Five/Ten/Fifteen year plan if you owned Alton?

[RIPCorky]

First thing I'd do is move Rita so the station is in car park and use it to transport guests to towers street. That should stop people moaning about the monorail being too slow. May even connect the corkscrews for the return trip.

 

[Willemgorman1]

I’m sure i did one of these but this is what i would do from now to 2028

2023:
• 3 brand new permanent flat rides. 2 in x sector where enterprise was and spinjam is. 1 in forbidden valley where funk n fly is.
• Nemesis sub terra returning, similar to what it was
• Duel reopens after refurbishment
• Nemesis undergoing re-track
• The park announce that 2023 is the last year of the dungeons.

2024:
• Nemesis reopens after re-track
• Brand new permanent flat ride to replace Flávio’s fabulous fandango

2025:
• New ride/area where project horizon is planned. Closure of the dungeons in 2023 means that the dungeons and the old Charlie and the chocolate factory building is used as a new indoor flume ride. In the project horizon building a new indoor coaster to be added.
• Rita removed at the end of August

2026:
• Construction of sw9
•General park updates, bit of a refresh of katanga canyon.

2027:
• Opening of sw9, a launch coaster of some sort, featuring 2-3 inversions.

2028:
• General park updates

 

[Zeock]

• Brand new permanent flat ride to replace Flávio’s fabulous fandango

Does Flavio's really need to go? It does look a little out of place but not that much in my opinion. I think that the most important thing to do in that area is to theme the Driving School to the World of David Walliams (naturally with a Bad Dad theme).

 

[Zeock]

Ten Year Plan:

2023:
Duel reopens after refurbishment
Nemesis undergoes retrack
Cuckoo Cars themed into World of David Walliams with Bad Dad theme
Retrosquad removed
Nemesis Sub Terra reopens
Scarefest maze to tease the reopening of Nemesis

2024:
Nemesis opens after retrack
General hotel improvements
General F&B improvements parkwide and in the hotels
Talocan clone opens on site of Ripsaw
Hotel prices reduced and Stargazing Pods capped to £80
Spinball Whizzer closes
Gardens given major TLC
New Nemesis Nosh

2025:
Project Horizon opens (a Mack Spinner similar but not a clone to Storm Chaser at Paultons)
Multiple flat rides open around Coaster Corner to create a new area along with Project Horizon
Swiss Cottage utilised as a upmarket restaurant
Dungeons close
The Blade closes
Rita receives new trains (with lap bars!) for its 20th anniversary.

2026:
General park improvements
New pirate ship with same name as The Blade opens on the same site.
Skyride given major TLC
Galactica themed back to Air

2027:
Oblivion undergoes retrack
General hotel improvements
Hex closes
General F&B improvements parkwide and in the hotels.
Scarefest's 20th Anniversary: 3 classic mazes (Sub Species 2015 version, Carnival of Screams 2010 version and Boiler House 2008 version) along with a new maze celebrating the history of Scarefest which would include areas themed to classic mazes not revived. Return of the free scare zones.

2028:
General park improvements
SW9 begins construction (a cross-valley B&M hyper)
Oblivion reopens after retrack

2029:
Flavio's Fabulous Fandango closes
SW9 opens
Multiple flat rides open along with SW9 to create new area
Air closes

2030:
Both Runaway Mine Train and Congo River Rapids close
Rita closes
New world-class log flume on Dungeons site similar to Chiapas at Phantasialand
General park improvements
Special events for 50th anniversary of AT

2031:
Intamin Blitz called Surrender opens on site of Rita
New flat ride in Forbidden Valley
General hotel improvements

2032:
New theatrical dark ride in the Towers similar to Symbolica at Efteling
General F&B improvements parkwide and in the hotels.
25th anniversary of Scarefest: 5 scare mazes and 3 free scare zones

2033:
New land on site of Katanga Canyon including a Vekoma SFC and a completely new immersive river rapids.
Cbeebies Land expansion on site of Spinball Whizzer
General park improvements

 

[Ethan]

