighting this pandemic.

Our NHS healthcare workers are doing an amazing job, we shouldn't deny them of receiving the vaccine as a priority

 

[Islander]

You only have to look what happened to the flu vaccine this season, those that are vulnerable and are in need of it and have regularly received it for the past years have been squeezed to the bottom of the pile.

You keep saying this, and certainly it sounds like unfortunately your experience and that of others in your area has been pretty awful this year... but I'm still not convinced it's been a widespread problem. Certainly around here I've not heard of any issues with access to the flu jab, and those that have accessed it in the past have managed to do so fine this year.

 

[RoyJess]

You keep saying this, and certainly it sounds like unfortunately your experience and that of others in your area has been pretty awful this year... but I'm still not convinced it's been a widespread problem. Certainly around here I've not heard of any issues with access to the flu jab, and those that have accessed it in the past have managed to do so fine this year.

If you read some of the other post, you will find it wasn't confined to our local area. It has been a wide spread problem. We did eventually get our vaccine only a couple of weeks ago.

 

[Tim]

Yes I know, see my earlier post

I did, and I've been agreeing with you all along, so I'm not sure why we are having this debate.

My point was simply that while teachers are putting themselves at risk they are not in as much risk as people in other sectors.
I do however believe they, and other works should be acknowledge as being more at risk because there profession makes contact harder to avoide.
That does not put them above people who are actually vulnerable as you are claiming I've said.

 

[RoyJess]

That does not put them above people who are actually vulnerable as you are claiming I've said.

I didn't claim that it was you that said it

This debate on here regarding the priority list is because of members expressing an opinion that key workers should be a priority and should have it now.

I did, and I've been agreeing with you all along, so I'm not sure why we are having this debate.

This...

If schools are going to be reopening then all school staff need to receive the vaccine now.

I'm all for teachers being given priority for the vaccine.

Well if we are talking priorities then food process workers should be first in line as well

The police say hi also.

Virtually all key workers should get priority for the vaccine!

....and you choose to wade in on it

 

[Craig]

We're just going to go round in circles on the vaccine priority front. People have their own opinions on it and clearly nothing is going to change that, so let's move discussion on from that please.

The fact that will not change is that the Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation make the decisions on vaccine priority. The government would change that priority only on their saying so, so suggesting alternatives for the government to otherwise adapt is not constructive.

 

[pluk]

This debate on here regarding the priority list is because of members expressing an opinion that key workers should be a priority and should have it now. As much as I feel that key workers have done a great job in keeping the economy going throughout this pandemic, I do find it is an insult that people have put key workers on the same par as the NHS health workers who are on the front line fighting this pandemic.

Our NHS healthcare workers are doing an amazing job, we shouldn't deny them of receiving the vaccine as a priority

I don't think putting any other key worker ahead of NHS staff is the intent of anyone's posts, it certainly isn't mine in regards to police. NHS staff are clearly already receiving it and it's more of a case of who should be next as to my knowledge none have been informed of any timeframe. Again, the rollout as it has occurred is incredible and still in very early stages, that isn't lost on me at all.

Having said that, I do think though there is a lack of appreciation about how involved with and exposed to the virus other services are. Police for example attend every sudden/unexpected death, this recently has obviously included a good number of people with covid who have coughed themselves to death at home. Attendance is to ensure the death is not suspicious or unnatural so includes searching of the body and the found locations which are obviously likely to be heavily contaminated. The necessity to arrest someone isn't changed by covid either, so we end up physically restraining people and can be with them in confined spaces for extended periods. All of this outside of the relatively controlled environment of a hospital ward, where each scenario is different and so making effective use of PPE becomes harder and harder.

Overall, there'll be people in other services who are much more greatly exposed to the virus than some medical workers working in isolated and non covid areas, so it's not as clear cut as its seems at first glance.

*sorry, started writing that before Craig's post, still think its relevant though.

 

[D4n]

The vulnerable and elderly can continue to self isolate, and should be given support in doing so until the vaccine can be made available to them.

Those in essential, high risk jobs don't have this option.

Regarding the difference between teachers and other key workers such as supermarket workers and police, my argument was more to do with opening schools being a political choice. They do not need to be open right now (unlike shops etc), therefore IF the government are going to willingly put these people in harm's way, when it is not necessary, then they should be offered the vaccine. Otherwise there if blood on their hands.

 

[RoyJess]

The vulnerable and elderly can continue to self isolate, and should be given support in doing so until the vaccine can be made available to them.

So you would like to see all those age 50yrs and over to go and isolate potentially for another year? This is what has got my hackles up and it is not just the attitude confined to this forum. It's something that I keep hearing time and time again since the first lock down.

