Nemesis: Sub-Terra

[Rob]

Ultimately we do not know. There are indications that it could be, but no one can say for sure if it is or is not re-opening. Good cases could be made for both scenarios, and I think on current evidence I'm leaning slightly towards the possibility of it re-opening next year.

 

[Benjsh]

With the HH being the big project for next year maybe they would hold it back for 2024 with the Nemesis re-opening.

 

[James]

I feel it's more likely to reopen, the activity around the ride is more heightened than in previous years and it would fill a gap in the line-up in Forbidden Valley next year. I imagine it would be a relatively cheap addition to the ride line-up, it's an existing building with existing hardware and theming. It has been SBNO for so long now that it will be easy to market as a brand new ride, as most of the GP will have forgotten its existence.

Besides all that, there have been various hints by different fan sites and people 'in the know' that something is happening to Sub-Terra, so I would certainly lean more towards it reopening next season.

 

[QTXAdsy]

If we have Sub Terra returning as is the return of HH, I could see Towers marketing the opening of two 'new' attractions for 2023, makes up for the loss of Nemesis.

I know some say that Joe public will know that's not strictly true, but then again considering how extensive HH's overhaul will be and with any Sub Terra plot being different due to Nemesis being out of action, you could honestly make the argument by the time they return, they will be pretty much new regardless.

 

[Danscott22]

If we have Sub Terra returning as is the return of HH, I could see Towers marketing the opening of two 'new' attractions for 2023, makes up for the loss of Nemesis.

I know some say that Joe public will know that's not strictly true, but then again considering how extensive HH's overhaul will be and with any Sub Terra plot being different due to Nemesis being out of action, you could honestly make the argument by the time they return, they will be pretty much new regardless.

This would work I think, and would probably make Nemesis being closed less of a blow to people. They are also only a footpath away from each other, so people might quite like the idea of two “new” attractions so close to each other

 

[Matt N]

I think the notable difference this time compared to previous years is that a member on here who actually works for a local lighting company that Towers has used before is claiming that Towers have requested their services again for next year, and that those services are for a project inside Sub Terra’s building.

That definitely suggests to me that something is happening…

 

[Danscott22]

We don’t know if they are standard lights which could be used because workers are going to be in there, or theatrical lights to be used in an attraction experience capacity though

 

[rob666]

It could be where they are putting the canteen and portaloos for the nemesis workers.

 

[Jordan]

If it was to re-open, let’s hope it’s been substantially reworked.

In its previous incarnation, the guest feedback scores for the park were actually higher on the days when the ride was closed.

 

[jon81uk]

If it was to re-open, let’s hope it’s been substantially reworked.

In its previous incarnation, the guest feedback scores for the park were actually higher on the days when the ride was closed.

Just removing most of the shouting would be enough I think. A "tour" of the facilty, go in the lift, sit down and then oh no something has gone wrong, the drop happens, have a pre-recorded emergency exit back to the lift. Don't need the attendants to shout at everyone so much. Instead of the "maze" exit I'd probably add something like what was added to DBGT of holding guests in a further room and then doing a jump scare, again could be largely automated like Hex so guests are held, the lights go out, something happens and then the doors automatically open.

 

[AT86]

Instead of the "maze" exit I'd probably add something like what was added to DBGT of holding guests in a further room and then doing a jump scare

Good call. This seems like a logical solution - just copy the same ‘effect’ from DBGT, doesn’t need as many staff as a maze.

 

[jon81uk]

Hex is a ride with three pre-shows (including the one at batching) Sub-Terra should be a ride with two pre-shows (including batching and the lifts) and two post-shows of the lift and the final scare. Other than the baggage hold issue (due to the floor dropping away on Sub-Terra I think external bag storage is needed) they should be able to run it more like Hex where it is largely automated.

 

[Dave]

Just removing most of the shouting would be enough I think. A "tour" of the facilty, go in the lift, sit down and then oh no something has gone wrong, the drop happens, have a pre-recorded emergency exit back to the lift. Don't need the attendants to shout at everyone so much. Instead of the "maze" exit I'd probably add something like what was added to DBGT of holding guests in a further room and then doing a jump scare, again could be largely automated like Hex so guests are held, the lights go out, something happens and then the doors automatically open.

They don’t need actors in the existing finale to make it scary for most guests. Just add a few automated jump scares like air cannons, or if they have a few grand spare the odd “monster” theming that is strobe lit.

