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A Royal Baby
- Thread starter Andrew
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Sam
TS Member
Re: Re: A Royal Baby
This was OBVIOUSLY suicide. If it was an accident, the BBC would have made that clear in their story. They don't use the word 'suicide' out of sensitivity to the nurse's family, but they presume it's obvious to everyone what's happened.
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Tom said:
This was OBVIOUSLY suicide. If it was an accident, the BBC would have made that clear in their story. They don't use the word 'suicide' out of sensitivity to the nurse's family, but they presume it's obvious to everyone what's happened.
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Tom
TS Member
The BBC are reporting that nurse's death as "desperately sad", but maybe if they hadn't broadcast the prank call over and over, it wouldn't have distressed her to the point where she felt she had to kill her self.
Sam, I'm sure it was suicide, I just wanted to emphasise that noting was known for sure yet and that I was officially speculating.
Sam, I'm sure it was suicide, I just wanted to emphasise that noting was known for sure yet and that I was officially speculating.
I am disgusted by the ridiculous obsession and outrage of the public over someone hoaxing their demi-gods. I don't trust the Palace's claim that they made no complaint or applied no pressure, they are the driving force behind the Royals' publicity and they purposefully push stories that get's them in the public eye. The Palace Press Office pushed this ridiculous story to the forefront on national news which created such pressure that is has resulted in a woman ending her life.
There's blood on the hands of the Palace Press Office, there's blood on the hands of the media, there's blood on the hands of fanatical Royalists.
I become more and more ashamed of this country every day. My heart goes out to her husband and two children she left behind. It must be an unimaginably terrible time for them.
There's blood on the hands of the Palace Press Office, there's blood on the hands of the media, there's blood on the hands of fanatical Royalists.
I become more and more ashamed of this country every day. My heart goes out to her husband and two children she left behind. It must be an unimaginably terrible time for them.
Sam
TS Member
Meat Pie, I think you're going a little far. The only people with blood on their hands are the two Australian DJs who thought this was a good idea, and the radio station that allowed them to do it.
Although this is a tragedy, the nurse in question probably had other issues in her life because this alone wouldn't drive a person to take their own life. If it's true that the hospital gave her their full support over this, then the vast majority of people wouldn't have got anywhere near committing suicide. Maybe if the hospital had disciplined her, but not when it supported her. I suspect she had other mental health issues and this tipped her over the edge.
Although this is a tragedy, the nurse in question probably had other issues in her life because this alone wouldn't drive a person to take their own life. If it's true that the hospital gave her their full support over this, then the vast majority of people wouldn't have got anywhere near committing suicide. Maybe if the hospital had disciplined her, but not when it supported her. I suspect she had other mental health issues and this tipped her over the edge.
I really disagree with you on this one Sam. I don't think there was anything wrong with the DJ's doing the hoax call. You wouldn't see this fuss if it had been anyone else they targeted. It's the shrieking overreacting Royal obsessives and the press eager to spread disapproval that convince people this is is somehow a 'serious' issue, and therefore created the sort of pressure that would act as a catalyst for someone ending their life.
Of course this alone would probably not mean the nurse would have taken her life, but it was something that could clearly damage a stable minded person but in this case absolutely destroyed this woman who must have been suffering from depression.
If people didn't put the Royals on such a ridiculously high pedestal, if the media wasn't so keen to abuse this bizarre national worship, and if the palace press wasn't so desperate to keep the public's attention, this would most likely have passed by with no-one really caring about it. It probably wouldn't have been splashed across the national news and those involved wouldn't be under the ridiculous levels of pressure that has lead to this awful tragedy.
Of course this alone would probably not mean the nurse would have taken her life, but it was something that could clearly damage a stable minded person but in this case absolutely destroyed this woman who must have been suffering from depression.
If people didn't put the Royals on such a ridiculously high pedestal, if the media wasn't so keen to abuse this bizarre national worship, and if the palace press wasn't so desperate to keep the public's attention, this would most likely have passed by with no-one really caring about it. It probably wouldn't have been splashed across the national news and those involved wouldn't be under the ridiculous levels of pressure that has lead to this awful tragedy.