I can tell you that we have recived very little in the way of support if any at all

 

[BigT]

The vulnerable and elderly can continue to self isolate, and should be given support in doing so until the vaccine can be made available to them.

Those in essential, high risk jobs don't have this option.

Regarding the difference between teachers and other key workers such as supermarket workers and police, my argument was more to do with opening schools being a political choice. They do not need to be open right now (unlike shops etc), therefore IF the government are going to willingly put these people in harm's way, when it is not necessary, then they should be offered the vaccine. Otherwise there if blood on their hands.

Opening schools isn’t a political decision it’s essential, kids have already missed 6 months learning in the last year, any more time off and they will have to repeat a year with all of the upheaval that will cause.
The only other option is for schools to open longer hours and more days, how about a six day school week?

 

[Alsty]

Schools are already disrupted with teachers and/or entire classes of kids and family units quaranting or being off self-isolating though. It's not like they've had anything like a normal academic year.

At the moment there's an expectation that teachers should do a full day's teaching and then provide exactly the same lesson for those who have to stay at home. That isn't reasonable or sustainable. They don't get paid overtime and are already overworked.

I don't know what the solution is but it seems to me that an approach like that taken in the first lockdown might be necessary in areas where the virus is out of control. Granted, it does pose logistic problems for parents with work arrangements and I suspect that's the real reason the government want kids in school.

 

[James]

It's worth pointing out in terms of healthcare staff, the intent of vaccinating healthcare workers is not just to protect them, but it is to protect patients and fellow colleagues as well. The spreading of the virus in healthcare settings is a huge issue, and of course the NHS is relied upon to be a service that is there for you when you need it. At the moment these services are struggling and by vaccinating these staff first, it ensures that there will be an NHS service available as we continue to get through this.

There will of course be valid points for all sectors, moreso those working in public facing roles or roles that involve interacting with others. There's no perfect order of prioritisation as there are too many variables. I believe the current priority list is as best as it can be (as I say, there's no such thing as perfect).

Personally I feel it's something not worth worrying about, we have been living with this virus for 9 months. We will all get round to being offered the vaccine at some point. The best way to think is that the more people that get vaccinated (even if it's before you) and the less cases we will see, the closer we get to being 'back to normal'.

 

[Alsty]

I guess it would also reduce the requirement for ICU staff to wear such intrusive PPE for hours on end. That can't be fun.

 

[pluk]

It's worth pointing out in terms of healthcare staff, the intent of vaccinating healthcare workers is not just to protect them, but it is to protect patients and fellow colleagues as well. The spreading of the virus in healthcare settings is a huge issue, and of course the NHS is relied upon to be a service that is there for you when you need it.

I guess it would also reduce the requirement for ICU staff to wear such intrusive PPE for hours on end. That can't be fun.

Unfortunately the vaccine will probably not have much bearing on these issues initially; vaccination does not stop you having or spreading the virus, it just stops you getting ill while your body fights it off.

 

[Themeparksandy1981]

I don’t know how many parties had to be broken up last night around the uk but in Birmingham alone over 300 times police were called out to gatherings in the centre, houses and a big party happening in a warehouse. I can’t understand why theses people still act like the virus is fake or won’t affect them.

 

[BarryZola]

We've got a nation of selfish grown up children unfortunately. Doctors and nurses working around the clock dealing with the dying and dead, reading them passages from their holy books because their families can't even see them before they go. But it's too much for some people to wear a mask for a few minutes or social distance because it infringes on their human rights. Blood on their hands.

 

[Danza91]

I'm not surprised. People's compliance is waning, and with the Government seemingly reluctant to acknowledge that schools are the super spreader, people are fed up of having their lives put on hold in a tier system which doesn't work. Or that's how I see it. Plus humans are not designed to be locked up indoors on their own, so it's only natural as time goes on people will start to ignore the rules more often.

We cancelled all our plans over the holidays, had things booked etc, but we might as well have carried them out. I nipped into town for some bits the other day and it was busier than Christmas Eve. There were clearly many groups of three/four households all together. It made our sacrifices feel pointless. At the same time I don't blame others when the rules were changed a few days before.

A quiet New Year's at home for us, and there didn't seem to be much going on in the blocks of flats we're in and surrounded by. At midnight there were people setting off fireworks in the park opposite which was nice to watch though.

In terms of the vaccine rollout, whichever way of looking at it people will make their own case to have it before others. I'd put 'smokers who have spent the last nine months seemingly acting concerned for their own health by shouting that other people are putting it at risk, but haven't bothered to give up smoking themselves' at the back of the queue - though I'm not sure there's a category for that.