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Coronavirus

Coronavirus - The Poll

  • Total voters
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Jonathan said:
Not to mention it’s an absolute nightmare for those like us who are on the autism spectrum!
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Oh yep, I'm using AAC basically full time at work now to help manage energy levels and IL still only just scraping by with all the change, closed season is going to be interesting...
 
My concern is that people are so fatigued by the restrictions we've had for six months that they are no longer interested. If people don't care, if they consider the deaths are now inevitable and worth it for some normality, then the appetite for following the rules fades, compliance drops and things will just get worse over winter.

You can see why the second peak is the most dangerous.
 
Craig said:
The new "rule of six" is easier to understand, the problem was the previous ones where there were separate rules for indoors and outdoors, not to mention law changing to guidance etc. That's where the confusion came in I think.

But, that's where the problem comes in I think. There's been a lot of changes back and forth, and a lot of public support for the restrictions has wasted away as a result.
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But there has only been one change, that was last week. It hasn't gone back and fourth significantly.

It was two households indoors, or groups of six outdoors.
 
Let's be honest. At this point if people are going to be out and about with random rules about how many people you can meet etc but pretty much everything is open you're always going to get enough people breaking the rules and spreading the virus. The only way to stop it from spreading is to get people back into the version of lock-down we had earlier in the year. Lock-down or let it spread. That's your choice, until everyone gets vaccinated.
 
imanautie said:
Oh yep, I'm using AAC basically full time at work now to help manage energy levels and IL still only just scraping by with all the change, closed season is going to be interesting...
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I've got a coping strategy as well. It's called 'a bottle of wine on a Saturday night'. :p And for the record, that's the only alcohol I'm drinking at all in the week, unless I go out somewhere, in which case I'll limit myself to one or two drinks.
 
BarryZola said:
Let's be honest. At this point if people are going to be out and about with random rules about how many people you can meet etc but pretty much everything is open you're always going to get enough people breaking the rules and spreading the virus. The only way to stop it from spreading is to get people back into the version of lock-down we had earlier in the year. Lock-down or let it spread. That's your choice, until everyone gets vaccinated.
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I don't see how you are going from people out and about means they will break the rules.

I went out to the pub, all the tables were for six people, lots of perspex screens inbetween, I met two friends and we had some drinks. Nothing made me feel like it was ok to further break the rules.

Just because it is OK to do one thing doesn't mean it is OK to break rules.
 
jon81uk said:
I don't see how you are going from people out and about means they will break the rules.
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So why's it spreading more now then? A lot of people (especially in this country) can't be relied upon to be sensible. Just because people follow the rules when they go for a nice sit down meal doesn't mean everyone in the country is behaving. People grouping up in houses, not following social distancing at work, sitting 15 inches away from the person on the next table at McDonalds. It's absolute fact that all of these things are happening and the list goes on. Just because you want to believe that people can and will follow the rules doesn't make it true.

It honestly doesn't bother me either way. I can do lock-down or just go back to absolute pre-Covid normal, but let's not pretend that ENOUGH people are giving avoiding each other a proper go, because they aren't.
 
jon81uk said:
But there has only been one change, that was last week. It hasn't gone back and fourth significantly.

It was two households indoors, or groups of six outdoors.
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But legally the groups of six outdoors prior to last week was guidance, not law. The legally enforced number was 30 people. That created considerable confusion, in fact people were surprised that it was originally so high (see this topic's posts when it was announced). Prior to that, there were changes from law to guidance for gatherings when lockdown lifted too.

But I'm not specifically only talking about the rule of six though, I'm talking about the changes as a whole and the way they are communicated in general which creates confusion. Local lockdowns announced on Twitter with nothing from the council for hours as they haven't been briefed, certain journalists being briefed a day or two before. That needs to stop. It creates uncertainty and confuses the public unnecessarily. The more that happens, the more people become annoyed, and the less supportive they are of what is being asked of them.

