Ban all wristbands and "Pay one price".

[rob666]

Ok, debate elsewhere about crowd levels and big queues.
Thought it worth a topic.
Back in the day, we used to visit funfairs, big and small, for a few hours, spend a few quid on half a dozen rides, then go and do something else.
Queues were between walk on, and twenty minutes at worst...big new rides excepted.
Staff used to do checks at speed, one train out,next one on the platform.
Until I was in my twenties, I dont think ever queued more than ten minutes for the Grand National, as soon as the queue got to the steps, the second set of trains went on.
It took two minutes.
Now, to do the same number of rides on a summers day, takes all bloody day.
There is no incentive for parks with the POP system to maximise capacity...they have your money, you are at their mercy.
You want quicker rides, pay at least twenty quid extra, or get in the slow queue.
So, ban all bands and POP.
Pay per ride, either cash, ticket or electronically using witchcraft and moonbeams.
Great for those not too keen, knowing your mates will be back in ten minutes, not two hours.
For those with fat wallets who want to ride fifty rides in a day, extra money to build new rides.
And if the park wants to shut at five instead of seven, nobody feels cheated, you get your moneys worth with each ride.
Great for the parks, no skinflint pain in the bottom season passholders, and incentives to keep operations up to scratch.
Bet Merlin would have sorted out thirteens issues if they were missing out on a fiver per ride.
Ban all wristbands now.
They made parks crap.
Edit...and before anyone starts...sadly, I am aware it will never happen in a million years!
Lets not bring the truth into it.

 

[Kraken27]

Fully agree that park operations at BPB were far more efficient when the majority of guests paid per ride (but wristbands were also available). As you rightly say, if a ride was not performing as well as it should, the park was losing money.

I remember well the infamous scenes on BBC's "Pleasure Beach" of JR shouting at the engineers to fix rides faster [not his exact words mind!] & him telling his side-kick Keith to go and mark open the Alice in Wonderland queue whilst the ride was being repaired / the problem car taken off, as a closed queue = lost revenue.

Pay one price can be "done right" - you only have to look at the likes of Europa Park or Disney to prove that. Merlin have not quite got the same ideas unfortunately, as they seem to like a nice slow moving queue to boost Fastrack sales.

 

[Enter Valhalla]

£25 entry was what I paid for BPB when I last visited. Got on everything we wanted, got on many rides more than once.

To do the same if we were being forced to pay per ride would have cost significantly more and would have been very poor value. BPB and other parks do still work hard to get the queues moving quickly. They want people out of queues spending money on food, drink, souvenirs etc. If queues are long, guest satisfaction is reduced and people won’t recommend to friends or return. The parks still have plenty of motivation to get the queues moving efficiently.

A few years ago I visited a permanent fair in Vienna where no wristbands are available and pay per ride is the only option. I was there for only about 3 hours and spent well over £60 and didn’t get on anywhere near all the rides I wanted to. I’d never go back to this park.

Wristbands and POP are better value, people want bargains these days and like to plan visits in advance. These systems are here to stay.

 

[Thameslink Rail]

My stance is that Pay-One-Price doesn't need to go, fasttrack needs to go as fasttrack gives the park an incentive to increase queue times.

 

[Tim]

Pay per ride is not the only factor that has changed ride wait times. Massivley improved health and safety standards are probebly the biggest factor.

Having said that I do think all the payment models still have their place.
Whenever I visit Great Yarmouth I head over to the pleasure beach for a ride on the Roller Coaster before walking back down the seafront. It's a shame Blackpool no longer lets you do the same.
I'd love it if Alton Towers could have a 2 ticket price entry; one to visit the gardens and towers and the other to use the rides. Would give the gardens more reason to be considered an attraction in its own right, but is a bit hard to implement unless you force all ride guests to wear wristbands.
Then there are some place like Europa and Disney that you go to for the complete experience so pay one price works best.

 

[jon81uk]

25 entry was what I paid for BPB when I last visited. Got on everything we wanted, got on many rides more than once.

I remember back in about 2001 going to BPB and getting a discount on a ticket sheet and due to the different ticket letters it encourages us to go on a range of rides, we did everything we wanted to and it felt like a great day out. Wristbands might work out a bit cheaper, but I don’t think the day out feels as good as the queues are often worse.

I can also remember going to Drayton Manor in the early 90s when they still used wristbands and it was nice as my Mum who didn’t ride much didn’t pay for a band, just a couple of tickets for a few things plus the car parking.

 

[rob666]

£25 entry was what I paid for BPB when I last visited. Got on everything we wanted, got on many rides more than once.

To do the same if we were being forced to pay per ride would have cost significantly more and would have been very poor value. BPB and other parks do still work hard to get the queues moving quickly. They want people out of queues spending money on food, drink, souvenirs etc. If queues are long, guest satisfaction is reduced and people won’t recommend to friends or return. The parks still have plenty of motivation to get the queues moving efficiently.

