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2022 Speculation and CBeebies Land additions

Maybe, just maybe that the Retrosquad will return with added leg warmers and mullets in 2022.

In other words, maybe they'll have different rides in their place. After all, they have spent a hell of a lot of money on them and making their areas look permanent (fences, paving, tarmac, electrical supplies etc) so it would seem a waste to not use those areas again. And of course if - through the winter - restrictions are returned, then come March we could be in pretty much in the same situation we were in in March this year - and that was one of the main reasons for the Retrosquad in the first place.
 
I'm starting to think that there's a good chance Alton Towers won't actually add anything next year. I'd love to be proven wrong however some good points have been made about the fact that it is unlikely Merlin where looking at buying attractions in 2020 and early 2021. I'm just not sure they'd have time to plan an attraction and get a manufacturer to build it in time for next season. I'm sure they want to add something so maybe we'll just get something small and easy to plan rather than something like a new flat ride but I suppose nobody can say for sure that something wasn't planned before. I still think they're is a likelihood that an expansion to TWODW was planned for 2022 two years after the original attraction opened. So maybe there is still a chance that something might be added to walliams world.
 
Danscott22 said:
We might get a flat ride, they surely don't really take a load of effort to plan/buy/put together.
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But surely the manufacturer is going to need near enough a year to get it made and ready to go out as well as the builders and anything like that has to be sorted too. I just think the short time they've had is not likely long enough to order a flat ride. Also they've probably had even less time if they were waiting to see if the retro squad was a success. I think if they are planning a flat ride we are more likely to see it in 2023.
 
They can easily order a flat ride in on lease at much shorter notice, much like the Retrosquad additions. I suspect they'll look to retain one or two next year, but not all four.
 
Danny said:
They can easily order a flat ride in on lease at much shorter notice, much like the Retrosquad additions. I suspect they'll look to retain one or two next year, but not all four.
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I just don't think retaining them will do much good. Perhaps one year but I don't want them to think that temporary flat rides are a good idea. I was behind them doing it for this year as it made sense at the time however I don't want them to do it permanently. I still think they'll all be gone by next year but I suppose we will see.
 
JAperson said:
I just don't think retaining them will do much good. Perhaps one year but I don't want them to think that temporary flat rides are a good idea. I was behind them doing it for this year as it made sense at the time however I don't want them to do it permanently. I still think they'll all be gone by next year but I suppose we will see.
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There’s always the second hand market to consider - for all we know they may have already secured a couple of fairly new second hand large flats. Wasn’t The Blade second hand when they purchased it back in the 80s?

I really hope they focus on ride availability and reliability next season too. Not a day goes by without several attractions being closed at the moment, and Wickerman and The Smiler are both currently closed on a half term Scarefest full capacity day. Imagine the queues if the temporary flats weren’t here?

I really, really hope we get a couple of high capacity flats in FV and X Sector next year rather than a couple of pointless tiny new additions to TWoDW. I don’t think I’ve seen a single negative comment on social media relating to lack of rides in TWoDW.
 
JAperson said:
I just don't think retaining them will do much good. Perhaps one year but I don't want them to think that temporary flat rides are a good idea. I was behind them doing it for this year as it made sense at the time however I don't want them to do it permanently. I still think they'll all be gone by next year but I suppose we will see.
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But if it helps like it did this year, then can that be a bad thing? Although we appear to be at the back end of the pandemic, we're not completely out of the woods yet. If come the summer, holidays abroad are still restricted or worse still, banned, then more people will holiday in the UK - the same as this summer. It would make sense to have something like the Retrosquad back if that is the case.
 
Steve74 said:
But if it helps like it did this year, then can that be a bad thing? Although we appear to be at the back end of the pandemic, we're not completely out of the woods yet. If come the summer, holidays abroad are still restricted or worse still, banned, then more people will holiday in the UK - the same as this summer. It would make sense to have something like the Retrosquad back if that is the case.
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I get what your saying but I'm just not sure temporary rides will be necessary after this season especially if they sort out reliability issues.
s_g_k said:
There’s always the second hand market to consider
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That's something I hadn't thought of and it wouldn't be a bad option. Perhaps they have bought some second hand flats and that would do the park no end of good.
 
JAperson said:
I get what your saying but I'm just not sure temporary rides will be necessary after this season especially if they sort out reliability issues
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Well as I said, if next year just as many people stay in the UK as this year, then it makes sense to have them back. If it could be guaranteed that guest levels would return to pre-2021 levels because more people are going abroad, then yes probably no need for them.
 
Steve74 said:
Well as I said, if next year just as many people stay in the UK as this year, then it makes sense to have them back. If it could be guaranteed that guest levels would return to pre-2021 levels because more people are going abroad, then yes probably no need for them.
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Yes I get what your saying but its not just about attendance levels I'm sure, because it will be a full season without restrictions (hopefully), Alton Towers will have a very good attendance number next year but I think it's likely to be more dispersed. We've had some really busy days this year as many people couldn't go earlier in the season or at company buy out days. I just think that the will probably just manage without them. I'm not sure if that's the right decision but I think they'll just do without them. Hopefully we do get something with a decent throughput for 2022. Something like a show would be perfect as it would soak people up for an extended period of time. Basically, I hope they put a 4D show in the theatre in Walliams world.
 
Let's face it, the 4 temp flats idea came about because the park was expecting a busy season and found themselves in the rediculous position that they just didn't have enough permanent capacity due to ride closures and cuts in the preceding seasons. These flats weren't just a Covid 21 season sticking plaster, the park needs permanent additions.

