• ℹ️ Heads up...

    This is a popular topic that is fast moving Guest - before posting, please ensure that you check out the first post in the topic for a quick reminder of guidelines, and importantly a summary of the known facts and information so far. Thanks.

Coronavirus

Coronavirus - The Poll

  • Total voters
    97
Sorry for double posting, but it would appear that Boris Johnson will be making an address tomorrow, outlining plans to return “normal life” in England by Easter 2021, including a break from restrictions for between 3 and 5 days over Christmas: https://apple.news/AGyYxSSw7TqKaHHG68LcHvA

Key points of interest include:
  • When the national lockdown in England ends on 2nd December, the country will go into a modified version of the previous tier system. It is rumoured that pubs & restaurants will be allowed to open until 11pm with last orders at 10pm, but that the tiers will be significantly toughened in other aspects.
  • There will possibly be a break from restrictions over the Christmas period, with up to 3 households possibly being allowed to form a large bubble. This break will last for between 3 and 5 days (the length hasn’t been agreed yet) before a return to the toughened tiers between January and March.
  • By March 2021, it is hoped that a vaccination program will be in full swing, with a substantial percentage of the population either having been vaccinated or due to get vaccinated.
  • The government is mulling over the idea of introducing “COVID passports”, which will allow those who have been vaccinated to effectively return to normal life.
The government and SAGE are said to be agreeing the final details today before an announcement from Boris himself tomorrow.

What do we all think of these new proposals, if proven true tomorrow?
 
Matt N said:
Sorry for double posting, but it would appear that Boris Johnson will be making an address tomorrow, outlining plans to return “normal life” in England by Easter 2021, including a break from restrictions for between 3 and 5 days over Christmas: https://apple.news/AGyYxSSw7TqKaHHG68LcHvA

Key points of interest include:
  • When the national lockdown in England ends on 2nd December, the country will go into a modified version of the previous tier system. It is rumoured that pubs & restaurants will be allowed to open until 11pm with last orders at 10pm, but that the tiers will be significantly toughened in other aspects.
  • There will possibly be a break from restrictions over the Christmas period, with up to 3 households possibly being allowed to form a large bubble. This break will last for between 3 and 5 days (the length hasn’t been agreed yet) before a return to the toughened tiers between January and March.
  • By March 2021, it is hoped that a vaccination program will be in full swing, with a substantial percentage of the population either having been vaccinated or due to get vaccinated.
  • The government is mulling over the idea of introducing “COVID passports”, which will allow those who have been vaccinated to effectively return to normal life.
The government and SAGE are said to be agreeing the final details today before an announcement from Boris himself tomorrow.

What do we all think of these new proposals, if proven true tomorrow?
Click to expand...

I disagree with the Christmas covid break. The lockdown is hurting so many businesses. The sooner we suppress the virus the better. There will be people that will ignore the lockdown rules over Christmas and will be meeting up with family what ever the rules, but there will also be people that will have the sense not to meet up with family members over Christmas despite the government allowing it. There have been other religious festivals and celebrations over the past year that had to adapt and abide by the lockdown and covid rules, so this should not be any different for the Christians. We are talking about 1 day here, family mixing could undo all the hard work of the lockdown. Why can't we just all stick with a social distancing Christmas and once everyone has been vaccinated, why don't we have an extra special bank holiday next year to make up for it during the summer where families can meet up for a meal and celebrate the end of the pandemic?

What about our NHS staff who won't be taking a day off over Christmas, they still have to work, they won't be meeting up with family, do they deserve a break? They will be the ones picking up the pieces when hospital rate spiral out of control again.

Don't forget, this government is following the science (I don't think so :rolleyes:)

E3iZi8t.jpg
 
I agree, Christmas is one day, we can all use a phone still, I don’t get what’s so special about it.
However we do need to get the shops open again, this is peak time for nearly all shops, if they can’t open from December 3rd then majority of them will go bust.

We will see what the announcement brings but I don’t agree with this passport rubbish, the likelihood is everyone under 50 is not going to see a vaccine this side of next Christmas or even ever unless you have medical conditions or pay for it.
 
Last edited:
Perhaps they should let all the churchgoing Christians out for a couple of days, but keep all the heathens and worshippers of other religions chained to their radiators.
 
BigT said:
the likelihood is everyone under 50 is not going to see a vaccine this side of next Christmas or even ever unless you have medical conditions or pay for it.
Click to expand...