I like the sound of this thread so I'll bring it back to life and throw out some ideas, starting from 2024.
2024:
Nemesis reopens after retrack
Retro rides leave and 3 permanent themed flats replace them
Food outlet improvements across the park, towers part ways with Amramak.
Dungeon closes to make way for indoor water ride
2025:
Project horizon opens, 2 flats on the plaza and very themed area/land. Coaster to be similar to Helix.
2026:
Water ride similar to Valhalla opens in former dungeon building
Galactica rethemed to fit the phalanx and Nemesis story
2027:
Hex closes
Spinball closes to prepare for Cbeebies expansion
2028:
Work begins on rides replacing Hex and Spinball
2029:
Massive Cbeebies expansion, with 5-6 new rides and new shops/outlets in the area.
Hex replacement similar to Phantom manor, with immersive backstory, pre shows and theme based on the haunted tales of the towers ruins.
2030:
Oblivion retrack takes place

 

[Martin]

With the revamped FV open already and a new flat - possibly one of three - on the way, along with a likely retheme of Galactica and the project in the old Coaster Corner, it seems Towers finally has something of a long term vision again, and a revived focus on making coherent, themed experiences. With Universal looking like it's certain to go ahead, Towers doesn't really have a choice but to open the taps. So thought I'd give this a bump with my ambitious LTDP / wishlist.

Over the next 5 years they're going to have to give most of the park some attention to address the weaker areas, the lack of flat and indoor rides, and the general poor state some parts of the park have fallen into. A major or multiple minor projects every year for the next five years, with 'major' being defined as a substantial new addition and minor being a refresh or a small addition. Expanding the resort can be a more long term thing as long as the immediate issues are taken care of soon. Not including the ruins or gardens, as these should be getting care and attention every year as a matter of course.

2025
Minor theme park projects
Two new flats in X Sector and a refresh to the theme, bringing Oblivion and Smiler properly together as projects by the 'Ministry of Joy' or some other unseen organisation above them. Repair the Oblivion station building and with whatever money is left, sort out The Smiler's building and queue to make them at least a little less awful. Galactica is refurbished and rethemed into the rest of FV alongside the new topspin.
Resort
Simple resort improvements by fixing processes and services, improving food offerings and opening one bar late.

2026
Major theme park projects
Horizon opens as phase 1 of a new mostly indoor land.
Minor theme park projects
Mutiny Bay is replaced by a new area based around The Wickerman, as the village the cult lives in and the Sea Life their fishing wharf - Battle Galleons goes. The vibe should be friendly but with something not quite right. Swiss Cottage opens as a new restaurant and tea room, and is kept open after park close with an upmarket menu. Dungeons close.
Resort
Begin rolling process of refurbishing hotel rooms over next few years.

2027
Major theme park projects
Family year. Walliams World meets its overdue end, a new kids area opens with new attractions and new frontages for the buildings etc, not just new paint. Spinball goes at the end of 2026, and the area becomes part of an expanded BBC/CBBC area. Possibly a new small family coaster if the planners are generous, some family flats if not. Rita and Thirteen close at the end of the season.
Resort
Hotel improvements continue with general refresh of lobbies, bars and restaurants etc bit by bit.

2028
Major theme park projects
Phase 2 of the new Horizon land opens, repurposing the Dungeons building for a new indoor water ride, and developing the midway.
Resort
Big focus on the resort, continuing any ongoing projects, and finally sorting out the water park with an extension and refurbishment. Big investment into Enchanted Village to make it not crap, add camping and add some new outdoor activities.

2029
Major theme park projects
Dark Forest reopens after a complete rebuild, with new buildings replacing the current ones. A modern launch coaster with a smaller family ride such as a Gerst shuttle intertwined ie Taron and Raik open. The theme is similarly haunted woodland based, but a more fun and whimsical take. A flat ride can go in now or as a phase 2 later on, depending on budget

2030-2035 and onwards
KK is now very old, but RMT and the rapids are staples so should be kept alive with a new, more original theme and whatever work needs doing to keep them going, or replace with more modern versions. Reopen the spa, begin work on new resort extension - an entertainment area on the part of the 'Air carpark' next to the golf. Long term, a new hotel on the southern portion of the car park. This will require a change in the route cars take - veering right to get to the resort, and keeping left for the main theme park car parks. This still leaves a large chunk of the Air car park free for future Resort extension, or theme park extenstion should Air be deemed surplus to requirements.

