Coronavirus

Discussion in 'Corner Coffee' started by Jb85, 14th Feb 2020.

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Coronavirus - The Poll

  1. Not had test

    41.1%
  2. Tested negative

    50.7%
  3. Tested positive

    8.2%
  1. Dave

    Dave TS Founding Member

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    Now I know who gave me the cold!

    Anyway vaccine passports unfortunately have the habit of reducing vaccine uptake (when you force someone to do something and are so minded they assume there are nefarious intentions).

    They also hold questionable benefit on preventing transmission since delta. The places that would have required them would likely had such high viral loads that delta would have still spread if you had an infection person in the venue. I suspect that’s why the scientists didn’t push the passport issue with a government who is ideologically opposed to them. It made more sense for France when they implemented theirs as the delta variant hadn’t yet took off, so will be interesting to see how it progresses.
     
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  2. delta79

    delta79 TowersStreet Member

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    Thats a advance of masks. It knock down the number of cases of colds and flu last winter.

    Sent from my SM-A217F using Tapatalk
     
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  3. Matt N

    Matt N TowersStreet Member

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    I’ll admit I’m quite unsure on the issue of vaccine passports myself.

    I’ll preface this by saying that I’m by no means an anti-vaxxer or COVID denier. Throughout 2020 and 2021, I’ve probably been among the more COVID conscious folk. I’ve always worn a mask in many areas (even though they’re not mandated anymore, I still wear a mask in crowded spaces, shops, and indoor areas, amongst other places), and even now, I still try and give people a little distance in situations like queues where I’m able to. When I was first offered my jab, I’ll admit that I felt bad about getting it ahead of those who are more deserving (I was in group 6 due to having autism), but I was very keen to get it; not out of wanting to protect myself, as I know that I personally am at very little risk from COVID, but out of wanting to protect others. I’ll admit I’m not the best with needles, and I was incredibly nervous before going to get my jabs, but I went and got them anyway because I think the pros vastly outweigh the cons for me, personally,

    Because of the fact there was a high chance of me having had asymptomatic COVID in April 2020 (I was never tested, but rest of the family either tested positive or had symptoms), that scared me a bit; I didn’t want to go out and be unwittingly spreading COVID to someone who’s immune system perhaps isn’t as capable at fighting it off. What if I innocently went out with asymptomatic COVID, passed it onto someone’s vulnerable relative or friend and ultimately ended up hospitalising or killing them? That would always hang on my conscience, and it’s the knock-on effects on other people I’ve always been incredibly worried about…

    However, in spite of that, other people have very different takes on COVID restrictions and vaccines, and Britain is a country of free speech and free opinion. I think that if some people don’t want to take the vaccine for whatever reason, then they should be given that right without being persecuted for it. Some people have concerns about the vaccine, and while I don’t personally share those concerns, I ultimately think people should have a right to have those concerns without being persecuted for it.

    I’m diagnosed with ASD, and I technically qualify for a sunflower lanyard, mask exemption pass or whatever, but I would personally never dream of redeeming that right because I’d be too worried about what effect I might have on others. However, some people find things like masks far harder to cope with, and I think that those who find it hard to cope with masks should be granted respite from the measures; in a time that’s been hard for everyone, mental health should come first. I think if you’re not a sunflower lanyard holder yourself, then it’s easy to underestimate how much some people might struggle with the measures currently in places. What is a minor inconvenience for some might be absolute torture for others, and genuinely give them panic attacks, claustrophobia or whatever. I personally think it’s important to make the world inclusive, and as liveable as possible for everyone on it, and we can’t do that without accommodating everyone’s specific needs.

    So what I’m basically trying to say is that I’m somewhat uneasy about the prospect of vaccine passports, in spite of not personally being anti-vaccine or anti-COVID myself. I feel like as much as vaccines are brilliant at allaying the pandemic, and I would certainly encourage someone to get the vaccine if they were undecided, I’m a bit unsure on the idea of persecuting people who don’t want the vaccine for whatever reason, as it is ultimately their right to choose not to.
     
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  4. Benzin

    Benzin TowersStreet Member

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    Again, having freedom of speech does not mean you are exempt from the consequences of your beliefs or actions.

    The main benefit of a vaccine passport is to allow those who cannot (that's CANNOT, not will not) get a vaccine for whatever reason to feel safe to go out to an event. That people over the past year have been generating fake vaccine cards anyway shows the sort of pig-headedness we're having to deal with. There are some out there who probably have valid concerns over not getting a vaccine, but those who listen to those spouting nonsense on Fox News (where said newscaster likely has been vaccinated) are just the absolute worst kind of people.

    It frustrates me no end that see people online openly making up things that aren't true and it runs. Just nonsense going on and on and it's no wonder we're in such a bad state. The belief that the pandemic is over is widespread and its a concern going into the winter.

    Then again that aspect of openly lying with no recourse has been going on for so long. You can literally say something like "you won't be able to call people at work darling, pet, duck, etc because IT'S OFFENSIVE" and people will parrot it even though its quite clearly not something that will ever happen.

    I hate people.
     
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  5. Alsty

    Alsty TowersStreet Member

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    At the risk of opening up a whole ethical debate, which approach is more palatable:
    • Moderate restrictions for everybody
    • Minimal restrictions for the vaccinated, stronger restrictions for the unvaccinated
    As @AstroDan said, it's the fact people have been vaccinated that has opened up the ability for a return to normality. Why should those people have to suffer restrictions simply because there are some who refuse to do so*?

