Paultons Park: General Discussion

[Themepark-newbie]

Yes, you are absolutely right.

However, with the quotes from the Director I would be really surprised if it is charged for. With the exception of that sentence, the whole article is geared at how thry can overcome social distancing in a queue line.

Time will tell!

 

[Enter Valhalla]

The classic fast track debate.

I’ll throw my two cents in. I used to be, like most enthusiasts very anti-fastrack, however my opinion has gradually changed and I believe that a well implemented fastrack system (believe me I’ve seen many) can have a very positive effect on guest experience.

Enthusiasts tend to visit the parks more regularly and therefore consider fastrack ticket holders an inconvenience. Keep in mind though that many guests only get the opportunity to visit the parks once in a blue moon and therefore welcome such systems and would actually be disappointed if such systems didn’t exist.

I know that my recent visits to Universal Studios Japan would have been a very different experience if there was no option of paid fastrack. I would have literally only got on about 3 or 4 rides in a 12 hour day. I knew that my one day at the park would be my only opportunity to visit, possibly ever in my life, so fastrack is a no-brainer. As I say, like many people, I would have been very disappointed if a fast track system had not existed.

 

[speedy]

The classic fast track debate.

I’ll throw my two cents in. I used to be, like most enthusiasts very anti-fastrack, however my opinion has gradually changed and I believe that a well implemented fastrack system (believe me I’ve seen many) can have a very positive effect on guest experience.

Enthusiasts tend to visit the parks more regularly and therefore consider fastrack ticket holders an inconvenience. Keep in mind though that many guests only get the opportunity to visit the parks once in a blue moon and therefore welcome such systems and would actually be disappointed if such systems didn’t exist.

I know that my recent visits to Universal Studios Japan would have been a very different experience if there was no option of paid fastrack. I would have literally only got on about 3 or 4 rides in a 12 hour day. I knew that my one day at the park would be my only opportunity to visit, possibly ever in my life, so fastrack is a no-brainer. As I say, like many people, I would have been very disappointed if a fast track system had not existed.

If the average guest needs fast track to ride everything and avoid disappointment, there aren't enough rides or throughput is too slow. If fasttrack is needed to have a good experience, everybody ought to have one. If everyone has one, it just doesn't work. It's an unfair system that discourages good operations.

 

[jon81uk]

The classic fast track debate.


I know that my recent visits to Universal Studios Japan would have been a very different experience if there was no option of paid fastrack. I would have literally only got on about 3 or 4 rides in a 12 hour day. I knew that my one day at the park would be my only opportunity to visit, possibly ever in my life, so fastrack is a no-brainer. As I say, like many people, I would have been very disappointed if a fast track system had not existed.

But you don't actually know in that example how many rides you would have got on if no-one has fast-track and the park was 100% standby. The queues are only longer for a majority because a minority have paid to go quicker.

 

[MakoMania]

The Smiler is a good example of this. Even with the removal of the baggage hold the ride is operated reasonably well most of the time, yet despite this the queue moves at a painfully slow pace due to excessive takeaway of capacity from the main queue by fastrack & RAP. I know RAP is a different issue and while there are concerns about that, fastrack allocation on The Smiler is simply too high.

The single rider queue is a godsend on this ride, but I expect we can kiss goodbye to that for now at least.

 

[RicketyCricket]

Fasttrack is the worst thing about theme parks.

Reluctantly paid $100 for it at Cedar Point and still had to wait an hour each time for Steel Vengeance.

This is why Europa Park is so well reviewed. Every guest is equal.

 

[Themeparksandy1981]

When I went to Paultons Park in 2014 the only areas in the park that were busy was all the Peppa pig rides the rest of the park was minimum. Even my friend took his kids last year and he said only Peppa area was very busy

 

[John]

Fasttrack is the worst thing about theme parks.

Reluctantly paid $100 for it at Cedar Point and still had to wait an hour each time for Steel Vengeance.

This is why Europa Park is so well reviewed. Every guest is equal.

