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Merlin Interested in Purchasing Busch Gardens Theme Parks?

MakoMania said:
Just as a final thing, SeaWorld is not currently in danger of falling off a financial cliff, the SeaWorld branded parks have taken some substantial hits mainly due to innacurate reporting but they do seem to be stabilising a bit now. They are still very profitable, just not as profitable as they were a few years ago.
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I feel like I'm probably getting into this with the wrong person (something leads me to suspect you are a big supporter of Seaworld), but surely the brand is now irrepairably damaged? The park will hopefully survive and adapt, but 'inaccurate reporting' or otherwise, events conspired to reveal a huge, er, sea change in public taste and ethics over the past few decades. Yes, Seaworld still makes money, but the upkeep involved in the parks is huge, and in Orlando, they are evidently struggling to keep up with the Wizard-and-Mouse game happening up either end of the road. Even if the worst of the coverage has faded into memory, they are still admist a serious identity crisis in a seriously competitive market.
 
Plastic Person said:
I feel like I'm probably getting into this with the wrong person (something leads me to suspect you are a big supporter of Seaworld), but surely the brand is now irrepairably damaged? The park will hopefully survive and adapt, but 'inaccurate reporting' or otherwise, events conspired to reveal a huge, er, sea change in public taste and ethics over the past few decades. Yes, Seaworld still makes money, but the upkeep involved in the parks is huge, and in Orlando, they are evidently struggling to keep up with the Wizard-and-Mouse game happening up either end of the road. Even if the worst of the coverage has faded into memory, they are still admist a serious identity crisis in a seriously competitive market.
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I know we are getting wildly off topic but I think you've hit the nail on the head there (almost).

Universal & Disney have made it quite clear that they will be taking the largest share of destination market guests in Florida, SeaWorld realise this and so they are beginning what will be a painful transitional phase to become more of a high end reigonal park. Not everyone can afford to pay Universal & Disney prices, so there is definitely an opportunity for SeaWorld to expand, just not in the same way that the other Orlando parks have.

The SeaWorld brand is damaged, but I don't think it is irrepairable. At the same time the park can't just give in to what the activists are demanding as it is based on emotion and fantasy rather than science and would harm the welfare of the Orcas. The park is talking less about its Killer Whales and more about its rides, animal rescue operations and other less controversial animals such as Dolphins & Penguins. If SeaWorld can establish itself as a brand that helps the ocean (which it does in many different ways) and pairs that with an increased emphasis on rides and up-close animal encounters, they could be onto a winner. After all, if the Brazilian market hadn't collapsed, SeaWorld would have had great attendance increases in 2016 as domestic attendance was up significantly due to the opening of Mako.
 
@MakoMania, I know you're the ultimate fanboy, but I think you're painting a pretty rosy picture here.

Here's an interesting read from Fool.com - he's a very smart guy and watches each of the industry giants very carefully.

I imagine the Department of Justice action just announced won't help matters either. You can buy stock with the money you find behind your couch at the moment, it slipped again after the investigation was announced.

We posted at the same time - I agree with some of what you have said, but not all. I do think the Florida operations are facing the same issues that other non-Disney/Universal operators (including Merlin) are facing. If someone is going to Florida, there are fewer and fewer reasons to stay off Disney/Universal property which I think makes it harder to get people to go and spend money with the other operators (inc. Legoland). If I am at Disney for ten days, in a resort with the dining plan,

I think the focus on rides could harm them further if they're not smart about it, because they're going to end up competing with themselves (or Merlin :eek:) with Busch and will end pushing away people that would choose to visit because they did want a break from the rides.

On the attendance point, I believe the Brazillian issue was a blow to them, but it did happen and they didn't seem to deal with it particularly well.
 
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Rick said:
@MakoMania, I know you're the ultimate fanboy, but I think you're painting a pretty rosy picture here.

Here's an interesting read from Fool.com - he's a very smart guy and watches each of the industry giants very carefully.