    The irony that those who sit in the "anti-vax" camp probably also sit in the "anti-lockdown" camp doesn't escape me either.

    * on non-medical grounds ofc.
     
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  6. Dave

    Dave TS Founding Member

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    There are actually quite a lot of restrictions on the unvaccinated, they pretty much can’t go on holiday.

    That said i have no moral issue with vaccine passports now everyone has had an opportunity to get one (i disagreed when a whole load of old folk started asking for them when the under 40’s hadn’t been offered one yet, the baby boomers in this country are such a selfish bunch).

    I don’t however think they will make much difference with Delta, particularly when you consider 90% of eligible people have had a vaccine in this country and some of the remaining 10% are not allowed to have one we don’t have a huge “anti-fax” population in this country, they are just very loud.
     
  7. Matt N

    Matt N TowersStreet Member

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    An interesting thing for me to bring up is that I don’t actually know anyone who has rejected the vaccine. Everyone I know personally, from family to people in sixth form, who was offered the vaccine took it.

    I did pass someone at Thorpe Park the other day wearing a t-shirt that said “No Vaccines. No 5G. Stop The Conspiracy.”, but that’s the closest encounter I’ve ever had with a vaccine rejector; everyone I know personally took it.
     
  8. geo4chg

    geo4chg TowersStreet Member

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    I was exactly the same with vaccine passports - when they first started getting talked about I hadn't even because eligible for my 1st vaccination, let alone had 2, and it seemed to reward others a similar age to me that had "jumped the queue" (I know someone who is 31 that volunteered at a food bank in order to get the vaccine and then never did the actual volunteering - getting her vaccine before even cancer patients became eligible).

    The issue in this country is this perception of things being an "assault on our freedoms" - people claim having to wear a face mask to buy a newspaper is an "assault on our freedoms", that working from home is an "assault on our freedoms", that being part of the EU was an "assault on our freedoms" - people need to grow up, recognise the severity and impact of this pandemic and accept that in order to save lives some "sacrifices" (if you can call wearing a face mask that) need to be made. The trouble is a lot of people are simply selfish.
     
  9. Plastic Person

    Plastic Person TowersStreet Member

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    This was possibly just an actor employed by Thorpe Park to add atmosphere.
     
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  10. Matt N

    Matt N TowersStreet Member

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    I don’t think it was; they looked like a member of the public to me.
     
  11. Plastic Person

    Plastic Person TowersStreet Member

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    Sorry Matt, I was using sarcasm in a lazy attempt to satirise Thorpe Park's well-worn dependence on miserable themes. I'm sure it was a member of the public (and a member of the public looking for a fight, by the sounds of it).
     
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  12. Matt N

    Matt N TowersStreet Member

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    Ah, that’s OK! To be honest, Merlin doing a COVID theme wouldn’t be the most surprising thing given their penchant for dark themes, especially on thrill rides…
     
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  13. rob666

    rob666 TowersStreet Member

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    "The baby boomers in this country are such a selfish bunch..."
    Oof.
    Prejudice of all kinds is wrong, but age prejudice is acceptable these days.
    Kiss my whip.
    Didn't want the comment to go without making my point.
     
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  14. Matt N

    Matt N TowersStreet Member

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  15. Funcone

    Funcone TowersStreet Member

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    The arguments around things like vaccine passports are quite complex, and it’s easy to oversimplify these things. I understand the death rate is very low for younger people, who tend to visit things like nightclubs. But you can still get pretty ill without dying, and it’s not ideal to have people unnecessarily clogging up hospital beds.

    I accept that we won’t get rid of the virus, but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t try to get the R rate below 1, rather than letting it rip through the population. According to a scientist writing in the Guardian the other day, someone who’s double vaccinated (presumably a couple of weeks after their second dose) has less than 50% the chance of catching Covid from a like for like interaction, compared to someone who hasn’t been vaccinated. Of course that still means a lot of double jabbed people can catch Covid, particularly in a poorly ventilated, crowded space like a nightclub. But if you can more than halve the chance of catching it, that seems like a positive development. Particularly given that the more it spreads, the more likely we are to get a mutation.

    Some people seem to see tax and vaccines as a punishment. They forget that taxes are there to fund our public services, and that vaccines are there to save lives and to get us out of a pandemic. We’re not asking people to run into a burning building. We’re not asking them to jump into a raging river. We’re not asking them to diffuse a bomb. We’re asking them to get a quick jab. It’s hardly very onerous. What’s the opposite of a hero?
     
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  16. JAperson

    JAperson TowersStreet Member

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    This shall be an interesting one as realistically if you are vaccinated do you need to be tested to enter the country? Many countries have started to release this and are letting fulling vaccinated people in.
     
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  17. Skyscraper

    Skyscraper TowersStreet Member

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  18. GaryH

    GaryH TowersStreet Member

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  19. rob666

    rob666 TowersStreet Member

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    My hair is naturally jet black, but I dye it grey to make me look wise and mature.
     
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  20. AstroDan

    AstroDan TS Forum Team Team Member

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    UK case rate is highest in Europe. Most people jabbed although rates of vaccination are now higher in several other countries, including France. Why is this? Where is the "herd immunity"? Is there a problem or is having the highest in Europe of no concern given hospitals are coping.

    Thoughts?
     
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