Kelpie
TS Member
I disagree on the point that DJ's doing a hoax call to a hotel to jokingly book a room for/impersonating a celebrity (any celebrity incidentally) and making silly requests etc on their behalf is one thing. Calling up a hospital and asking for medical details, however mistaken the nurses in divulging them might have been, is a very different matter. The Radio station management should not have okayed it's airing.Meat Pie said:
I agree with Sam, speculation but I think that the nurse must have had some underlying issues to take this drastic step and leave her family without her. As far as I can tell she was never publicly named, unlike others who've found themselves unwittingly shoved into the media spotlight and the pressure of that. Anyone could have answered that call, it was no indication of her capabilities as a nurse either.
To be fair, even with 'some' of the public (aka Daily Fail thinking people are that obsessed because actually I don't think they are) being massively interested in the Royal pregnancy, they didn't need a hoax call to feed it. The interest would have kept rumbling all week without it with just the announcement, let alone the brief hospital stay. I work in News (NOT editorial in any way I hasten to add!) and getting to know these things it would have been covered every day for certain in some way.
I would also add that a large part of the reasons our Royal family have so much coverage compared to other Royal families elsewhere in Europe for example, is the fact they are the heads of state of far, far more than just us. And they have a lot of respect elsewhere in the Commonwealth - yes many countries have a strong Rebublican movement also, but there are a lot of very strong 'Royalists' out there too.
If we're back on the original topic - good for the couple, congrats to them as any other couple wanting a baby, but that's all I have to say or personally care on the subject. In a wider political context, it holds a lot of importance. It would be interesting if it is a daughter and they subsequently have a son with the new heir rules for example. There's a lot of argument such rules should also be applied to the rest of the aristocracy. So it can hold significance in other ways.
Stelios
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Nemesis
Blaze said:
That needs to be in your signature.
My money is on Victoria then Diana or George and Wills. Doesn't really bother me that much since we'll be hugging zimmerframes before the child becomes monarch it seems. But wasn't one year of being all British enough?
Jem8472
TS Member
Meat Pie said:
Of course the radio station did not broadcast the prank call. The presenters did not post it on twitter and facebook causing it to be a viral audio clip of the prank call. :
Its all those dam Royals!!! Probably Prince Philip himself at a laptop hacking all news site to make sure its on the front pages of them all!!!! :
It also seems that you make sure everyone except you has blood on their hands....
As Kelpie said I really don't think that it was a good decision of the management to allow this to be broadcast. A bit like the Russell Brand and Jonathan Ross prank call. Hardly the most entertaining and intelligent form of humour.
Also looks like the radio station has dropped the presenters, at least for the time being.
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/jacintha-saldanha-royal-hospital-nurse-death--australian-dj-duo-quit-twitter-164606662.html
I think there have been some interesting points made by Kelpie. I reconsider the appropriateness of the hoax call, which admittedly due to the nature of breaking patient confidentiality, I see that it was a stupid and ill-advised hoax and should not have been broadcast.
However, I maintain that the reason such a hullabaloo was kicked up about this hoax (rightly or wrongly) was because it happened to be members of the Royal Family that were targeted. If this had been someone else, it would most certainly not be headline news and ridiculously pushed to the lengths that it has by the media.
Also, I agree in that I have no doubts that the news would have covered the pregnancy story every day that they could, but what's better than having a new controversial story that doesn't reflect badly on the object of the story's sympathy, and yet propels the story into headline news? It's publicity gold for the Palace. I think it would be naïve to not see that this was a signifcant contributing factor to raising of the profile of the story.
Jem8472 - Wow what a pathetic post. So your accusing blood being on my hands? Come on then, this should be a laugh... How so pray tell?
It's an absurd claim.
I've given reasons for why the fingers in their ears pro-royal lobby has been responsible in flagging up a rather mundane and unimportant story, so don't go round belittling my opinion. If you disagree, make a reasoned argument.
Also, when did I say that the Royals themselves were directly to blame in this instance? I didn't. The palace press has an objective to promote the institution and that is what it has done, but their actions and those of the wider media, have in this case been reckless and pushed a poor woman to suicide.
However, I maintain that the reason such a hullabaloo was kicked up about this hoax (rightly or wrongly) was because it happened to be members of the Royal Family that were targeted. If this had been someone else, it would most certainly not be headline news and ridiculously pushed to the lengths that it has by the media.