 

[Balddadgra]

Loving this thread but i think as it seems universal uk WILL now happen, this will totally change the short term and long term plans towers has. It WILL have to somehow build a new sw every 1 or 2 seasons for a few years just to compete in my opinion. I’m not saying i agree with it, but it will have to be like the 90’s and create a new generation of amazing coasters to being the general public in, or keep them coming in.

 

[Jb85]

Loving this thread but i think as it seems universal uk WILL now happen, this will totally change the short term and long term plans towers has. It WILL have to somehow build a new sw every 1 or 2 seasons for a few years just to compete in my opinion. I’m not saying i agree with it, but it will have to be like the 90’s and create a new generation of amazing coasters to being the general public in, or keep them coming in.

I hope things aren’t rushed and built every 1 or 2 years. Unless plans are well thought out, we risk a mish mash of rides again.

There plenty of time still for the park to adjust. What I would say is they need to be setup as a proper resort - not just play at it like they have been.

 

[owenstreet7]

For me, I'd say this is how I'd do it taking into account current projects.

2025:

Project Ocean - Huss Top Spin Suspended in Forbidden Valley or similar
X Sector Flat 1 - Huss Airboat or Trioka on the site of Enterprise
X Sector Flat 2 - Zamperla Discovery 30 on the site of Spinjam/Submission
Retheme of Galactica to fit into Forbidden Valley
Reopening of Skyride and Hex if not already happened
Park sets up Alton Towers Express shuttle bus from Stoke on Trent and Uttoxeter
Start of expansion of Single Rider queues

2026:
Project Horizon - Intamin Multi Dimension coaster similar to Uncharted (Themed to Exploration)
Overhaul of Dungeons Boat Ride to fit into the theme of Project Horizon
Removal of Raj, Driving School and Flavios to make way for the 2nd Phase of Project Horizon Area
Larger Replacement of Royal Carousel in the Project Horizon area (Bertazzon)
Relocation of smaller existing Royal Carousel to Cbeebies Land
Addition of Bertazzon Dodgems and Musik Express to Project Horizon area

2027: Phase 2 of Project Horizon area
Retheme of Gangsta Granny Ride to fit into area
4D Cinema to be replaced with a Mack Gameplay Theatre
Nickelodeon Outta Control to become a Funhouse similar to the one at Phantasialand
Driving School site to become an Adventure Play Area suitable for those 6-12 years old.
Park to start opening for winter season with Cbeebies Land, Munity Bay, Gloomy Wood and Project Horizon areas being open with all indoor or covered rides being open.
Last rides on Rita

2028:
Rita to be relocated to Gardaland during the closed season with it becoming an LSM coaster
Most of Dark Forest closed for entire season and demolished with Thirteen accessible via an alternative route.
Quiet Season for additions

2029:
SW9 - Intamin LSM Launch Coaster similar to Taron on the site of Dark Forest
Supporting Ride - Intamin Flume similar to Biberburg
Supporting Ride - Intamin Dynamic Motion Stage
Supporting Ride - Flying Theatre
Thirteen to be integrated into Mystic Forest area with Thirteen being the dark part of the area.
Spinball Whizzer to close at the end of season

2030:
Spinball Whizzer is dismantled during the closed and possibly relocated elsewhere
Construction starts on a large Cbeebies Land Expansion
Addition of multiple Robo Arms in Mystic Forest area as Phase 2

2031: Cbeebies Land Expansion with Dark Ride and Family Rides on site of Spinball Whizzer

2032-2040:
Replacement of Congo River Rapids (water ride and possible rollercoaster)
Expansion of Park towards hotel beyond Galactica
Development of Area by Wickerman on the path to Katanga Canyon
Cross Valley SW from Forbidden Valley to Dark Forest (B&M Hyper Style)
Major Refurbishment/Overhaul of Oblivion and possibly Galactica
Runaway Mine Train to receive similar replacement (possibly at same time as rapids)
Further Expansion of Flat and Dark Rides
Further Resort Expansion

 

[Ethan]

What I will say in regards to Universal is that the new resort will likely have more implications on Thorpe Chessington and Legoland not Towers. Busch Gardens tampa is 77 miles from Universal and yet Busch Gardens still get relatively large visitor numbers without needing to keep up with Universal

 

[Matt N]

What I will say in regards to Universal is that the new resort will likely have more implications on Thorpe Chessington and Legoland not Towers. Busch Gardens tampa is 77 miles from Universal and yet Busch Gardens still get relatively large visitor numbers without needing to keep up with Universal

I disagree with this, as I don’t think it’s entirely down to distance. I think the market it targets and product it offers is also important to consider.