You can't rely on reliability alone. Something will always break down or need a part. Things break and need maintenance, it's just the way things are. This only becomes a big problem when you have areas like Dark Forest with just 2 coasters, Forbidden Valley with 2 and one very old flat, X Sector with 2 and an another very old flat. If many areas of your park are so sparse in attractions that there's nothing to do if just one coaster breaks down then you've got a problem.

The park is in desperate need of supporting flats and dark rides in Walliams World, X Sector, DF, FV and I would also argue that it needs one in Katanga as well. This is before we even consider the fact that Blade and Enterprise are in their twilight years.

I would look to be opening either the theatre or a ride in the Charlie building (I would prefer the latter) next season and doing something about the other areas pretty sharpish. If temp flats need to be phased out over a few seasons whilst quality permanent additions are sought then so be it. I can't imagine chucking a high quality permanent flat in XS, DF and FV with some decent theming would be too taxing on the finances.

But since they couldn't even open Walliams World properly due to financial constraints, I have no hope any of this will happen. It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if none of this happens and we just go back to how things were in 2020.
 
JAperson said:
I just don't think retaining them will do much good. Perhaps one year but I don't want them to think that temporary flat rides are a good idea. I was behind them doing it for this year as it made sense at the time however I don't want them to do it permanently. I still think they'll all be gone by next year but I suppose we will see.
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The flats were brought in to address the ride count KPI for guests. With some of the more permanent additions suffering downtime at the moment, they are doing a sound role in offering an alternate solution and meeting this KPI.

Regardless of how long they are there for, one or two ought to be retained until a permanent solution is achieved.

As far as I'm aware, they aren't proud of having had to slap four garish fairground attractions in, but it proves a point to the purse string tighteners at head office in Poole. They know full well they aren't a permanent solution, but they're a great fix until one is established; regardless of if they have to stay another season or two.
 
Danny said:
As far as I'm aware, they aren't proud of having had to slap four garish fairground attractions in, but it proves a point to the purse string tighteners at head office in Poole. They know full well they aren't a permanent solution, but they're a great fix until one is established; regardless of if they have to stay another season or two.
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I think that's the intention, but ultimately not what is happening. Their effectiveness is very much reduced by the issues the park are having with the reliability of their permanent rides.
 
Rick said:
I think that's the intention, but ultimately not what is happening. Their effectiveness is very much reduced by the issues the park are having with the reliability of their permanent rides.
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Not helped by the fact that the Retrosquad rides aren't super reliable either. Mixtape was closed Monday morning then opened in the afternoon with four arms out of use (and a 60 minute queue when it was marked 0). These rides are already quite old and simply not used to operating as much as they have been at Towers. Brand new, permanent flats will be more reliable (after the usual teething issues that all new rides have that is).
 
Skyscraper said:
Not helped by the fact that the Retrosquad rides aren't super reliable either. Mixtape was closed Monday morning then opened in the afternoon with four arms out of use. These rides are already quite old and simply not used to operating as much as they have been at Towers.
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Pretty sure Roller Disco and Funk'n'Fly only started operating for the first time last year! Mixtape i think might be a 2012 ride but the other two aren't that old!
 
Danscott22 said:
Pretty sure Roller Disco and Funk'n'Fly only started operating for the first time last year! Mixtape i think might be a 2012 ride but the other two aren't that old!
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Ah that's interesting. Explains why Funk 'n' Fly has been having loads of issues as well as Mixtape (one is brand new, one is 9 years old). Roller Disco seems to have been the most reliable out of the three Retrosquad rides, and Flavio's too. Makes sense though as those as the less complex than the other two.

(Mods might want to move this discussion to the Retrosquad topic :p)
 
JAperson said:
This os another reason I don't think they'll bother keeping Retro-squad rides next year. Wny keep rides that are very unreliable.
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I'd be interested to know if the reliablility of these rides fall into the acceptable window of reliability set by the manufacturer.

Don't forget, these rides have been working almost non-stop for 6 months, for at least 7 hours a day, 7 days a week. We don't know what time the operators (who are the owners I believe) have outside of these hours to carry out any preventative maintenance or repairs - remember that when these travelling rides are travelling, they probably only operate a few hours a day for short periods then dismantled and moved. When not in operation, the owners have far more time to fix any issues - so in the case of the arms on Mixtape, they could "fail" as often as we're seeing here but are repaired in the mornings before the travelling fair opens to the public, giving the impression of much higher reliability than we're seeing at Towers.
 
Steve74 said:
I'd be interested to know if the reliablility of these rides fall into the acceptable window of reliability set by the manufacturer.

Don't forget, these rides have been working almost non-stop for 6 months, for at least 7 hours a day, 7 days a week. We don't know what time the operators (who are the owners I believe) have outside of these hours to carry out any preventative maintenance or repairs - remember that when these travelling rides are travelling, they probably only operate a few hours a day for short periods then dismantled and moved. When not in operation, the owners have far more time to fix any issues - so in the case of the arms on Mixtape, they could "fail" as often as we're seeing here but are repaired in the mornings before the travelling fair opens to the public, giving the impression of much higher reliability than we're seeing at Towers.
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Yes your probably right @Steve74 but that doesn't stop them from being awkward for Towers to keep. Like you say the owners don't have the time to do the maintenance and they aren't designed for continuous operation then why would Towers keep them for another year?
Back on topic:
I do think we will see something next year |I just don't think it will be a flat ride for reasons I've already mentioned. I think we may see a new show in walliams world or perhaps something else small but I would love to be proven wrong. I suppose we might start hearing rumours about what is happening next year soon? When could we expect an announcement for something?
 
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