A few years ago I visited a permanent fair in Vienna where no wristbands are available and pay per ride is the only option. I was there for only about 3 hours and spent well over £60 and didn’t get on anywhere near all the rides I wanted to. I’d never go back to this park.

Wristbands and POP are better value, people want bargains these days and like to plan visits in advance. These systems are here to stay.

Yup, you got a fun day, but many going in the holidays simply dont.
Two hour queues for the Big One are routine on one train.
And Vienna really isnt comparable to Blackpool, compare it to Winter Wonderland instead...similar pricing.
It all falls apart on busy days, it didnt with pay per ride.

 

[Enter Valhalla]

Winter Wonderland is exactly the same problem. Huge amount of money spent if you want to try even a handful of the rides. Therefore, unless you’re willing to spend £100+, you’ll leave disappointed as you’ll have walked past rides which look fun but which you can’t justify paying £5 for.

I’d also argue that the demand for pay per ride just isn’t there anymore, hence why Blackpool have moved away from it. Fewer people visiting Blackpool during off peak periods, more people staying at home (this was the case long before covid), hence why home related services such as Netflix, Just Eat, Deliveroo etc are now more popular than ever. People now want good value options to entice them out of their homes. Being offered all day riding for £25 seems like a good deal to people and will entice them out, even if it does mean waiting in longer queues than if it was pay per ride. This doesn’t matter to, or even occur to most people.

Every seaside park up and down the country now encourages wristbands. I know that some BPB fans don’t agree with this approach but it’s obviously what works for them, hence why they have kept this approach going for the past 15 years and hence why it was changed in the first place.

Now that prebooking is required in order to limit numbers, people now more than ever, plan their days in advance. It therefore makes even more sense to move away from pay per ride and towards pay one price.

 

[Themeparksandy1981]

I remember back in about 2001 going to BPB and getting a discount on a ticket sheet and due to the different ticket letters it encourages us to go on a range of rides, we did everything we wanted to and it felt like a great day out. Wristbands might work out a bit cheaper, but I don’t think the day out feels as good as the queues are often worse.

I can also remember going to Drayton Manor in the early 90s when they still used wristbands and it was nice as my Mum who didn’t ride much didn’t pay for a band, just a couple of tickets for a few things plus the car parking.

I agree with this as my mum wasn’t a big fan of spinning rides, Heights and coasters she was happy just paying for parking/zoo at the entrance booths and buying me and my sister wristbands while she brought tokens for herself as she only liked the Pirate Adventure, Splash Canyon and the Jungle Cruise.
I remember the bumper cars used to cost 4 tokens per car.

 

[rob666]

Still disagree Mr Valhalla, sorry.
The park was pretty much forced into wristbands to compete with Towers, after the 94 "coaster wars"...oh what a time that was.
If they went back to tickets/pay per ride, they could comfortably reduce opening hours in off peak times, say just opening three until eight to catch the after school/kids party market on school days, and for trippers/holidaymakers, there is plenty to do in the town before the park opens.
Wristbands mean all day opening, when there are regularly more staff than punters...massive costs for little revenue.
Tickets were fun, there were different types for different groups...white knuckle and family books...and lovely old British Rail used to give you four ride tickets (a,b,c,d) if you purchased an off peak return to the coast!
That tempted punters on the Beach to spend more.
Cant do lead in offers like that as easily with wristbands.

 

[jon81uk]

I agree with this as my mum wasn’t a big fan of spinning rides, Heights and coasters she was happy just paying for parking/zoo at the entrance booths and buying me and my sister wristbands while she brought tokens for herself as she only liked the Pirate Adventure, Splash Canyon and the Jungle Cruise.
I remember the bumper cars used to cost 4 tokens per car.

Pretty much exactly the same for us, those are the only three rides I remember going on at DM with my Mum. I think back then a majority at Drayton did have wristbands, it was already almost pay one price, it was mainly the non-riders who didn't get them which was useful to keep the cost down (and maybe one reason we did several Drayton visits and only one to Alton where it was already pay one price). I don't think the tickets/wristband thing made operations any better/worse at Drayton, as Rob says it was BPB where this was always more obvious.

 

[rob666]

Pay one price can be done right, but the Beach is a massively popular heritage park that is cramped within tight boundaries, they simply cannot manage queuetimes on busy days, queueing an hour fir every ride takes all the fun out.
The Turnpike (now Grand Prix) used to fill the tracke wth cars when it was a ticket (petrol) attraction.
Couldnt afford the gas on wristbands, so it went electric, and the number of cars was cut by half.
So the queuetime tripled overnight...less cars, more people.

 

[rob666]

One last one...double post...whip me.
Imagine how good the effects could be on Valhalla if the park were getting four quid a time for riding it instead of about two quid now.
They might turn the gas back up!
And still charge a few quid entry to keep the rabble out.

 

[Mikw]

Against pay per ride.