Alton Towers may be further from Universal than the three London parks, but the market space it occupies and target market it attracts is arguably more similar.

Thorpe Park is predominantly a day trip park, and focuses on the amusement park vibe with big thrill coasters and flats. Universal is unlikely to muscle in on this turf too much; their park might offer one or two outdoor thrill coasters or flat rides, but it’s unlikely to focus on them in the way Thorpe Park does.

Chessington has more of a resort offering, but it has the zoo as a dividing line with Universal. The chances of Universal offering any kind of zoo offering in their British resort are slim to none.

Legoland is arguably more vulnerable, with a strong focus on dark rides that Universal is likely to parallel as well as more of a resort offering, but it has the Lego and a possibly slightly younger target market as a dividing line with Universal. Universal will not have the Lego that Legoland offers.

The key thing is that Thorpe and Chessington, and to a lesser extent Legoland, have a mostly regional pull and are parks that most simply make day trips to.

With Alton Towers, on the other hand, the park has a national pull and has a significant number of people booking multi-day short breaks there. It is a whole-family short break resort with a nationwide pull, and a significant proportion of visitors to Alton Towers will be staying overnight and taking in the whole resort. Universal will be muscling in on this turf massively; the British Universal resort is likely to be aiming for a nationwide pull, and it will likely be aiming for this family short break market. I think this will make Alton Towers uniquely vulnerable compared to the London parks, and I certainly think that there’s a chance of the short break market at Towers being harmed.

 

[Martin]

Towers is absolutely vulnerable. People tolerate it being in the middle of nowhere and the low standards because there's nothing else in the country like it.

Universal will be closer to London, much more accessible, and won't allow itself to get as ran down as parts of Towers are.

Towers' advantage is they're still well over with the public for now. It's easy for us lot to get crayons out and say "this is what they should do" but they don't really have a choice. They really do only have 5-10 years to get ready for Universal

 

[Ethan]

and a significant proportion of visitors to Alton Towers will be staying overnight and taking in the whole resort.

This is just not true. There will be far more day trippers than those staying at the resort

 

[Matt N]

This is just not true. There will be far more day trippers than those staying at the resort

I won’t claim to know the exact ratios, but I wouldn’t mind betting that a significant number of people at very least visit Alton Towers for multiple days and make it into a whole short break. Perhaps not necessarily staying on-site, but I’d argue that a lot of people spend a whole short break there rather than merely doing it in a day trip.

At very least, I’d argue that that percentage is far higher than it is for the London parks, which makes Alton Towers more vulnerable, in my view.

 

[Ethan]

At very least, I’d argue that that percentage is far higher than it is for the London parks, which makes Alton Towers more vulnerable, in my view

Towers will still make significant profit through day tickets regardless of hotel performance. Universal won’t offer what most people visit towers for. The main draws like Smiler Nemesis and Cbeebies will keep the park in the game

 

[Mick]

Let’s say for arguments sake Universal gets 20m visitors in a year.

A percentage of that will be tourists from America, Asia and Europe travelling specifically for the park. But the majority will be people from the UK who are making the conscious choice to use their time and money to go there over many of the vast array of leisure and entertainment options on offer in this country.

This isn’t just exclusive to theme parks, but museums, sport, concerts, even stuff such as clothes and nights out, even holidays. It’s all disposable income that people have to make a conscious decision on spending.

If the offer is good enough, people will still go, it’s simple.

 

[Steve74]

You also have to factor in price. Currently, Universal Orlando day tickets booked in advance online are $126-$190 (£99-£150) for 1 park per person (source). Obviously no idea what they'll charge over here or what packages and deals they'll offer, but you can guarantee you won't get into Universal GB for whatever Towers will be charging in 2030 and beyond. For many, I see Universal being the 1 trip per year or even every couple of years destination purely because the cost will be prohibitive and Towers/Thorpe etc will continue to cater for the majority of the British public.

