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2017/18: SW8 Speculation

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Max said:
I still seriously doubt we'll ever see another dark ride under Merlin, especially after the disaster of Sub Terra. If Merlin do ever attempt a dark ride again, It won't be a major investment, it would be far too much of a risk for Merlin to spend millions on a dark ride when they're previous attempt was a total failure.
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Why was Sub-Terra a total failure? I admit I didn't ride it in the first few months of opening (when issues were reported) my first experience was last year and I loved it. Delivered exactly what it needed too, the drop maybe wasn't great as it isn't that tall but the sensation of fear and panic worked and I and many others felt terrified as leaving the experience. I don't see Sub-Terra as being a real dark ride though, it is (like The Dungeons) more of an experience with three separate parts and it relays on the cast more than the ride.
The new Lego haunted house in Denmark has received good reviews and is largely a less scary version of Sub-Terra with a walk-through followed by a drop tower. Thinking about it dark rides (Atlantis subs, laiser raiders) are good at all Lego parks too, even if they are all too short.

I think a decent dark ride could be delivered by Merlin but at the moment I don't think they have built anything that is truly a dark ride (outside of the Lego parks). The concern with Thorpe would be the lack of space to build a decent ride in but I am sure Alton Towers could find space for a decent building.
 
To be fair, the inside section of Saw is very well done. What's to say Merlin can't theme something in that way on a larger scale?
 
I am expecting Alton's Dark ride to be one of these new interactive dark rides with 3d Screens with motion based cars. Obviously not on same scale as universals 3d based rides but similar to what some other regional parks have started to add in recent years, which seem to be costing other parks around $10m. Plus the park would save a lot of money utilising the duel ride building, so would have plenty of money for a decent major dark ride.
 
Sub-Terra was a total failure from it's original version. Although the fact they closed it and changed the experience greatly I think it turned out to be a great little dark ride/experience. It seems to be pretty popular with the public. The only downfall of it is the requirement of so many staff, which doesn't work quite well for a filler attraction.

I think now is just as good as any other time for Merlin to create a large scale dark ride. A dark ride is never guaranteed to be 100% on opening. Haunted House is a good Tussauds example of how a dark ride can be completely changed in the space of a few months. Same might happen with a Merlin dark ride.

It's the perfect time for Towers most. You have Duel, which has ran its lifespan and could really do with better use, and CATCF, which, well, is a mess and could do with gutting out and something completely new. Both two perfectly usable buildings ready and waiting. Upper hand with that too is that Merlin could spend £15-£20 million on an immersive dark ride experience without the worry of constructing a building.
 
Yes, the first "version" of Nemesis Sub Terra was quite bad, although Merlin quite obvsiously made up for that mistake by correcting it with the scare maze section, which personally I believe makes the ride quite good. Duel is in serious need of either refurbishment or removal- when I went three days ago, I noticed around 5% of the lights didnt actually work, reducing everyone in my party's final scores to be substantially lower than usual. Dont forget that Alton could potentially be moving the entrance (or just making a new one) in that section between Gloomy Wood and Forbidden Valley. This means that a dark ride will be less favourable to Merlin as people coming to the park want to be able to see whats in store for them at the park.
 
The more I think about it, the more I reckon Alton Towers have only a couple of real options in 2017. I am confident the park will be looking at Forbidden Valley, where SW7 was originally touted to be - possibly weaving in/around the area. This joins up with the rumours about Ripsaw having to be relocated elsewhere in the park.

First of all, I believe we can rule out three manufacturers:

Intamin due to the problems and experiences of the rollercoasters in Dark Forest
Gerstlauer due to the problems with The Smiler.
B&M due to the fact that they don't seem to be coming forwards with anything particularly unique

I therefore think we could be looking at one of the following:

Mack with a multi-launched product. Quiet and smooth with a range of possibilities. This would eliminate the need for height whilst negating the requirement for expensive digging. Maintenance and build quality is also high.
RMC which would get over the issue of a wooden coaster - because it's not a wooden coaster. It would also be somewhat unique with only 1 other in Europe (Kolmarden). They also seem keen to play with all manner of layouts and ideas - perfect for USP seeking Towers!

:)
 
Given that the monorail is going to be soon on its last legs so to speak I wouldn't be surprised to see SW8 part of the plan to move the entrance near to the hotels and part of an entertainment complex similar to the DLP Hollywood Studios entrance.
With the enchanted village and both hotels guests are going to need something to do in the evenings.
 
I'm still not sure about RMC. Several people from Merlin (including John Wardley) have been asked about an RMC and their response has been favourable but also that the ride system / company is too new to judge how well it will age.

Plus they only make trains with lap bars so no chance ;)
 
RMC or B&M I can see, depends if B&M want to break out of their current rep
 
I cannot see Towers getting a Mack, however much we may all want one. A launch would be considered too similar to Rita. Multi-inversions would be considered too similar to The Smiler. What could Mack offer Towers in their mega coaster that would give Towers the essential USP? It's mad I know, a good coaster is a good coaster and something like Helix would be brilliant but I cannot see Merlin giving the green light.

An RMC is interesting, but once again I cannot see Towers getting one. For starters in would involve inversions and lap bars (well more than likely, they'd be mad not to put inversions in an RMC and I cannot imagine RMC designing OTSRs for Towers). On the plus side however an RMC is certainly unique and would have that USP. I believe they are also relatively cheap which would go down well.

B&M are a funny one. In many ways Towers are long overdue a nice new B&M. Merlin clearly have a decent relationship with B&M; Raptor, Krake, The Swarm, Flug der Dämonen, and Gardaland dive machine all in the last 4 years. Towers are the only major Merlin park not to have been given one. If, and it is a big if, B&M are ready with their 4D concept then that is where my bets are for SW8. It is a long shot but when you look at it then it's the perfect solution. Cost however could be a massive issue!

:)
 
Tim said:
I'm still not sure about RMC. Several people from Merlin (including John Wardley) have been asked about an RMC and their response has been favourable but also that the ride system / company is too new to judge how well it will age.

Plus they only make trains with lap bars so no chance ;)
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Seems odd that they wouldn't trust RMC based on their rides being new considering they've been retracking various wooden coasters with their topper track since 2001, and full coasters since 2011. They had no problem going to B&M in the 90s (still a new company at that stage) for concepts which had never been seen before! :p
 
BigAl said:
Seems odd that they wouldn't trust RMC based on their rides being new considering they've been retracking various wooden coasters with their topper track since 2001, and full coasters since 2011. They had no problem going to B&M in the 90s (still a new company at that stage) for concepts which had never been seen before! :p
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It may seem odd, but Wardley did once say about how it will be interesting to see how the hybrids age/last over time. He did not sound convinced at all!

:)
 
I'm struggling to see how there would be enough space left within Forbidden Valley for a major coaster without going in the valley itself. Maybe I'm missing something but I don't want another compact coaster.
 
The MTDP shown it basically going round the back of Air onto the car park, which was supposed to be getting moved.
 
AshleeKel said:
I'm struggling to see how there would be enough space left within Forbidden Valley for a major coaster without going in the valley itself. Maybe I'm missing something but I don't want another compact coaster.
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Remove Blade and Ripsaw (put the station there) and take the coaster out into the car parks
 
Build out from KC to the mini bus car park and make a new area, build around, past the back of Duel and then build access to said car park, make it a circular access from both Valley and new area for the ride, station is behind air
 
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