Incident on The Smiler 02/06/2015

[Rob]

Surely the logical answer to the problem of what happened is that whenever a train stalls, the ride must be shut down and evacuated before anybody fiddles with 'manual overrides' etc.

Whether the train on the lift hill was released by human error or not it should have been evacuated.

I agree completely, and I would imagine that would be standard procedure already. Which makes me think that any staff members who were present in the op-cabin at the time were not aware of the stall.

 

[Dave]

But as we all know, ride breakdowns (and subsequently manual over-ride) are a routine part of any ride's operation. If, as I assume you're implying, the crash was therefore due to human error, I'm sure you'll agree that there's no way to completely remove the risk of human error occurring again. Which is why you would then take other steps to minimise the risk should such an event occur again.

But I almost feel that whether it was the computer system failing in normal operation or human error in manual, it is actually irrelevant. The fact is that it happened due to what Merlin describes as a 'unique set of circumstances' and there's no guarantee that another 'unique set of circumstances' couldn't occur again.

Indeed there is never a guarantee that another accident can't happen again, no system is 100% safe. The accident likely though highlighted something they see as being fixable with new systems in place.

Plus they have to be seen to be doing something even if it's effect is negligible.

 

[Alexsutton]

There was a theory that the procedure was to reverse the train down the lift to make for an easier evac on level track at ground level, a situation specific to The Smiler as I can't think of any other ride that can be reversed back down the lift.

 

[Rick]

You're absolutely right but at this point we don't even know if the ride operator/engineer even realised that a train had stalled.

Which is the root cause of the issue.

 

[Tarquin]

Which is the root cause of the issue.

Gerstlauer obviously wouldn't design a rollercoaster where you were unable to tell if it had stalled. So something must have happened that was completely unexpected and that they had not foreseen if (and that's a big if) the stall wasn't detected. Therefore, there could be a similar set of unforeseen circumstances (not necessarily the exact same circumstances mind), that would result in another crash. I don't see the harm in preparing for such a possibility with physical measures at the front and back of each car.

 

[Tom]

I think you'll find that while any of the electronic systems could be improved, the manufacturer will certainly state that there is no substitution for the visual verification of a train's position.

The only thing I think Gerstlauer should have to answer for is the design of the trains, particularly on The Smiler, where the inversions and changes of direction are tight. There should be no way that the bar on the front should be impacted in such a way during a collision with another train.

 

[smudge]

Gerstlauer obviously wouldn't design a rollercoaster where you were unable to tell if it had stalled. So something must have happened that was completely unexpected and that they had not foreseen if (and that's a big if) the stall wasn't detected. Therefore, there could be a similar set of unforeseen circumstances (not necessarily the exact same circumstances mind), that would result in another crash. I don't see the harm in preparing for such a possibility with physical measures at the front and back of each car.

To clarify, the system/rollercoaster DID shut down because it realised a train had stalled. The train had not cleared the block so the ride stopped.

People then intervened and the ride was put into manual mode - from what we understand so far. If a process was in place like PeteB suggested, then even if the same thing happened again and the ride was sent round mistakenly, noone would be on it... Problem solved.

 

[Tarquin]

To clarify, the system/rollercoaster DID shut down because it realised a train had stalled. The train had not cleared the block so the ride stopped.

Even that's an assumption at this point to be fair. The ride certainly did stop but we've had no confirmation to say that it definitely stopped because it detected a train had stalled. The reason I say that is because the ride continued on regardless afterwards. Perhaps another fault happened at the same time, stopping the ride? The engineer might have over ridden the system, missing the stalled train, and only seeing the more minor fault that could be safely ignored. It's impossible to say for certain at this point.

 

[smudge]

Even that's an assumption at this point to be fair. The ride certainly did stop but we've had no confirmation to say that it definitely stopped because it detected a train had stalled. The reason I say that is because the ride continued on regardless afterwards. Perhaps another fault happened at the same time, stopping the ride? The engineer might have over ridden the system, missing the stalled train, and only seeing the more minor fault that could be safely ignored. It's impossible to say for certain at this point.

Regardless, the system stopped the ride.

Its not much of an assumption either, lets be honest. It's how a roller-coaster system works. Clutching at straws much.