Also, I agree in that I have no doubts that the news would have covered the pregnancy story every day that they could, but what's better than having a new controversial story that doesn't reflect badly on the object of the story's sympathy, and yet propels the story into headline news? It's publicity gold for the Palace. I think it would be naïve to not see that this was a signifcant contributing factor to raising of the profile of the story.
Jem8472 - Wow what a pathetic post. So your accusing blood being on my hands? Come on then, this should be a laugh... How so pray tell?
It's an absurd claim.
I've given reasons for why the fingers in their ears pro-royal lobby has been responsible in flagging up a rather mundane and unimportant story, so don't go round belittling my opinion. If you disagree, make a reasoned argument.
Also, when did I say that the Royals themselves were directly to blame in this instance? I didn't. The palace press has an objective to promote the institution and that is what it has done, but their actions and those of the wider media, have in this case been reckless and pushed a poor woman to suicide.
Jem8472
TS Member
Jem8472 said:
Firstly please re-read and try again.
Secondly I was mainly just taking the piss about the royals being involved. Anything that happens with the royal family you get conspiracy people coming up with odd theorys about what happened. Just look at Di. There are some weird and wonderful theorys about what happened to her.
Thirdly don't be a condescending idiot, my post was not pathetic, maybe a little bit of a troll post don't be so high and mighty about yourself.
Dave
TS Founding Member
You know it baffles me why people don't have the ability to debate without getting personal, I'm going to state this one last time on this topic NO PERSONAL ATTACKS ON OTHER MEMBERS. If people can't debate instead of arguing then we will either A) Lock topic and/ or B) put offenders on moderation. And there are people on both sides of this argument crossing the line.
It's getting to the point now where I for one don't want to join in with what could interesting debates because its getting tedious to do so.
It's getting to the point now where I for one don't want to join in with what could interesting debates because its getting tedious to do so.
Dave - I regret allowing myself to be cajoled into such pettiness. When someone decides to take a bizarre but undoubtedly ill-intentioned potshot directed at me, I do unfortunately lose my rag. Everything I said I stand by, but admittedly I should have just looked away and let the post hang itself rather than take the the topic into unhelpful territory, and for that I'm sorry.
Anyway, getting back to the story of the baby, I think there is another critical angle that has been missed and that is, despite all the wealth and privilege, I believe it very likely this child will be brought up deprived of a normal childhood. The psychological impact of all that pressure knowing that you are one day expected to take to the throne must be quite hard, not to mention the constant media attention. It's not an upbringing I would have wished for myself, that's for sure.
Anyway, getting back to the story of the baby, I think there is another critical angle that has been missed and that is, despite all the wealth and privilege, I believe it very likely this child will be brought up deprived of a normal childhood. The psychological impact of all that pressure knowing that you are one day expected to take to the throne must be quite hard, not to mention the constant media attention. It's not an upbringing I would have wished for myself, that's for sure.
James
TS Founding Member
Meat Pie said:
That's a very valid point indeed. However, the child will know no better. The child will be brought up in this media attention world, being 'trained' (so to speak) to deal with being a royal family member. I certainly wouldn't have wanted to have been brought up like that, but then I know no better than have being brought up in the middle class family I was. It wouldn't surprise me if the royals look at us and be glad they were not brought up like us.
Obviously all the media attention must be hard, that's certain. Although unlike the mainstream celeb world, the royals aren't always so vigorously under the microscope. They always go through phases of being in the limelight, then disappearing for while, then coming back out again. They do control their media attention pretty well.
Although I cannot deny this child will struggle a lot with the media, as this is going to be the biggest news in a long while. It's a feast for the media. I would assume the royal family will have lot of control 'training' up the child to deal with this however. I know training is such a strong word, although I'm not that all keen on them, and I do believe they try to mould people into their ways and train them up to deal with the media in such a way. Was probably why they din't like Diana so much as she didn't bow to their ways.
I guess the main point I'm making is. This child will be brought up in the perfect environment, one where the royal family can control how the child in brought up in the way they wish. So the child will know no better. They will just believe that childhood is experienced like that. You could argue that the child will realise it's wrong a little more when they are older, although by then it will be too late.