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Disneyland Paris: General Discussion

Matt, you’re right in saying that Disney is essentially trading off of a blend on nostalgia and reputation. That will obviously bring in visitors. As has been pointed out though, you can only trade off past glories for so long before the gloss wears off. Visitors to WDW now will probably be less glowing in their reviews compared to people visiting 20 years ago - primarily because it’s more expensive, offers less and is busier.

It’ll take time for Disney’s current actions to work through as it’s a very strong brand. One has to believe that eventually the brand will start to suffer and there are already signs that is starting to happen (see the numerous Chapek issues).

On the other side of the coin, Universal is making the right moves to build its theme park brand and good word of mouth.

Like any well established brand, the change will not be overnight, but if both Disney and Universal continue on the same trajectories, I can’t believe that in another 20 years time Universal will still be seen as the also ran in the way it was up until 2010.

No brand is eternal, even Disney.
 
venny said:
Matt, you’re right in saying that Disney is essentially trading off of a blend on nostalgia and reputation. That will obviously bring in visitors. As has been pointed out though, you can only trade off past glories for so long before the gloss wears off. Visitors to WDW now will probably be less glowing in their reviews compared to people visiting 20 years ago - primarily because it’s more expensive, offers less and is busier.
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This is also where Paris seems to be doing strangely well on compared to WDW, nothing has been added at the original park in years but it still remains a reasonable draw.
 
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That’s true and initially as a result of necessity - they had no money once they’d built Space Mountain. By the same token it’s also definitely not been a runaway success and WDS clearly tanked.

I suspect the other factor as I said is the differentiation between destinations. Whereas a lot of people will visit Orlando (rather than Disney World), nobody is visiting Marne la Vallee. The comparators are therefore less visible. If people decide to visit another resort rather than DLP, it could be anywhere from PA, to Europa Park or a more regional theme park. It’s not the competition across the street, because there isn’t any.

One can only guess what potential visitors the resort has lost due to the lack of investment.
 
venny said:
It’s not the competition across the street, because there isn’t any.
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You make Parc Asterix sad.


Other consideration is the European market and DLP also contests with Paris itself. What else is there to do in Orlando beyond the theme parks? You can probably trek over to Kennedy Space Centre but the options are limited.

European parks have a lot more competition in tourism beyond other parks. DLP does work in that it can at least get a few day trippers in (if rich enough) or make it part of a visit to Paris.
 
SeaWorld is just outside Disney property, Universal is just up the street. People will often visit these attractions together when they visit Orlando.

By comparison, Parc Asterix is about a 50 mile drive away from DLP. Not entirely close and not a regular stop that people tag onto a visit to DLP.
 
venny said:
SeaWorld is just outside Disney property, Universal is just up the street. People will often visit these attractions together when they visit Orlando.

By comparison, Parc Asterix is about a 50 mile drive away from DLP. Not entirely close and not a regular stop that people tag onto a visit to DLP.
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Many people tag DLP onto a visit to Paris and the museums, Eiffel Tower etc. DLPs competition is other tourist things. Similar to in London where Madame Tussaud’s competes with the London Eye, Buckingham Palace and the Tower of London.
Whereas in Orlando the competition is other theme parks, going to Universal may mean people spend fewer days at WDW. There isn’t really as much non-theme park competition.

Parc Asterix is competition for French people visiting theme parks.
 
Can you imagine if EP was literally across the street from Disneyland Paris? You'd have people come for Disney but spend most of the trip in the far bigger and more developed EP. I bet most people would just mistake it for EuroCOT.
 
It's incredible how lumbering and cumbersome DLP development is given the white hot European Market.

There's competition left, right and centre. And Disney churn out rides worse than the competition.

Symbolica?
Piraten in Batavia?
Toutatis?
Rookburgh?

Yup. All more interesting than anything Disneyland Paris have done in the last five years. Even some Merlin projects are more interesting.

They trade on those characters for the kids. Without them, it'd be done by now for lack of additions.

Sent from my SM-G991B using Tapatalk
 
But if there’s one thing you can bet on is that people will keep having kids, and for every family that can no longer afford Disney there’s another one waiting to replace them.

We can lament that there are better attractions at other European parks - there are - but outside of enthusiast circles nobody is travelling to see it. We know that and Disney know that.

Do I find Efteling a better park than DLP for the same target audience ? Yes. Do I have to explain what it even is every time I bring it up … also yes.

Disney is Disney and that won’t be changing any time soon
 
I do want to give a shout-out to Disneyland Paris over the entertainment and characters. Shows etc are amazing but I bet this has something to do with labour laws and rights.
 
Matt N said:
I was thinking about why people are less happy with Avengers Campus than they are with other IP-themed lands at Disney and Universal parks, and I did think of one possible problem with the Marvel IP that doesn’t plague other IPs that have had lands given to them. I once heard someone say this.