Absolutely. Cedar Point is great but fastrack there is utterly out of control on busy days now. We had it on one of our 2 days in 2018 (because you basically have to unless you're there a week). Maverick was running 50% FT with a 3-figure main queue and a fastrack queue typically around 30 minutes whilst SV's was typically 45+ (still beats the multiple hour main queue). Then they have the audacity to say in the marketing for fast lane that "the only thing limited about it is how many we sell". Really? Where's the limit then?

 

[Islander]

This is why Europa Park is so well reviewed. Every guest is equal.

Don't let it be forgotten that EP themselves trialled paid Fasttrack a few years back. Luckily it disappeared very quickly, so either the revenue wasn't there, or more likely the Macks realised the detrimental effect it had.

 

[Tim]

Before using EP as an example of why parks are better of without fastrack i think its worth remembering that EPs operations are second to none.
Parks like Thorpe Park and Cedar Point that have really big fastrack issues would still have terrible queues even without them.
Case in point I made really good use of Universals fastrack when in Florida and never saw more than a few people ahead of me in the queue. This is an example of the system working well as the main queue was barely affected. However I then tried using it for Halloween Horror Nights and found it was essential as it turned a 3 hour queue into 45 minutes. Completely ridiculous that you had to pay for a reasonable queue time but it wasn't the fastrack that was the problem but the events insane capacity issues.
I make this point because fastrack (or more accurately virtual queuing) has a good idea at it's core which is taking people out of queues. Now is a perfect time to experiment with this, not only because it helps with isolation but also the reduced park capacity gives it a much better chance of actually working.
And if they do charge for it, maybe look at it as supporting a park you like through these tough times.

 

[Enter Valhalla]

But you don't actually know in that example how many rides you would have got on if no-one has fast-track and the park was 100% standby. The queues are only longer for a majority because a minority have paid to go quicker.

You say that, but it isn’t just operations that mean you need to buy fast track in some scenarios.

When I went to one particular park a few years back, the place was rammed with school trips. These school kids were noisy, boisterous and badly behaved. Queuing alongside them was a horrible experience.

This was not the park’s fault, the operations were good but the type of guests in the park slowed down the park’s operations efforts and made standing in the queues a massive headache.

We purchased fast track that day and, again, this turned what would have been a horrible day into a good one. This was in no way the park’s fault nor was it our fault as we didn’t know that the park was going to be full of school trips, neither would your average guest have known this.

I get what people are saying, but this is an enthusiast argument. I used to hate fastrack, but there are genuinely some situations where it is beneficial for guest experience and the where the parks would receive more complaints if fastrack wasn’t available.

 

[speedy]

You say that, but it isn’t just operations that mean you need to buy fast track in some scenarios.

When I went to one particular park a few years back, the place was rammed with school trips. These school kids were noisy, boisterous and badly behaved. Queuing alongside them was a horrible experience.

This was not the park’s fault, the operations were good but the type of guests in the park slowed down the park’s operations efforts and made standing in the queues a massive headache.

We purchased fast track that day and, again, this turned what would have been a horrible day into a good one. This was in no way the park’s fault nor was it our fault as we didn’t know that the park was going to be full of school trips, neither would your average guest have known this.

I get what people are saying, but this is an enthusiast argument. I used to hate fastrack, but there are genuinely some situations where it is beneficial for guest experience and the where the parks would receive more complaints if fastrack wasn’t available.

It was the parks fault for booking so many school trips in at the same time! And you say fast track is beneficial to the guest experience when in reality it was beneficial to your experience, while making the queue longer for everyone else. The "average park guest" argument is nonsense, if every "average park guest" purchased fast track, we would be back to square one.

 

[jon81uk]

You say that, but it isn’t just operations that mean you need to buy fast track in some scenarios.

When I went to one particular park a few years back, the place was rammed with school trips. These school kids were noisy, boisterous and badly behaved. Queuing alongside them was a horrible experience.

This was not the park’s fault, the operations were good but the type of guests in the park slowed down the park’s operations efforts and made standing in the queues a massive headache.

We purchased fast track that day and, again, this turned what would have been a horrible day into a good one. This was in no way the park’s fault nor was it our fault as we didn’t know that the park was going to be full of school trips, neither would your average guest have known this.