I think the government are being a bit over ambitious in thinking that they will get everyone vaccinated by the end of march next year. Bear in mind that half of the population have either said no to having the vaccine or will put it off to see how it goes just to see if anyone falls ill with unforeseen side effects. So I can imagine that those that are keen on having the vaccine might receive theirs sooner than they think.

With regards to anyone with a medical condition, I can tell you that the government criteria for this is very small and the goal post on this has been tightened even more since the summer. Considering that 75% of those that die have some form of underlying health condition, and the health conditions are not always considered serious. We have been following the advice of Jess' Dr's and hospital consultants and not the governments. There are many people with serious medical conditions that are self shielding but are not on the government shielding list. Not everyone with a lung condition or immune condition are on the shielding list. You have to meet a strict criteria and this is very tiny. Jess' medical condition is not even listed for the moderately vulnerable list, so we are unsure if she will get her vaccine before me or if she will be pushed to the bottom of the pile as usual.
 
RoyJess said:
Bear in mind that half of the population have either said no to having the vaccine or will put it off to see how it goes just to see if anyone falls ill with unforeseen side effects.
Click to expand...
This seems overly pessimistic. Whilst there no doubt will be a proportion of society who are, err, sceptical about the vaccine (i.e. complete and utter idiots), it will hopefully not be a large percentage - certainly nowhere near 50% - with the vast majority of the population either well informed enough to realise that having the vaccine is a no-brainer, or desperate enough for normality to resume to just get it done.`
 
RoyJess said:
I think the government are being a bit over ambitious in thinking that they will get everyone vaccinated by the end of march next year. Bear in mind that half of the population have either said no to having the vaccine or will put it off to see how it goes just to see if anyone falls ill with unforeseen side effects. So I can imagine that those that are keen on having the vaccine might receive theirs sooner than they think.

With regards to anyone with a medical condition, I can tell you that the government criteria for this is very small and the goal post on this has been tightened even more since the summer. Considering that 75% of those that die have some form of underlying health condition, and the health conditions are not always considered serious. We have been following the advice of Jess' Dr's and hospital consultants and not the governments. There are many people with serious medical conditions that are self shielding but are not on the government shielding list. Not everyone with a lung condition or immune condition are on the shielding list. You have to meet a strict criteria and this is very tiny. Jess' medical condition is not even listed for the moderately vulnerable list, so we are unsure if she will get her vaccine before me or if she will be pushed to the bottom of the pile as usual.
Click to expand...

But quite rightly she should be above the fit and able under 50, that’s kind of the point I’m making, by having a so called passport system and saying those that have had the jab can go back to a normal life they will make a mad rush for it amongst those that don’t really need it.
 
Islander said:
This seems overly pessimistic. Whilst there no doubt will be a proportion of society who are, err, sceptical about the vaccine (i.e. complete and utter idiots), it will hopefully not be a large percentage - certainly nowhere near 50% - with the vast majority of the population either well informed enough to realise that having the vaccine is a no-brainer, or desperate enough for normality to resume to just get it done.`
Click to expand...

When I said half, it was just a figure of speech :rolleyes:

I know people that definitively won't take it up for one reason or another, they either don't believe in vaccines or have a needle phobia.
 
RoyJess said:
When I said half, it was just a figure of speech :rolleyes:

I know people that definitively won't take it up for one reason or another, they either don't believe in vaccines or have a needle phobia.
Click to expand...
"Half the population" is not a figure of speech, it's a statistic, that in this case is wildly wrong :p

I would have serious problems remaining on good terms with anyone I know if I were to discover that they "don't believe in vaccines" - that's just a whole new level of dumb.

As for fear of needles... yeh I get that, I'm not a needle fan myself. However, the vast majority of those really just need to get over it, and have the vaccine. And I'm sure they will. It's only a very, very small subset of these who have such severe trypanophobia that it honestly isn't worth the temporary stress/anxiety/fear to attempt to push life back to normality.

But, even considering this small minority of people, and the (unfortunately) probably not-so-small minority of idiots who think they know better than vaccine science, remember that you don't need to vaccinate 100% of a population to achieve herd immunity. It just has to be hoped that enough of the population is vaccinated that this can be achieved.
 
RoyJess said:
You have to meet a strict criteria and this is very tiny. Jess' medical condition is not even listed for the moderately vulnerable list, so we are unsure if she will get her vaccine before me or if she will be pushed to the bottom of the pile as usual.
Click to expand...

Sound like jess's consultant would not bat an eyelid at writing a letter of need for the vaccination for her and you.