The Marvel IPs centre primarily around the superpowers of the protagonists, so the locations used in Marvel films (which Avengers Campus tries to replicate) are arguably quite dull, everyday locations unless the protagonists are present.

With something like Harry Potter, on the other hand (just as an example); key locations like Hogwarts and Diagon Alley are quite intriguing and mystical even if the protagonists aren’t present, so the WWOHP lands are still quite magical and offer lots of in-theme opportunities for shopping, F&B etc even though the protagonists themselves are not actually there.

I’m not sure how much sense I’m making, but could this be why Avengers Campus is leaving people so non-plussed?
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This is a good comparison video:



The previous RnRR facade looked better than this Avengers one in my opinion.
 
The old glorified cardboard cutout 'facade' looked better!? Each to their own, but wow, ok. That video is a perfect showcase of how the new area is so much better than what was there before. Taken out of context, the walkthrough of the original area could easily have been a walkthrough of a generic midway in a Six Flags park.
 
I completely agree, so much better than what went before, even just having proper paving rather than tarmac makes such a difference.

Overall I like the look of the land - I'm not the biggest Marvel fan but the aesthetic they've gone for looks really nice, high quality in my opinion, and feedback on the vlogs I've seen so far seems to be really positive. Having "impromptu" little shows and character appearances looks to be a great touch, it is easy to underestimate how "magical" it will be for 8-12yo to be walking through Avengers Campus and spot Captain America or Black Widow or Spiderman, just as amazing as seeing a Disney princess or Mickey and friends for many.

I'm going at the end of August/start of September and I'm really looking forward to seeing this land now - it looks like it is an amazing place just to be and walk around, which could not be said for the old Backlot or really a lot of WDS as a whole.
 
I can kind of see both side of the argument. I would say that the new facades are much better quality and certainly more modern. But it also comes across as much more generic - in shots that don't include the avengers ship, you would be forgiven for thinking you were looking at any old business park. Whilst the old RNR facade was very cheap/tired looking, it was at least a good place setting to indicate there was a rollercoaster in the building.
 
Squiggs said:
I can kind of see both side of the argument. I would say that the new facades are much better quality and certainly more modern. But it also comes across as much more generic - in shots that don't include the avengers ship, you would be forgiven for thinking you were looking at any old business park. Whilst the old RNR facade was very cheap/tired looking, it was at least a good place setting to indicate there was a rollercoaster in the building.
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I liked the neon fire effects though surrounding the Name. That was pretty cool.
 
According to OutsideEars, who are generally usually pretty on point with their info, the big wigs at Disney are not happy with the coaster portion of the rethemed RnRC and are working on plans for a 2.0 refurb in the coming months.

outsidears.fr

Towards an update for Avengers Assemble Flight Force ? - OutsidEars

Only a few days after Avengers Campus Opening, the first impressions on Avengers Flight Force are mixed. The attraction, based on the old RNRC infrastructure and ride track, seems a bit unfinished for visitors and fans which were able to discover the new version. They’re not the only ones to...
outsidears.fr
 
AT86 said:
According to OutsideEars, who are generally usually pretty on point with their info, the big wigs at Disney are not happy with the coaster portion of the rethemed RnRC and are working on plans for a 2.0 refurb in the coming months.

outsidears.fr

Towards an update for Avengers Assemble Flight Force ? - OutsidEars

Only a few days after Avengers Campus Opening, the first impressions on Avengers Flight Force are mixed. The attraction, based on the old RNRC infrastructure and ride track, seems a bit unfinished for visitors and fans which were able to discover the new version. They’re not the only ones to...
outsidears.fr
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From what I've seen its very disappointing I would have wanted stars in space!

It needs either physical themeing in place or more screens during the dark sections. Even if it's just the missiles shooting over our heads? (No actors required lol).

Do you think the fact it's in mixed languages makes it harder to follow? I think I would have preferred the option of a French line and and English line. With every 3rd train being English.
 
I hadn’t actually realised that they’d closed the stunt show until I looked on Wikipedia just now. So, they’ve scaled back the studio tour, removed the stunt show and Armageddon, and added Web Slingers. I know that in the long run it probably will lead to a better park when they add the Frozen area and whatever else they’re working on, but in the short term it feels like the attractions have gone backwards. Clearly rides are more popular than shows these days, but they have lost a couple of their more unusual attractions.

Admittedly you could say the same thing about Hollywood Studios when Galaxy’s Edge was under construction, but it does feel like it could be a long time before we get the pay off here.

In terms of the aesthetics, I do agree with what’s been said. The paving makes a big difference, and there seems to be a lot more greenery now, although that might be partly the time of year. To be fair it does look better, at least from the point of walking through it.

I don't think it's a terrible theme park by any means, and rides like Tower of Terror and Ratatouille are cool attractions, but if I could choose between a day out at the Disney Studios and Parc Asterix, it's an easy choice. There's so much more to do at Parc Asterix.
 
The stunt show has closed, but the arena is still there, so they could use the space to bring a new show to the park, if they wanted to.
 
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