I get what people are saying, but this is an enthusiast argument. I used to hate fastrack, but there are genuinely some situations where it is beneficial for guest experience and the where the parks would receive more complaints if fastrack wasn’t available.

You miss the point.
If you get to go in front of someone else by paying for it, the queue gets slower for everyone else. Therefore if you see an hour long queue with fasttrack operating, you don't know how long the wait might be without it.

Yes in your example the school trip kids are frustrating but if there was no option of fast track I don't think people would be complaining about the fact they are prevented from spending more money to go in front of the school group. I don't expect Paultons Park are currently getting complaints that there is no fast track option.
As a side note following on from the Drayton Manor incident I would hope any schools are now better supervising groups anyway.

 

[Enter Valhalla]

You miss the point.
If you get to go in front of someone else by paying for it, the queue gets slower for everyone else. Therefore if you see an hour long queue with fasttrack operating, you don't know how long the wait might be without it.

Yes in your example the school trip kids are frustrating but if there was no option of fast track I don't think people would be complaining about the fact they are prevented from spending more money to go in front of the school group. I don't expect Paultons Park are currently getting complaints that there is no fast track option.
As a side note following on from the Drayton Manor incident I would hope any schools are now better supervising groups anyway.

I’m not missing the point at all.

Obviously fast track slows down the main queue and I’m not even commenting on if it’s a fair or unfair system. That’s a matter of opinion.

I am simply pointing out that that, whilst most enthusiasts assume that fastrack has a negative effect on guest experience and that everyone thinks the same, it’s not uncommon for enthusiast opinions to differ to those of the majority of the general public.

The park which I mentioned which was full of school trips, it felt like on the day we visited at least 90% of customers were school groups. We purchased all day fastrack at a very reasonable price and very few people were using fastrack. If everyone was in the main queue, it would have still been a very unpleasant experience. By having the fastrack option, we left the park far more satisfied than if we’d had to queue with badly behaved school groups all day.

At parks all over the world, I hear guest enquire if a fastrack system exists and many would be disappointing if the answer was no. Different people have different expectations when they visit parks and to say that fastrack is never well implemented and that it always negatively affects guest experience simply isn’t true in all cases.

I try to avoid buying it wherever possible but there have been some parks abroad where I’ve only had one opportunity to visit, in these situations fastrack has been very welcomed and I honestly don’t think that removing the system would actually have shortened the main queues by that much. Obviously for parks in the U.K. which I can visit regularly, I don’t even consider buying fastrack, but not everyone has the luxury of being able to return frequently. And obviously there’s many international parks where I don’t have this luxury.

 

[jon81uk]

I’m not missing the point at all.

Obviously fast track slows down the main queue and I’m not even commenting on if it’s a fair or unfair system. That’s a matter of opinion.

I am simply pointing out that that, whilst most enthusiasts assume that fastrack has a negative effect on guest experience and that everyone thinks the same, it’s not uncommon for enthusiast opinions to differ to those of the majority of the general public.

My original response was to your experience of Universal Japan, where you claimed that without fast track you would only have got 3-4 rides done. But you have no way of knowing how many rides you would have done if there was no fast-track at all causing the regular queue to slow down. That's the point that was missed. its not to do with the opinion on fast track, just that you don't know you don't know what it could have been like at USJ if there was regular queues only.

I do agree that many people who don't visit often find Fast-track a good service and like using it. Or they find at some parks (Thorpe especially) it is oversold and you have a miserable day without it.

 

[Enter Valhalla]

My original response was to your experience of Universal Japan, where you claimed that without fast track you would only have got 3-4 rides done. But you have no way of knowing how many rides you would have done if there was no fast-track at all causing the regular queue to slow down. That's the point that was missed. its not to do with the opinion on fast track, just that you don't know you don't know what it could have been like at USJ if there was regular queues only.

I do agree that many people who don't visit often find Fast-track a good service and like using it. Or they find at some parks (Thorpe especially) it is oversold and you have a miserable day without it.

Obviously I don’t know the exact number of rides I’d have got on if fastrack hadn’t been available but it’s not fair to say that I have missed the point.