Last time i went BPB i got on ALL the major coasters, including 15 rides on Icon, all for £25 (ish).

How much would that cost on a pay per ride basis?

 

[Enter Valhalla]

I honestly don’t think that the town of Blackpool is busy enough (outside of August and illuminations weekends) to support a pay per ride option.

Visiting habits have changed since the 80s and 90s. People go abroad more. People stay home more. It’s just very different now. Every seaside park in the country has moved towards pushing wristbands and encouraging guests to prebook and therefore plan their visit in advance. This system must work for them otherwise why are they all doing it?

 

[Mr Pearse]

I think the days of pay per ride being viable are long gone in major parks. It was definitely a product of the time but unfortunately times move on to more efficient methods.

Pay one price is what people expect from a major park these days and they would spot straight away if it wasn’t value for money. I’d say most people are so used to cheap deals that it would just end up in backlash.

If and big if any of the merlin parks get sold off in the future, it will be interesting to see if the new owners stick to the 2-4-1 offers that people are used to and draws more people in or scrap it completely and try a different approach.

 

[rob666]

I honestly don’t think that the town of Blackpool is busy enough (outside of August and illuminations weekends) to support a pay per ride option.

Visiting habits have changed since the 80s and 90s. People go abroad more. People stay home more. It’s just very different now. Every seaside park in the country has moved towards pushing wristbands and encouraging guests to prebook and therefore plan their visit in advance. This system must work for them otherwise why are they all doing it?

Because they darent break the chain...all the others do it, they darent lose market share.
Like the supermarkets on home delivery,... not one single supermarket makes a profit on home delivery, but they all do it, and make a loss on it, because they have to protect their market share.
I was advised that every supermarket shopper is subsidising home deliveries, if that brand does delivery.
So I now shop at stores that dont deliver...why should I subsidise home delivery?
.
I agree Mr Pearse, people do spot poor value.
Thats why Altons attendance has dropped, and they have made a race to the bottom by playing the six flags "flog em cheap, hit em with the fastpass charge" on bargain basement season passes, to push numbers back up.
And that is why my best mates wife refuses to do the Towers with the kids...too long a wait for short rides (smiler excluded of course).
She went with work in the holidays...three rides in a day, and hated the fact that other people were "pushing in" with fasttrack...lovely way to create a two level park...pay double or get in the slow lane for an extra hour.
So merlin dont get their hotel stay and family of four tickets...it just isnt worth it for what you get.
Finally Mikw, I have had many visits like yours, and they are great, but I bet your visit wasnt in the school holidays, or a sunny Saturday, when all the queues tend to grind to a halt with speedypasses creating a two tier park...just not fair for the punter who gets three or four rides in a day for the price.

 

[shakey]

I honestly don’t think that the town of Blackpool is busy enough (outside of August and illuminations weekends) to support a pay per ride option.

Visiting habits have changed since the 80s and 90s. People go abroad more. People stay home more. It’s just very different now. Every seaside park in the country has moved towards pushing wristbands and encouraging guests to prebook and therefore plan their visit in advance. This system must work for them otherwise why are they all doing it?

But the change in visiting habits mean that people have less time, because they are visiting seaside towns for shorter breaks and day trips. Therefore they don't always want to spend a full day in an amusement park.

While most seaside parks now offer some sort of pay once options, they still cater for the pay per ride market which is a big source of income for them, especially at peak times. I would be very surprised if any other seaside park apart from Blackpool would be stupid enough to cut off the income they get from pay per ride custom.

A lot of families just want to let their kids go on a few rides while the parents/grand parents stand and watch. The pay per ride model if perfect for that.

I am not advocating a move back to pay per ride only at Blackpool, and I suspect that neither is @rob666. Let's face it, with the amount of visits rob usually makes in a season he is probably paying less per ride now than his parents would have paid to watch little rob have his fun in the 1970's !

 

[rob666]

Indeed, couple of years ago I worked out I got my ride costs down to about 20p...roughly the same price as a go on the Nash when I was first riding.
As I said at the start, I know it wont happen, but I have to have something to moan about when it rains.
Edit...started on the Southport Cyclone in the sixties, apparently.

 

[jon81uk]

While most seaside parks now offer some sort of pay once options, they still cater for the pay per ride market which is a big source of income for them, especially at peak times. I would be very surprised if any other seaside park apart from Blackpool would be stupid enough to cut off the income they get from pay per ride custom.

A lot of families just want to let their kids go on a few rides while the parents/grand parents stand and watch. The pay per ride model if perfect for that.

Parks like Dreamland aren't worth buying a wristband for at all in my opinion and couldn't operate as pay one price.

Blackpool of course has been operating on a one-price model for at least 20 years, although the "one price" back around 2000 was a ticket sheet, I doubt many people went for single tickets, but a sheet was a good way for several rides to fill most of a day and BPB also made a bigger deal of their shows which also filled the day up.