The whole point of the finale was to add a final bit of stress to the ride rather than the damp squib of being attacked by a monster in a lift then the doors open and you wander out into the sun. If you do it correctly those inclined to be scared will let their imaginations add to the physical effects even without an actor and those who are not inclined to find the finale scary won’t find an actor adds anything to their fear anyway.

Actors only add to proper scare mazes as you are in them for longer so the actors add a certain dynamic as 10 minutes of animated effects and air cannons gets boring, 20 seconds at the end of a ride not so much.

 

[jon81uk]

They don’t need actors in the existing finale to make it scary for most guests. Just add a few automated jump scares like air cannons, or if they have a few grand spare the odd “monster” theming that is strobe lit.

The whole point of the finale was to add a final bit of stress to the ride rather than the damp squib of being attacked by a monster in a lift then the doors open and you wander out into the sun. If you do it correctly those inclined to be scared will let their imaginations add to the physical effects even without an actor and those who are not inclined to find the finale scary won’t find an actor adds anything to their fear anyway.

Actors only add to proper scare mazes as you are in them for longer so the actors add a certain dynamic as 10 minutes of animated effects and air cannons gets boring, 20 seconds at the end of a ride not so much.

I was also proposing removing the actors and adding automated scares. Just doing it in a more controlled way like they added to DBGT rather than a maze format. I don't think they should use actors either

Spoiler: details on Derren Brown Ghost Train

Yes I know that the effect on DBGT is a person in a demon costume, but it should be possible to achieve the same scare with lighting and a monster with a strobe

 

[Dave]

I was also proposing removing the actors and adding automated scares. Just doing it in a more controlled way like they added to DBGT rather than a maze format. I don't think they should use actors either

Spoiler: details on Derren Brown Ghost Train

Yes I know that the effect on DBGT is a person in a demon costume, but it should be possible to achieve the same scare with lighting and a monster with a strobe

See I don’t think stoping the guests helps with ST. The whole point is you are trying to escape, stopping doesn’t really help with that idea. Lots of noise and stress is more in line with the aesthetic.

 

[Benzin]

Are we aware that the DBGT final scare effect is currently broken and replaced by something...... not quite scary?

All for Sub Terra coming back if it does so. I enjoyed it as it was silly and also filled a gap in the ride line up. Most groups I rode it with over the various incarnations seemed to at least have fun, if probably forget about it afterwards. That it's been sat dead is a testament to the poor running of the park over the last few years.

If not, put Dynamo in the building.

 

[jon81uk]

See I don’t think stoping the guests helps with ST. The whole point is you are trying to escape, stopping doesn’t really help with that idea. Lots of noise and stress is more in line with the aesthetic.

Whereas I think that stopping adds to the stress of trying to escape more than more noise, which is the wrong sort of stress. The noise to me was just painful. But being told you need to escape from a monster, then finding the escape route blocked (with appropriate computer voice of "containment breach - zone now secured" so it is obvious it is blocked as part of the show) would be more scary stressful than just a really loud siren going off.
I'm picturing coming out of the lift into a normally lit corridor with a closed door and a flashing red light above it and the recorded announcement, then the lights go out and the monster comes out with the strobe and air cannons etc, lights come back at a lower level and the door opens.
Whereas from memory the old exit maze was just a loud siren, a strobe and a bloke in a gas mask?

 

[Poisson]

Dark and strobes are their biggest friends for the blinding effects and disorientation. Removed the low ceiling bit, add some air cannons and strobes, maybe some props and you're good.

Regarding hosts they really should be modelled on actually military base security who in my experience are perfectly nice but also scary. Try and aim for some of the more physical looking staff to be hosting the ride, chuck them some deactivated machine guns and it'd be alright.

 

[James]

If I remember correctly there were air cannons in the maze finale. I think if they want to keep it simple, keeping these effects with perhaps some enhanced sound effects and some smoke, it should be fine without any actors. A DBGT-type finale would be great but Towers are unlikely to invest much into this.

The acting definitely needs to be changed. None of this random abusive language and shouting at guests. Welcoming but authoritative, then the chamber hosts can act on edge/scared after the drop sequence to indicate something has gone wrong.

 

[ChristmasPud]

I think a more entertaining and richer inspiration would've been the scrappy cult worshippers from the early Nemesis days.