One piece of legislation alone - The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (No. 2) has been amended 4 times since it was first laid in mid-July and is now some 2100 words from 800 words. In some cases, these amendments have been laid just minutes before they come into law. That's not acceptable when businesses, councils and the police are relying on the detail within these to help enforce them, or those in the legal world who would like to scrutinise them.

It should be said that I am for rules to be in place to try and reduce the virus spreading, but it needs to be done properly, and so far that hasn't been the case. A prime example that had the potential to affect me directly was the "north east lockdown". Constant rumours flying around for days, and people from across my area being confused because the initial briefings to MPs and later to journalists were not clear enough in specifying the areas affected. Then the changes are announced but the old phrase "the details will come tomorrow/later" is what brings out the annoyance from people.
 
Craig said:
But legally the groups of six outdoors prior to last week was guidance, not law. The legally enforced number was 30 people. That created considerable confusion, in fact people were surprised that it was originally so high (see this topic's posts when it was announced). Prior to that, there were changes from law to guidance for gatherings when lockdown lifted too.

But I'm not specifically only talking about the rule of six though, I'm talking about the changes as a whole and the way they are communicated in general which creates confusion. Local lockdowns announced on Twitter with nothing from the council for hours as they haven't been briefed, certain journalists being briefed a day or two before. That needs to stop. It creates uncertainty and confuses the public unnecessarily. The more that happens, the more people become annoyed, and the less supportive they are of what is being asked of them.

One piece of legislation alone - The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (No. 2) has been amended 4 times since it was first laid in mid-July and is now some 2100 words from 800 words. In some cases, these amendments have been laid just minutes before they come into law. That's not acceptable when businesses, councils and the police are relying on the detail within these to help enforce them, or those in the legal world who would like to scrutinise them.

It should be said that I am for rules to be in place to try and reduce the virus spreading, but it needs to be done properly, and so far that hasn't been the case. A prime example that had the potential to affect me directly was the "north east lockdown". Constant rumours flying around for days, and people from across my area being confused because the initial briefings to MPs and later to journalists were not clear enough in specifying the areas affected. Then the changes are announced but the old phrase "the details will come tomorrow/later" is what brings out the annoyance from people.
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It's not even like they can claim they didn't have time to annouce it properly, if they have time to say "we will do something in a few days" they have time to annouce more details.
 
Pubs with people “crammed in like sardines” are breaking the law and should be closed down.
The rules are already simple but I’m also ok with table service only and wearing masks unless sitting down at a desk / table or exercising indoors.
However they need to be enforced and swiftly, either the coppers or shop keepers do it or they need to legalise giving a swift right hook to offenders, I’m happy either way.
 
BarryZola said:
So why's it spreading more now then? A lot of people (especially in this country) can't be relied upon to be sensible. Just because people follow the rules when they go for a nice sit down meal doesn't mean everyone in the country is behaving. People grouping up in houses, not following social distancing at work, sitting 15 inches away from the person on the next table at McDonalds. It's absolute fact that all of these things are happening and the list goes on. Just because you want to believe that people can and will follow the rules doesn't make it true.

It honestly doesn't bother me either way. I can do lock-down or just go back to absolute pre-Covid normal, but let's not pretend that ENOUGH people are giving avoiding each other a proper go, because they aren't.
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Yes people are breaking the rules. They are having large house parties, or pub owners are allowing bigger tables to form. But the fact that some activities are allowed to happen doesn't excuse the fact that people are doing things that aren't allowed to happen.

You don't stop everyone from driving at 70mph on the motorway, just because some people drive too fast in a city.
If everyone was sensible and stuck to the guidance then lockdowns wouldn't be needed.
Although not enough of the offenders are being punished I think. If more fines were issued then hopefully people will take it more seriously.

Just because places are open and some things are allowed to happen, shouldn't excuse those who do things that shouldn't happen.
 
Craig said:
But legally the groups of six outdoors prior to last week was guidance, not law. The legally enforced number was 30 people. That created considerable confusion, in fact people were surprised that it was originally so high (see this topic's posts when it was announced). Prior to that, there were changes from law to guidance for gatherings when lockdown lifted too.