Sadly in this day and age just getting a letter of a consultant will not guaranty the vaccination.
Awkward question asked to the right people in the right way gets results. Unfortunately that way is in the public eye.

Sent from my SM-J600FN using Tapatalk
 
Islander said:
"Half the population" is not a figure of speech, it's a statistic, that in this case is wildly wrong :p
Click to expand...

If you want to be pedantic, then that's your problem not mine. Do you know the meaning of "A Figure Of Speech"? There is no statistics on the vaccine up take as this is yet to be rolled out, but there have been various surveys published over the past few months showing a whole range of various percentage of people that would, would not and unsure about the vaccine uptake. So my assumptions are based on those surveys. So there is no current statistics on the actual vaccine uptake.


Islander said:
I would have serious problems remaining on good terms with anyone I know if I were to discover that they "don't believe in vaccines" - that's just a whole new level of dumb.
Click to expand...

I know a lot of people, only a small handful of them are what I call good friends. I also family members (not from my side) who won't take up the vaccine as well as I'm also a member of several forums just like this one where people have already express that they will either not be taking up the vaccine or are in no hurry to have it. As much as I agree with you that anyone that don't believe in vaccines is just a whole new level of dumb, I have to also respect that people are entitled to their own opinions, even if we completely disagree.

delta79 said:
Sound like jess's consultant would not bat an eyelid at writing a letter of need for the vaccination for her and you.

Sadly in this day and age just getting a letter of a consultant will not guaranty the vaccination.
Awkward question asked to the right people in the right way gets results. Unfortunately that way is in the public eye.
Click to expand...

Trust me, we are in good contact with both our GP and consultant. They said that the government criteria is very strict and out of their hands. They have many people on their books that are at very high risk, but fall fail of the criteria. Unfortunately the government over rules the consultants, they don't have a say.

Hopefully if the NHS time line that I recently posted is achieved, we all should have a vaccine by the summer which is good enough for Jess and me. I think the government would want to roll out the vaccine no longer than required as this pandemic is really hurting the economy.
 
The vaccine itself is not what will put an end to restrictions and allow life to return to nomral. It is the reduction in cases and hospital admissions that the vaccine will hopefully lead to that will allow for that to happen. Obviously you are going to need a certain percentage of the population to receive a vaccine for there to be a real impact, however we do not know what the figure is yet. It could be 40%, it could be 70%. Also whether or not any of the vaccines stop transmission as well as prevent disease will be a key factor. Again we do not know this yet.

I get why people might be wary of having a fastracked vaccine. But one of the main reaons they have been able to develop these vaccines so quickly is because of the resources made available that are not usually there. Never before has there been so much money thrown the way of vaccine development nor such a large number of volunteers eager to take part in trials. These two things alone have really helped speed up development.

I'll be happy to have the vaccine when/if I become eligible. Right now I am just desperate to have some sort of social life again in 2021.
 
Covid has been estimated to need a population immunity of 60-70% to achieve the effects of herd immunity. With a vaccine that is 90% effective you would need 70-80% of the population to get vaccinated to achieve that.

I believe the recent polls suggest 60-70% of people in the UK are willing to be vaccinated, with 20% in the definite no group. That’s better than the USA where around 50% of people are saying they won’t get vaccinated.
 
I’m surprised that it hasn’t been mentioned yet that AstraZeneca’s efficacy results came back today; on average, the vaccine was 70% effective, but it could achieve up to 90% effectiveness with modification of the dosage.

While it may not quite hit the heights of Moderna and Pfizer’s vaccines, it is still well above the initially anticipated threshold of 50% efficacy, and AstraZeneca’s vaccine is very cheap and easy to store, making it a brilliant choice for low and middle income countries.
 
Jonathan said:
The fact we've got three potential vaccines for a disease that was only identified less than a year ago, and all with very good effectiveness rates, speaks wonders for the people behind them. It's a truly astonishing achievement.
Click to expand...
I couldn’t agree more; really proves that you can make anything possible if you put enough effort in!

As it’s now looking like we could be beginning to see the first vaccines administered before the end of 2020; I’m happy to say that for the first time in this pandemic, it looks as though optimism may be winning out!
 
The full rundown of the "new" tier system restrictions can be found here on the government website.

The rules for meeting others appear to be:
Tier 1: Rule of 6 indoors or out
Tier 2: Rule of 6 outdoors only
Tier 3: Rule of 6 in public outdoor spaces

One of the things I've never understood concerning the restrictions is, what's the bloody difference between meeting in a private garden or in a park?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top