I imagine the Department of Justice action just announced won't help matters either. You can buy stock with the money you find behind your couch at the moment, it slipped again after the investigation was announced.
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I agree with nearly everything in that article. Ocean Explorer was good overall, but Submarine Quest was in all honesty abysmal :p If SeaWorld San Diego doesn't grow in 2018 with Electric Eel I will give up all hope on SeaWorld!

I have done a couple of summer's work experience with animals in the parks so I don't know if I'm really a fanboy or not. I guess I'm half fanboy and half an actual part of things. My interest in SeaWorld stems from a wider interest in marine biology though, so I guess it comes naturally.
 
Rick said:
@MakoMania It's refreshing to debate with someone who is so enamoured with a park, but still sees it for what it is and is enthusiastic about it. We should have you stuffed.
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Thank you, I don't often get to agree much in SeaWorld threads :p *

2018 should be all fun & games with this investor lawsuit that seems to be dragging out forever and increased competition from Universal & Disney as per usual. $10 share price anyone?

Infinity Falls will be awesome though.

*I just remembered this isn't a SeaWorld thread, we should probably get back on topic........
 
Rick said:
@Dave If it was to keep the company solvent that doesn't sound like an overreaction to me! Being solvent is fairly crucial.

It's fair to say that they've had more than their fair share of stuff to deal with. There aren't many backlashes like this in corporate history. One so big that the company's solution to it is to remove their signature offering that is basically the reason they are what they are in the first place.
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It's fine if the decisions being made are not short sighted.

And Mako i respect your passion for the company but tempesto has been widely criticised by fans of the park, the CEO himself talks about the cuts and operations and events/ shows have been reduced. You have a distinct inability to see any criticism of Seaworld.

As for the Florida effect I don't think you can blame fully the Mouse or Universal. The Orlando tourist area by far as more guests in villas than on either resort (and universal resort is incredibly close to SEA, Varneys wheel of fortune V2 and the bus service to Lego). The parks are just not competing with the heavy hitters, you could argue they can't but certainly Merlin is a bigger organisation than Universals theme park atm but it is also very risk averse.

SEA was hit badly with blackfish but it had plenty of warning public opinion was starting to float that way (dolphin shows used to be a staple of theme parks but most got rid long before blackfish, partly due to cost but also due to PR).

To me Merlin operate very similar to SEA, so I would expect a similar slow decline if they took over the parks.
 
Dave said:
As for the Florida effect I don't think you can blame fully the Mouse or Universal. The Orlando tourist area by far as more guests in villas than on either resort (and universal resort is incredibly close to SEA, Varneys wheel of fortune V2 and the bus service to Lego). The parks are just not competing with the heavy hitters, you could argue they can't but certainly Merlin is a bigger organisation than Universals theme park atm but it is also very risk averse.
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It's perhaps not the full reason, I agree - but it's such an important factor. Even if you are staying in a villa, the ticketing deals mean that it's much hard to see everything at a price that makes sense versus giving the rat your credit card and not worrying about anything for two weeks. Disney's plan is seemingly to grow to a point where your holiday can be spent almost entirely with them and it seems to be working pretty well. Universal are on the attack with the wizard, though.

I can't imagine it will get any easier, with Star Wars and Toy Story on the horizon.

Dave said:
The parks are just not competing with the heavy hitters, you could argue they can't but certainly Merlin is a bigger organisation than Universals theme park atm but it is also very risk averse.
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Merlin as an organisation is larger than UPR but that's largely irrelevant given Merlin's relatively small footprint in the Orlando market (not to mention that UPR is owned by NBC Universal). This is why I think they will seek to pick up Busch. At the moment, the fact that they own a bunch of aquariums on the other side of the world doesn't help them compete in the Florida market.
 
Dave said:
It's fine if the decisions being made are not short sighted.

And Mako i respect your passion for the company but tempesto has been widely criticised by fans of the park, the CEO himself talks about the cuts and operations and events/ shows have been reduced. You have a distinct inability to see any criticism of Seaworld.

As for the Florida effect I don't think you can blame fully the Mouse or Universal. The Orlando tourist area by far as more guests in villas than on either resort (and universal resort is incredibly close to SEA, Varneys wheel of fortune V2 and the bus service to Lego). The parks are just not competing with the heavy hitters, you could argue they can't but certainly Merlin is a bigger organisation than Universals theme park atm but it is also very risk averse.

