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2022: General Discussion

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JAperson said:
I don't disagree but all of that costs far more than whacking up a few signs to cover themselves. I don't think it's the right thing to do but I understand why they've done it. As you've suggested there are other solutions, all of which would be better, but I just don't see them doing them simply due to cost.
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I understand why they've done it. But again that shows short-sightedness on the part of Merlin and the decision they took to implement them. Yes, it ticks a box, yes it "covers them" in respect that they're more likely to get insurance money if the worst would happen.

However, they need to look at the bigger picture. Let's say a guest ignores the signs and an incident happens anyway. The press don't give a damn if the park have a load of signs up, they'll take the park to town like they do with every amusement/theme park accident that has happened in recent years. Sure there'll be insurance to cover some costs, but the wider impact of lower guest numbers is arguably far more costly. We saw it with The Smiler, we saw it with Drayton too.

The short term "cost" of thinking more outside the box with health and safety messaging, and increasing the possibility of preventing these incidents in the first place is a far lower long term cost than they'd get hit with should the worst happen. Pushing that aside for a second though, let's also not forget Alton Towers are a themed attraction, the place shouldn't be resembling the shop floor of a factory.
 
The signs are basically useless - with the modified boats the risk of falling out is massively reduced if you stand up and a sign isn't going to stop someone who actually wants to jump in the water.

The reason they've been added is purely to comply with guidance issued by the HSE which places a whole load of requirements on parks operating rapids rides, much of it of dubious benefit
 
The problem is though, with hundreds of people riding the Rapids in a day, there will almost certainly be at least a few who disobey the rules even though the warning measures are there. Same goes for people crossing the road without looking, for example; most people will be sensible and look, but a small minority will cross without looking and dice with death. You simply cannot trust everyone to be sensible and follow the rules.
 
Alsty said:
Health & Safety tends to sit in one of two camps:
  • Measures that actually eliminate or reduce risk,
  • Measures that have little or no effect on risk but "tick a box"
These signs sit firmly in the latter.

Health & Safety should be about genuine measures to control risk rather than simply about covering your backside.
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Yep and the former are the modifications to the boats adding doors and higher backs.
 
Those signs around the rapids which many seem to say are new were actually installed at some point last season. Although with the rapids shut for the end of the season they might have been missed. Thorpe have the same signs around theirs too.

There were only two boats on the system on Sunday so the ride clearly hasn’t finished all of its maintenance or training yet.
 
djtruefitt said:
Those signs around the rapids which many seem to say are new were actually installed at some point last season. Although with the rapids shut for the end of the season they might have been missed. Thorpe have the same signs around theirs too.

There were only two boats on the system on Sunday so the ride clearly hasn’t finished all of its maintenance or training yet.
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Was the ride open?

I seem to remember the signs being installed while the ride was shut, and I remember this being true for Rumba as well, but I could be wrong there.
 
Alsty said:
I would argue that's entirely foreseeable and doesn't need a specific warning.

I'm not one to jump on the "H&S gone mad" bandwagon but surely we have to allow some level of personal responsibility as well?

I know the park can't depart from this kind of thing for liability reasons but it just feels a bit unnecessary to me.
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This is the response to the actions of a child, who can't be relied upon to draw such logical conclusions, so it's fair enough really. The choice really is spell it out or ban children from a family ride.
 
pluk said:
This is the response to the actions of a child, who can't be relied upon to draw such logical conclusions, so it's fair enough really. The choice really is spell it out or ban children from a family ride.
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Do you honestly believe if Drayton Manor had a sign that said "Danger of drowning" then the incident would not have occurred?
 
Alsty said:
Do you honestly believe if Drayton Manor had a sign that said "Danger of drowning" then the incident would not have occurred?
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The HSE do think that the fact there was no signage emphasising the risks was a contributing factor. The signage of remain seated was worn out which is the main issue, but they added that there was nothing to mention what may happen if you don’t remain seated. See the image in the below quote.
AT86 said:
I believe these signs are in response to the report sent out to all U.K. parks with rapids rides from the coroner following the Drayton incident. Specifically this bit:

A6A1F5FF-8AD0-42B9-880F-E9B913330A19.jpeg
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I think from a theme park front, it mitigates them a lot. This is in no reflection to the poor victim of the incident.

However there are some people who if similar happened, they survived and tried to sue, their basis would be 'There wasn't anything suggesting moving seats would be dangerous'.

In the same way when I worked at a cinema and someone got arrested, their claim was 'There wasn't a sign saying we couldnt record the film, so I assumed we could'

if something was to happen again, the theme parks defence could be 'We had visible signs warning against moving and they have broken the rules of the ride by ignoring these signs'

But back to 2022, Im looking forward to it, with the wicker man pre-show back on it makes the ride better in my opinion - gets the adrenaline pumping
 
Tibble said:
But back to 2022, Im looking forward to it, with the wicker man pre-show back on it makes the ride better in my opinion - gets the adrenaline pumping
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Yes, but just bear in mind that the last time it ran (in main season anyway) the ride broke down and everyone got shut in for half an hour! So maybe don't join the queue with a full bladder...
 
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