 

[Leah]

Think so.

Isn't the whole point of a rollercoaster to make you feel in danger, to make you have the thought that you are about to fall out, isn't this the point. To give you a thrill. No matter what towers do, some people will still believe that are in danger. People will lie. "I was next to ride when it crashed" "my restraints lifted up" "towers let me on today even though it was closed to see if it is safe". I don't understand people who do this, but they will, and the media will be all over it. It's a lose-lose situation for Alton. There is NO situation where towers get off lightly, there is no way out, there is no happy ending to this story (sorry, couldn't resist)

 

[Tarquin]

Regardless, the system stopped the ride.

Its not much of an assumption either, lets be honest. It's how a roller-coaster system works. Clutching at straws much.

It is an assumption. You say that it's how a rollercoaster system works yet clearly a rollercoaster isn't supposed to crash into a stalled train either is it? Something went wrong and we don't know what it was.

Think so.

Isn't the whole point of a rollercoaster to make you feel in danger, to make you have the thought that you are about to fall out, isn't this the point. To give you a thrill. No matter what towers do, some people will still believe that are in danger. People will lie. "I was next to ride when it crashed" "my restraints lifted up" "towers let me on today even though it was closed to see if it is safe". I don't understand people who do this, but they will, and the media will be all over it. It's a lose-lose situation for Alton. There is NO situation where towers get off lightly, there is no way out, there is no happy ending to this story (sorry, couldn't resist)

The most important word there being 'feel' of course. I'm not trying to paint rollercoasters as actually being dangerous by the way. It's just previous experience has shown that when there's been terrible events such as these, even if it's been proven by the HSE that ride protocols were to blame, alterations to the train (sometimes quite drastic ones) have been made.

 

[MichelinMan]

It would pointless strengthening the cars to make them able to withstand a crash - the cost benefit just isn't worth it. In a similar manner, the front end of trains are not designed to withstand an impact - it is generally acepted if there is a collision, then the driver is a 'goner'. The effort is placed into preventing the collision in the first place, which can can be controlled.

Car collisions, on the other hand, cannot be closely controlled. Therefore more effort is put into strengthening the vehicle.

It is all about the hierarchy of risk control measures - you put more effort into preventing things occurring before needing to resort to risk mitigation measures following an incident.

On a separate matter, I just checked the Chessington site ('cos I'm staying there in 2 weeks time after my trip to AT), and I noticed the Rattlesnake is still not operational. Wonder why that is? I've never ridden that one before, and was looking forward to it. I just wonder if it is because of the number of carriages on the ride at once (lots of small wild mouse type cars), and they have found the block brake system is deficient for the number of cars on ride?

 

[Leah]

Your not missing much. Standard wild mouse with badly decaying theming and really dirty Windows that practically everyone has written there names on. I'd be surprised if you have any non-broken ribs after.

If it's open though, I'd still go on it

 

[Coaster]

Your not missing much. Standard wild mouse with badly decaying theming and really dirty Windows that practically everyone has written there names on. I'd be surprised if you have any non-broken ribs after.

If it's open though, I'd still go on it

Rattlesnake is not rough.

 

[Leah]

Depends, if your Sat in one of the rows next to either...

1. Someone much bigger that you
2. Alone

Then yes... it hurts.

 

[XXBENNXX]

Rattlesnake is no bpb wild mouse, but it is very rough, that final brake can knock you windless.

 

[DiogoJ42]

Bless.

 

[spinba11]

One of the changes on Sonic is when sending empty cars round it's done one at a time and every staff member keeps their eyes on it until it gets to the end.

 

[Coaster]

Rattlesnake is no bpb wild mouse, but it is very rough, that final brake can knock you windless.

BPB's Wild Mouse isn't rough either, it's raucous!
The final brake run on Rattlesnake is the only section that is even verging on rough IMO, the rest of it runs smoothly although you do get thrown about a bit, but it would be boring if it was completely smooth.

 

[AliceHL91]

Rattlesnake is no bpb wild mouse, but it is very rough, that final brake can knock you windless.

BPB Wild mouse! My arch nemesis. Migraine, neck and backache guaranteed! A good laugh though.
@Leah if you ever go to pleasure beach avoid this ride at all costs!