General Queue Times Discussion

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John

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Steel Vengeance
So there we go, Rita and Smiler operations are officially terrible whilst WM and Nemesis are both excellent. Nothing we didn't already know of course!

Obviously as I'm dangerously obsessed with operations I have a few comments:

They should have used a higher theoretical capacity for Oblivion as it usually runs 6 trains not 5 as stated in the video. Operations on Oblivion have been mediocre for years, luckily the theoretical capacity is enormous so it doesn't matter as much as (say) Rita.

The figures for Thirteen are probably distorted by only having 6-8 people per train, which probably speeds up loading significantly. When the trains are full the station gets pretty crowded and loading is slower (I'd expect something like 1000-1100). Also worth remembering that it used to be capable of 1400+ when it had the bag store.

Galactica is maybe a little lower than I'd have expected, still decent though. Getting the most out of it requires very pro-active staff due to the restraints constantly requiring re-checking but if it's running smoothly it's an absolute queue-muncher.

Smiler needs the bag store back (or at least, an unstaffed bag drop where the store used to be). An average dispatch time of 80s is way too long for a ride with such small trains. Ditching the bag cages on the platform would easily save 10s per train and boost capacity by at least 100/hr, possibly much more.

Rita just seems to be a lost cause nowadays. They could maybe do a little better if they had 4 platform staff and an SRQ could also help by ensuring all seats are always filled (closing restraints on empty seats takes time) but I can't see it going back to getting anywhere near the 1000/hr it used to be capable of
 

AstroDan

TS Team
Favourite Ride
Steel Vengeance, Cedar Point
When I worked on Rita - Queen of Speed in 2007, we hit 1,000+ often and always 900+.

They removed two platform staff which drastically cut throughput.

Rita hasn't got a baggage store issue either, so it ought to be far better...

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Matt.GC

TS Member
On Rita, it always looks like restraint fluff. Pointless OTS restraints that lift up at a snales pace and straps that, for some reason, I see being adjusted for length quite alot when loading.

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Matt N

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Mako (SeaWorld Orlando)
So Thirteen is actually Alton’s highest throughput coaster; interesting! I only got 957pph when I timed the ride in April, whereas Coaster Bot clocked 1210pph.

Similarly, Wicker Man was lower than I’d have expected; I clocked 1059pph on my last visit, while Coaster Bot clocked 973pph. CB must have visited on a slower day for Wicker Man operations than I did! Either that, or my dispatch timing may have been inaccurate; I used Dispatch Timer, an iPhone app that I downloaded, and did an average of 5 dispatches. Is WM capable of achieving 1059pph?
 

pluk

TS Member
So Thirteen is actually Alton’s highest throughput coaster; interesting! I only got 957pph when I timed the ride in April, whereas Coaster Bot clocked 1210pph.

No it isn't. As noted, they were only having to check half a train due to social distancing, it'll be considerably slower when all seats are full.

I'd be interested to have someone monitor the merge point for a period of time to find out the percentages of riders from main queue, fastrack and RAP. See what the throughput from the mugs queue that I'll be in.
 

John

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Steel Vengeance
Mugs = the main queue

I'd be VERY interested to know main queue throughput for all rides on a busy day. I think it'd be a real eye-opener to see just how low some of them are relative to theoretical total capacity.
 

Matt N

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Mako (SeaWorld Orlando)
Out of interest @John; as you seem to have a lot of knowledge on the subject of Alton’s operations, I was just wondering how many rides that you personally think can regularly achieve over 1,000pph at Alton Towers? I was only wondering because on the day Coaster Bot visited, they only logged Nemesis, Galactica and Thirteen at over 1,000, but I myself have also logged both Wicker Man (1059pph) and Oblivion (1156pph) at over 1000pph, so I was wondering; do you think my readings are accurate, or do you think that it is only Nemesis, Galactica and Thirteen that can regularly achieve over 1000?
 