 

[Matt N]

Towers will still make significant profit through day tickets regardless of hotel performance. Universal won’t offer what most people visit towers for. The main draws like Smiler Nemesis and Cbeebies will keep the park in the game

I can see the argument that Universal will never match Towers’ coaster lineup, and perhaps that does give Alton Towers a dividing line with Universal to some extent.

However, I think the whole family, multi-day short break market is a significant one for Alton Towers, and I think this is where Universal will hit them hardest, and hit them much harder than any of the other parks.

I think Alton Towers, more so than the other 3 Merlin parks, will need to fundamentally change its business model in some way to compete with Universal effectively. My view is that they have a few options.

One option is that they do similar to Thorpe Park and really double down on the thrill rides, coasters and flats. The park certainly has the coaster lineup to make such a business position work, in my view, and if combined with some effective investment into thrilling flat rides and new thrill coasters, this could give them a strong dividing line with Universal. However, I think that a whole family short break resort like Alton Towers does not suit this approach as well as Thorpe Park does, and I think it would likely have to entail a bit of a painful transitional phase of Alton becoming more of a day trip-focused park due to the thrill market being less conducive to a substantial resort offering (as evidenced by Thorpe’s next to nonexistent offering compared to the other three Merlin parks). For a park that has spent the best part of 30 years curating a reputation as a whole family short break resort, I think this could be a very drastic and painful transition.

Another option, and probably the more likely one, is that they significantly undercut Universal in terms of price. Universal will be expensive, and some of the British public won’t pay their prices, either through lack of means or lack of desire. Alton Towers could tap into this market by offering a significantly cheaper short break offering; people won’t care if the product isn’t spectacular if the price point is compellingly low enough. This route, if pursued aggressively, would likely see the product become more low-end and would not see the sort of increased quality people desire, but the success of businesses like Wetherspoons proves that “cheap and cheerful” can be a highly effective business model.

 

[Ash]

2025:
Galactica re-theme & Ripsaws revenge opens for start of the season
Towers St Family Restaurant bought back into use
Skyride reopens

2026:
New flat ride located in X-Sector

4D cinema reopened
Project Horizon construction started

2027:
Second Flat ride added to X sector
Driving school relocated to CBeebies & re-themed
New Alton museum added into the towers
Dungeons re-themed to Sherlock Holmes
ATH refurb “guest areas” refurb

2028:
PH opens
FFF removed
Walliams World rethemed to “Talbot Street”
Oblivion partial retrack
Railway line to Alton from Leek reopens
Swiss Cottage turned into high end dining experience

2029:
GG re-themed to Mr Bean cartoon attraction
Monorail receives overhaul
Downtown Alton started (minigolf moved indoors, Lego discovery centre added, restaurants)
Meadows parking enhancements finished

2030:
Flying theatre added behind old Nickoledeon building themed to “Algenon Flying Machine”
Rita removed end of season

2031:
Blade relocated to MB
Dark Forest consolidated to just 13
All existing buildings demolished
New “spooky” restaurant added
Family flat ride added to KC
Nightime/fountain show added to lake

2032:
New Mack Multi Launch open
Galactica closes end of season

2033:
New flat ride added on blade site
Guest Services side of Towers Street demolished
RMT retracked/theming improvements

2034:
New large indoor/show event space added to express disabled parking. Accessible from inside and outside the park
365 operation begins

2035:
New hotel covering RHS of Towers Street and entrance plaza constructed
Work begins on new world class trackless dark ride on land behind KC

 

[Balddadgra]

I hope things aren’t rushed and built every 1 or 2 years. Unless plans are well thought out, we risk a mish mash of rides again.

There plenty of time still for the park to adjust. What I would say is they need to be setup as a proper resort - not just play at it like they have been.

I completely agree with you but this is probably, in reality, what HAS to happen. Alton will know next year onwards they will have to, for the foreseeable, build at least one big coaster/significant project every hear or two just to remotely compete with universal. I know they are slightly diffwrent markets etc but like other posters have said, a LOT of people like me only visit one ‘resort’ like alton once a year for a weekend. If universal was open next year, to he blunt, i’d visit universal unless alton had 2 or 3 new coasters. A lot of my family and friends up north think similar too. Yes universal will cost more but it will undoubtedly be better quality, so alton need to up their game and have some fresh rides. I LOVE altons rides but there's only so many times you can ride the same rides year after year…