SEA was hit badly with blackfish but it had plenty of warning public opinion was starting to float that way (dolphin shows used to be a staple of theme parks but most got rid long before blackfish, partly due to cost but also due to PR).

To me Merlin operate very similar to SEA, so I would expect a similar slow decline if they took over the parks.
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I can see that SeaWorld has its flaws, I've seen them with my own eyes and I have named them myself in the past. One of the things that bugs me the most is the 2 SBNO rides in Tampa, but considering Merlin's record on SBNO attractions at Heide Park and Alton Towers, I doubt they would be in a rush to increase the ride offering.

Joel Manby has never talked about cuts to events, this would be the complete opposite of the current strategy! We have seen some cuts to park hours in areas like San Diego, but this has been compensated for by increases at other parks. For example, last year SeaWorld Orlando operated 9am-8:30pm during most summer days, this year it was 9am-10pm every day.

I would also disagree that Tempesto has been "widely" criticised. Sure, it has had some ciriticism that it is a clone and its placement in the park is slightly odd, but on the other hand it has decent theming and there is no other ride like it in the park so it helps to round out the lineup.

As for Dolphin shows, they are still one of the most popular offerings in the park and have attracted very little criticism. Facilities like Georgia Aquarium offer Dolphin shows and are enjoying record attendance levels, I don't think this has much to do with SeaWorld's problems.
 
This is quite interesting from Manby:

One place Manby said the company can save money is in the amount of theming in rides, particularly in its more regional parks outside of Orlando.

"One thing I'm pleased with on capital, we are spending less in 2017 than we did in 2016, and we're introducing significantly more attractions," Manby said. "One way to do that is to focus more on the ride itself and not too much on the theming."

He pointed to the recently opened Mako roller coaster as "a good mix of how much theming should go with it." Much of Mako's theming is in the queue, where people see videos of mako sharks, and at the exit, with a mural painted by conservationist Guy Harvey.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/tourism/os-seaworld-q3-earnings-20161108-story.html
 
Mako has great theming, although Infinity Falls will have more :)

I think he was mainly referencing the shambles that was Antarctica, the theming spend on that area was immense! Same goes for the $50 million Discovery Point that opened in 2016.
 
Tempesto at BGW was hardly an inspiring addition but to be fair to the park I can see why they made it. Verbolten was not as successful as they had hoped in terms of increasing guest numbers but come 2015 the park were not quite due another major coaster. The budget was smaller but they wanted a high impact ride with a small footprint. So they went with Tempesto knowing that they could market a new coaster better than they could market a thrill flat ride (although the less said about their denial of its existence even when fully constructed the better). I actually think they did a decent job with the ride, it's just a shame that it is so close to Apollo's Chariot.

Going back a bit to cutting events at BGW, pretty sure I am right in saying that IllumiNights was discontinued a few years ago which is a shame.

:)
 
Merlin (and others) have approached SeaWorld about purchasing "part" of the company.

Whilst the concept of buying Busch Gardens from SeaWorld isn't new (Six Flags have been trying to do it for ages), this is the first time that Merlin have come into the equation as far as I know.

Ball is in SeaWorld's court........
 
And how long until the overly dark forbidding sinister themes come into play on new rides? I shudder at the thought of Merlin getting hold of Busch Williamsburg.....

:(
 
Apparently SeaWorld would rather see the whole company bought rather than just part of the company (i.e. just the Busch parks).

:)
 
matthewgcole said:
I can't imagine the tarnished Sea World brand would go for much. Steal for Merlin perhaps?
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Considering it is a tarnished brand, if Merlin did buy Sea World I wonder would they rebrand it with the Sea Life brand.

To be honest I don't really want Merlin buy any more parks they should stick to Midway attractions...
 
Give it another decade and Merlin will own Cedar Fair, and have their eye on Six Flags.

... Whats that line in the bible about how the antichrist will be welcomed ar first, and people won't even know until it's too late?
 
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