David Allen

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Nemesis
just got back from towers today from my experience today Wickerman was the quickest & moved fast, Nemesis was 7/10 not bad but a lot of staying still for a while, Smiler was okay 6/10 and galactica the worst. Didn't do Rita or 13.
 

TPC

TS Member
Definitely was a busy day today and a fair bit of downtime on Nemesis and Oblivion. Glad I managed to get on Smiler, WM and GG, but was a low ride count with the high queue times
 

David Allen

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Nemesis
Yea oblivion had some serious issues did not open until about 12 didn't it and then straight to 50min when it did , nemesis broke as i got on it , WM wasn't bad 30min when i got on it and smiler 35 at the end of the day but even nemesis later on the que was miles back.
 

Loui Richards

TS Member
Thought it was worth noting that the smiler was running 3 trains on the day he recorded the smilers operations :) as 80 seconds would X3 = 240 seconds which is 4 minutes whereas the ride is only 165 seconds so a 3 dispatches every 4 minutes is about right so that averages out to be 80 seconds, dispatches would be around every 65-75 seconds on 4 trains which isn’t a lot less but it does make difference, still has an awful throughout so my point is kinda unnecessary I’m aware
 

Rick

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Crux
Thought it was worth noting that the smiler was running 3 trains on the day he recorded the smilers operations :) as 80 seconds would X3 = 240 seconds which is 4 minutes whereas the ride is only 165 seconds so a 3 dispatches every 4 minutes is about right so that averages out to be 80 seconds, dispatches would be around every 65-75 seconds on 4 trains which isn’t a lot less but it does make difference, still has an awful throughout so my point is kinda unnecessary I’m aware
That logic only works if you're loading trains more quickly when running more trains, which is usually not how things work in practice.
 

John

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Steel Vengeance
Exactly - if they're sending a train every 80s on 3 trains then the 3rd would be leaving the station barely before the 1st gets back (based on 165s cycle time). Adding a 4th just results in trains waiting in the brakes, with only a negligible increase in throughput.

See also - Oblivion running 6, but having all the trains waiting on the brakes for ages. Taking a train off would would make virtually no difference, even losing 2 would only reduce throughput slightly.
 

Rick

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Crux
Exactly - if they're sending a train every 80s on 3 trains then the 3rd would be leaving the station barely before the 1st gets back (based on 165s cycle time). Adding a 4th just results in trains waiting in the brakes, with only a negligible increase in throughput.
Which demonstrates the borderline insanity of them regularly running 5 in those early seasons! Had they only bought four in the first instance, it's perhaps only slightly dramatic to suggest that the ride, park, Merlin and the wider UK industry could have had a very different decade.
 

Matt.GC

TS Member
Which demonstrates the borderline insanity of them regularly running 5 in those early seasons! Had they only bought four in the first instance, it's perhaps only slightly dramatic to suggest that the ride, park, Merlin and the wider UK industry could have had a very different decade.

I might be being a bit thick, but.... what???

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Danscott22

TS Member
Favourite Ride
The Smiler
I think I’m being thick too but what I’m implying from that message is
No fifth train = no mistake in 2015 = only having to account for 4 = no accident = no profit loss = different decade. Not sure if that’s what is meant though
 

Rick

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Crux
I think I’m being thick too but what I’m implying from that message is
No fifth train = no mistake in 2015 = only having to account for 4 = no accident = no profit loss = different decade. Not sure if that’s what is meant though
Bang on. Not much of a leap, really.
 

Matt N

TS Member
Favourite Ride
Mako (SeaWorld Orlando)
Out of interest, did we ever ascertain what became of that week-long distancing trial on certain rides? Did the park ever extend the distancing removal to other rides? Was the policy reversed?

I’m guessing based on the current queue times that the policy wasn’t reversed, as they’re surprisingly quite low, but I’d be interested to know, if anyone does know!
 
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