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Incident on The Smiler 02/06/2015

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Bantanium said:
The accident over all makes me shiver, the screams, the malfunction, CSI Cyber and the theories. I have one which probably is just nope but here it is. Could The Smiler been hacked, as in the systems that run it? Probably not but I'm really curious :eek:
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If you look closely at the track, you'll notice it is made of triangles...
illuminati-confirmed.png
 
My opinion is that a computer error has messed with the block brakes and that pure human error/negligence has let the 16 people round the track not knowing the empty one had stalled
 
Yalnix said:
I think this show how British media over exaggerates everything. Is it seriously going to effect park reputation... No. Are people not going to ride The Smiler... No. Are all theme parks now dangerous and could kill us without warning... No. By that logic the millions of people who take a plane are going to get fatally injured.

People are still riding the Runaway Mine Train, and it was a more unfortunate accident than this, In the grand scheme of things as insensitive as it may sound... No one lost their life. The people riding were unfortunately very lucky indeed.
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I think you're underestimating the short - medium term effects of this. This has been a big story and to be fair, I'd struggle to think of another accident as serious as this, since 1994 - and that wasn't as big a deal because of the way news was reported back then and with the general lack of social media. Also, since then, Alton Towers has created a formidable reputation as the UK's favourite park and more importantly, it has one of the best safety records in the business. I've seen bad operations at a lot of parks with operators chancing things, but never at Alton.

I think the core damage to the park's reputation will be done in the educational sector, in the short term. I think schools may find it a hard sell to nervy parents.

Quetzal said:
So much of that long post is wrong, blocks aren't 'timed', merely cleared
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On most coasters, blocks have timings associated with them. If a block should be cleared in 43 seconds there is a safety window of 41 - 45 seconds, for instance. If the train doesn't arrive at the next block within that window, the train has potentially stalled, is overloaded, weather is adversely affecting the ride vehicle etc. That's one of the key problems that the Pleasure Beach have with Big One in the wind, it runs too slowly and spends too much time in C block.

Kurtis Rogers said:
My opinion is that a computer error has messed with the block brakes and that pure human error/negligence has let the 16 people round the track not knowing the empty one had stalled[/QUOTE
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You need manual/maintenance modes to check various elements of the control surfaces on the ride, whether those be tyre drives, lifts, brakes etc. It is up to the park/manufacturer to determine under what circumstances such a mode can be used and by who (does the ride need to be locked out, do all trains need to be empty, can you only use the mode with a single vehicle on he track, etc).

For example - you have to fit a new brake fin, or a new lift chain. The way to test the replaced part is not to send a train round, you need to operate the device independently. Manual block mode could also be used potentially after a break down.
 
Does anyone know if Gerstlauer themselves have been at the park today? I would be quite surprised (and appalled) if they haven't to be honest.
 
When I did the lift hill walk we spotted a cam on the lift looking at the ground (I'm guessing that due to the movement of the lift at the trains went by the cam kept moving) and it was nicknamed the grass cam (cam 05 on the top screen)
 
Jamie said:
Does anyone know if Gerstlauer themselves have been at the park today? I would be quite surprised (and appalled) if they haven't to be honest.
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Perhaps not today, but I think it's safe to say they'll have someone on site alongside the investigation soon.
 
Judging by the majority of comments in this thread you'd think the world's media or Facebook users caused the accident.

Regarding the Media - Maybe we can all now look cautiously at the information we are fed about ANY news story given the inaccuracies in this one which of course we all have pretty indepth topic knowledge of.

Regarding the Facebook users asking 'When will the park be open' What do you expect them to do if they have forked out shedloads of money for tickets/hotels/ travel plans? They are bound to enquire, this doesn't make them heartless idiots.

Regarding the rebranding of Airlines (which in itself is stretching the comparison gauge on relevance to the max) it might be worth noting the Singapore airlines are going through as massive rebranding operation after the Two recent crashes (one of which was not their fault technically.)

I think New trains would be a good way to go, they will have to buy more anyway. It will be a very visible way to show that changes have been made and cost effective.
 
I think it would leave a bad taste in the mouths of the public to see the same trains merely repaired and reinstalled. Besides, if a retheme or rebranding does occur, they will probably need to go anyway.
 