But I'm not specifically only talking about the rule of six though, I'm talking about the changes as a whole and the way they are communicated in general which creates confusion. Local lockdowns announced on Twitter with nothing from the council for hours as they haven't been briefed, certain journalists being briefed a day or two before. That needs to stop. It creates uncertainty and confuses the public unnecessarily. The more that happens, the more people become annoyed, and the less supportive they are of what is being asked of them.

One piece of legislation alone - The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (No. 2) has been amended 4 times since it was first laid in mid-July and is now some 2100 words from 800 words. In some cases, these amendments have been laid just minutes before they come into law. That's not acceptable when businesses, councils and the police are relying on the detail within these to help enforce them, or those in the legal world who would like to scrutinise them.

It should be said that I am for rules to be in place to try and reduce the virus spreading, but it needs to be done properly, and so far that hasn't been the case. A prime example that had the potential to affect me directly was the "north east lockdown". Constant rumours flying around for days, and people from across my area being confused because the initial briefings to MPs and later to journalists were not clear enough in specifying the areas affected. Then the changes are announced but the old phrase "the details will come tomorrow/later" is what brings out the annoyance from people.
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Oh yes communication of local lockdown have been awful. Also announcing things on a Friday that come into effect next week just encourages "one last night out" behaviour. The communication of local stuff should have been left a lot more to each council.

For the socialising rules though I don't think it should directly matter what the law was in terms of what people actually do. If the guidance said to meet one other household, then being the person who says "but technically the law means I can do this" just makes them sound like a dick.
 
I think if we had the actual logistics in place to support another lockdown/circuit breaker/whatever you want to call it then I'd potentially be more supportive.

However, a lockdown not only serves to suppress the spread of the virus, the aim was supposed to buy us time. It was time to allow plans to be put in place with the NHS, to allow patient numbers to drop and the most important and critical thing was to prepare an effective testing and contact tracing system. The latter has clearly not happened, and that's my concern about whether a lockdown is really worth it at the moment. With a testing system which has clearly collapsed, what would we gain two weeks further down the line?

And this is where the blame cannot be put on the general public. Testing and contact tracing were shouted about from the word go, and yet we're all these months down the line and the whole thing is a shambles again.
 
Craig said:
I think if we had the actual logistics in place to support another lockdown/circuit breaker/whatever you want to call it then I'd potentially be more supportive.

However, a lockdown not only serves to suppress the spread of the virus, the aim was supposed to buy us time. It was time to allow plans to be put in place with the NHS, to allow patient numbers to drop and the most important and critical thing was to prepare an effective testing and contact tracing system. The latter has clearly not happened, and that's my concern about whether a lockdown is really worth it at the moment. With a testing system which has clearly collapsed, what would we gain two weeks further down the line?

And this is where the blame cannot be put on the general public. Testing and contact tracing were shouted about from the word go, and yet we're all these months down the line and the whole thing is a shambles again.
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I agree. Test and trace has been a shambles and I really don't think two weeks lockdown will help much.

Some proper enforcement of bars/pubs which don't have effective methods to control distancing and enforcing sitting at tables would help. A 10pm closure enforcement may also help weed out those venues which are allowing too many people to get too drunk and not distance properly.

But closing shops and workplaces again probably won't help all that much other than to put everything on hold for a few weeks.
 
Actually does a lot of this boil down to British drinking culture? Of getting together with the "lads", getting hammered and not caring what happens?
 
jon81uk said:
Some proper enforcement of bars/pubs which don't have effective methods to control distancing and enforcing sitting at tables would help. A 10pm closure enforcement may also help weed out those venues which are allowing too many people to get too drunk and not distance properly.
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Yup completely agree with you on that front. A trip to Newcastle walking past some of the late bars a few weeks ago and the state of some people later showed why those earlier closures would help. Ideally I'd love to see table service mainly due to being a lazy arse, but one person at the bar with a collection point further down should be the absolute minimum. That's worked in the vast majority of cases when visiting most decent bars.
 
The big difference we gonna have with the start of Autumn tomorrow is the nights are getting shorter and it’s gonna start to get colder so people will be indoors more.
 
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