I can still have a fair idea of how much of an impact fastrack had on the length of the main queues. At USJ, the system was being implemented fairly. Express queues were all less than 10 minutes due to the allocation of Express being very low and the number of seats on each ride being allocated to Express pass holders can’t have been more than about 10% (less in many cases). On the day I visited, main queues for major rides ranged from 60 minutes to 210 minutes. You can’t honestly be trying to tell me that, even if fastrack has not existed, I’d have got on more than a handful of rides. I only had one day available to visit the park and would have been very disappointed if I’d visited and not been able to get on half the rides. Even with an Express pass, I missed out on some rides, but left feeling a lot more satisfied than I would have done if no fastrack system had existed.

You can easily see what impact fastrack is having on main queues by looking at how many of the seats are allocated to fastrack ticket holders. This is something which I am fully aware of.

 

[speedy]

Obviously I don’t know the exact number of rides I’d have got on if fastrack hadn’t been available but it’s not fair to say that I have missed the point.

I can still have a fair idea of how much of an impact fastrack had on the length of the main queues. At USJ, the system was being implemented fairly. Express queues were all less than 10 minutes due to the allocation of Express being very low and the number of seats on each ride being allocated to Express pass holders can’t have been more than about 10% (less in many cases). On the day I visited, main queues for major rides ranged from 60 minutes to 210 minutes. You can’t honestly be trying to tell me that, even if fastrack has not existed, I’d have got on more than a handful of rides. I only had one day available to visit the park and would have been very disappointed if I’d visited and not been able to get on half the rides. Even with an Express pass, I missed out on some rides, but left feeling a lot more satisfied than I would have done if no fastrack system had existed.

You can easily see what impact fastrack is having on main queues by looking at how many of the seats are allocated to fastrack ticket holders. This is something which I am fully aware of.

I can't comment on the fast track queues vs the regular queues as I wasn't there. However even if the time impact is minimal, seeing other people pay to use a pass and skip ahead of you has a negative impact. I disagree that fast passes have a positive impact on the experience for the majority of guests.

 

[RicketyCricket]

Absolutely. Cedar Point is great but fastrack there is utterly out of control on busy days now. We had it on one of our 2 days in 2018 (because you basically have to unless you're there a week). Maverick was running 50% FT with a 3-figure main queue and a fastrack queue typically around 30 minutes whilst SV's was typically 45+ (still beats the multiple hour main queue). Then they have the audacity to say in the marketing for fast lane that "the only thing limited about it is how many we sell". Really? Where's the limit then?

It really wound me up tbh.

Had a great visit because... Well it's Cedar Point. But left there feeling pretty ripped off.

 

[Enter Valhalla]

I can't comment on the fast track queues vs the regular queues as I wasn't there. However even if the time impact is minimal, seeing other people pay to use a pass and skip ahead of you has a negative impact. I disagree that fast passes have a positive impact on the experience for the majority of guests.

Like I keep saying, a well implemented fastrack system can have a positive effect on guest experience.

In some parks, fastrack queues are basically next to the main queues and people literally jump on to the ride ahead of those in the main queue. This of course is very bad for perception and I agree is not good for guest experience.

However a well implemented fastrack system involves smaller allocation of fastrack and the type of batching or merge system that allows fastrack ticket holders to merge on to the ride platforms or into the queues without guests in the main queues even noticing, let alone being put out by it.

Believe me I have seen both types of system and many which are somewhere in between. I never said that fastrack has a positive effect on the majority of guests. However I believe that a well implemented fastrack system has a positive effect on the guests who use it and very little effect and those waiting in the main queue. With a well implemented system like I saw at USJ, the vast majority people in the main queue barely even noticed that fastrack ticket holders were being merged in. The effect in the queue time, as mentioned before, was also minimal as the allocation was low.

 

[John]

So basically as long as it's priced high enough that the peasants don't buy it. At USJ it was something like £88 for one-time access to 4 rides back in 2016. We didn't bother but still got round everything we wanted to in a day thanks to the SRQs (which were largely ignored by the locals) - only thing we didn't do was minions as the queue time was 300 min at one point.