TomLad said:
But then taking the airline example, they don't rebrand do they? Taking both the major accidents of Air France (Rio to Paris) or the recent German Wings crash, one human 'error' and the other mechanical/software failure. Two high profile companies, very safe industry and people are still going to use them and realise that things are perfectly okay for 99.9% of the time. Yes, googling both comes up with their respective incidents, but I recently read on the internet (dangerous, I know) that google favours negative results as it drives clicks and ad revenue. The nature of the beast really. After two years of aggressive advertising, a rebrand would damage their reputation when people think they are coving up. Especially as everyone knows about 'The Smiler and its 14 loops, more loops than any other!' I think in this situation they can only find the cause and keep their heads held high about the professionalism that we saw in handling the worst.
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Germanwings is rebranding as Eurowings...
 
Harvey. said:
I think it would leave a bad taste in the mouths of the public to see the same trains merely repaired and reinstalled. Besides, if a retheme or rebranding does occur, they will probably need to go anyway.
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I honestly don't see why this would be an issue. Much worse incidents have happened where vehicles have crashed then been salvaged and re-used. I don't think the average person has a level of interest great enough that they would pay attention to exactly which trains were going into service.

Anyway, once repairs and refurbishments have taken place, there may be no way to tell whether they're the same trains or replacements with the same numbers. If they chose to reuse the damaged trains, I doubt that Alton would give any indication of the fact.
 
Croftybaby said:
Regarding the Facebook users asking 'When will the park be open' What do you expect them to do if they have forked out shedloads of money for tickets/hotels/ travel plans? They are bound to enquire, this doesn't make them heartless idiots.
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No, it doesn't make them heartless, but when Alton Towers are giving the same response over and over it seems a bit silly to keep asking.

I'm sure the park will let everybody know when the place will reopen.
 
I've held off posting for a couple of days to stand back and assess the situation.

First of all, my thoughts are with the injured, who I hope will make faster and better recoveries than reported in the press.

I believe that rollercoaster are statistically incredibly safe and that knee jerk reactions to ban them from keyboard warriors on the Daily Mails news feed are hypocritical. In many cases these same keyboard warriors who want to ban things that OTHER PEOPLE enjoy will be smoking as they write their replies. Many of them will exceed speed limits on public roads or consume alcohol in excessive quantities. The fact is that NOTHING in life is completely without risk.

As a responsible adult, I have the right to make my own decisions about risk and reward. Within this however, I do have a right to expect that all reasonable steps are taken to ensure that any activity I partake in is as safe as possible.

Out of the tens of millions of people who have visited AT over the last 35 years, the proportion of people injured is miniscule and the number of people killed is zero. I would be more likely to be electrocuted cutting my lawn that being hurt at AT.

This is an awful accident, but every crash in aviation makes future flights safer as lessons are learned, flaws are re engineered and procedures improved.

Let the professionals do there job, conduct a full investigation, publish their findings, make appropriate changes and have EVEN SAFER theme parks as a result.

Although I disagree with Nick Varney about the minimum wage which I think should be higher I think he is handling this situation brilliantly and that he genuinely sympathises for the victims.

If JW is reading this, I hope he feels the warmth from these pages. I know his name is often attached to these projects, but I also know that he is consulted on theming and layout. He is not a designer of PLC systems or a structural engineer. I hope the gutter press have not been knocking on his door.

So I want to say a big thank you to the team at AT for the huge number of fun and safe days that I have had. This applies to the staff on minimum wage; the design team, JW, everybody.

AT, you have my support and I will be back when your investigation is complete
 
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Sam said:
Four teenagers lives have possibly been ruined permanently due to this park's negligence. Whether it's human error or down to the shoddy manufacturer they chose to get the ride on the cheap, it makes no difference - the park have been negligent. It is impossible to think of any way that this accident could have happened that doesn't lead to this conclusion. The outpouring of sympathy and defence for the theme park over this incident - rather than the condemnation they deserve - is truly shocking.
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It is too early to state with any certainty that the theme park was negligent in this accident - I suggest such categorical statements could lead you open for litigation!

They are highly likely to be found to be negligent - but it could be down to faulty computers/electronic systems supplied by a 3rd party that is the fault. In which case it might not be the theme park's fault - it would then come down to factors such as how the systems were maintained, were the systems designed to a Merlin specification etc.

Personally, I would be surprised if it was purely down to failure of control systems - the system will almost certainly need to be a safety instrumented system, which tends to have high levels of reliability and redundancy. From my experience, such systems tend not to fail completely - they are designed to tolerate failures of individual components without compromising the integrity of the whole system - human error is more usually the cause.

But you are right - the amount of defence and sympathy for the theme park is surprising on here.Won't put me off going in a few weeks time though. Ironically, the safety performance of companies after big incidents like this improves dramatically.
 
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