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Health and Safety Gone Mad?

andyramone said:
Has anyone thought to actually contact Alton Towers and find out the reason it's there?

Maybe that would be a good idea? Instead of assuming a whole bunch of stuff that may not be true, and slagging of the park for it?
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Last year the cable snapped and the cable dropped under the track into an area where guests could walk. So was the scaffolding needed last-year.... yes. There was a risk (stealth has a different cable tray design). Hence why i never moaned last year about its presence (i mourned the aesthetic displeasure it caused but accepted its practicality) as there was a risk (not many Intamin launches allow guests under the launch).

This year it seems a bit stupid, there is a new tray under the track to stop the cable dropping, so it seems silly that this situation has returned.

As for H&S there IS a culture where personal responsibility is no-longer a factor. That does frustrate me, for instance the gardens. You would have to be pratting around to fall down one of the drops in the gardens but they have to now fence the whole of these HISTORIC gardens because there is no requirement for people to take responsibility for their actions.... this is not a sensible situation.

Some H&S is very important, for instance the need to add say Air-gates to a roller-coaster platform (they never used to exist). I can see their need and why they are installed.

The trouble is at the moment H&S has vomited over the park with stupid ideas that add nothing to the safety of any ride (RMT must have stopped for 5 seconds before the restraints can open, there is no need for this).

I am all for good H&S, Towers has had very good H&S for many years to the point that the only big incident (the RMT crash) the H&S executive turned around and said the park was in no-way at fault over the incident.

Bring back the sensible.....
 
In any workplace H&S training the first thing they tell you is that YOU are responsible for your own safety first and foremost. IE, if something is obviously dangerous, DON'T DO IT.
Unfortunately it seems that the oposite is true when it comes to members of the public. Everyone is responsible except the person who did the stupid thing.
::)
 
I don't disagree with all changes this year, i have no big issue with having dispatch buttons on RMT, it provides a solid indication that the host is happy they have finished their job.

Infact my opinion on the Oblivion situation is that they need 2 extra dispatch buttons so that all 4 hosts have to press to dispatch a train (as 2 of the hosts have other tasks during dispatch 2 buttons can just require a single press whilst the other two must be pressed constantly). Then all the hosts have recorded electronically that they have done their job and if it turns out seats where not checked the responsibility lies with the staff member that acknowledged they had completed their task but had not.
 
BigDave said:
In addition one boy still has brain damage due to running out into Nemesis brake run and getting struck by the train.
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When was this? Never heard about it, I am guessing it was a while ago?

When I went on Saturday I was shocked to see the Rita tunnel up as I thought the whole point of the off season was to get the problem sorted. Seems they have added the extra cable tray but have also put the scaffolding back up. It is a real shame and makes the area look an eyesore.

Hopefully something more is done to get rid of the scaffolding - saying that, maybe they have put the scaffolding back up as theming similar to Th13teen...:p
 
I aint going to moan too much about h&s alot of people whinge about it and its something that protects us but more importantly protects the companys from pointless law suits.

airgates on oblivion. Maybe there delayed so that people can actualy get off the station before the rush of the next lot. Maybe just to make life for the staff easier. deal with one set at a time. just a guess maybe quicker and safer for them to get people away before letting the next lot through.

This topic is very much like most topics on this forum people sticking there bottom lips out over nothing. If AT what to be safe rather then sorry let them. Yellow paint round trip hazards. Scaffolding around rita, bars near drops and delayed airgates. So what does this actualy affect anything to stop you enjoying your day there.............. no. Ther vast amount of people in this country are stupid. But they know enough that if they get hurt they can get money because tv has told them tv tells them everything (blame there's a claim.) are any of you suprised that with a culture like this that they are other cautious.
 
The thing is yes it does effect my day. Poor throughputs, ugly fences and scaffolding, etc all effect my day. Especially when half of them are not needed as already mentioned about 10 times.

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Slugjc said:
This topic is very much like most topics on this forum people sticking there bottom lips out over nothing. If AT what to be safe rather then sorry let them. Yellow paint round trip hazards. Scaffolding around rita, bars near drops and delayed airgates. So what does this actualy affect anything to stop you enjoying your day there.............. no. Ther vast amount of people in this country are stupid. But they know enough that if they get hurt they can get money because tv has told them tv tells them everything (blame there's a claim.) are any of you suprised that with a culture like this that they are other cautious.
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The thing is though, quite a lot the new measures implemented CAN impact your day out. The whole dispatch on RMT seems to be unnecessarily long and impacts queuing times for it. Holding the queue before launches on Rita quite a way back even when a new tray has been fitted does impact on queue times also.

As for the yellow marking around raised areas on Rita's station platform, no they don't impact your day out. However, they do look messy and not needed. Unless you walk around just by shuffling your feet the chances of tripping must be extremely marginal so I, personally, don't see that it is needed.

I'm not disagreeing with you, as I'm all for H&S. However, Towers just seem to be over cautious and doing things unnecessarily to a point where, when gate figures will pick up, it will impact customers enjoyment of their days out.
 
Also, very few of the new measures actually resolve the underlying problem. If staff are doing stuff they shouldnt, then sort the staff out. Dont change a ride that as run fine for over 15yrs! If a launch cable snaps, come up with ways to stop it snapping and install failsafe features. Dont cover all of dark forrest in scaffolding.


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BigDave said:
Also, very few of the new measures actually resolve the underlying problem. If staff are doing stuff they shouldnt, then sort the staff out. Dont change a ride that as run fine for over 15yrs! If a launch cable snaps, come up with ways to stop it snapping and install failsafe features. Dont cover all of dark forrest in scaffolding.


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That is the top and bottem of it. I have witnessed the same sorts of problems crippleing the thru-put at PB recently, all brought about by the same daft reasons. The Slow lifthill on the Big Dipper being the primary example, I mean it takes 60seconds to get to the same height the Grand National and Streak get to in half the time. You know something is wrong when the Big One is at the top before the Big Dipper! Also, forcing people to stand with backs against the wall until the train has parked up is becoming a pain. As for the Revolution, they wont let you though the scanner now until the train is out of the station, but will let you stand there as it returns! Its gross inconsistancy in its unglyest form.

The Big One no longer runs 2 trains anything like it should, instead its taken the National's approach and doesn't dispatch until the other train is back to avoid lift evacuations, a pattern being repeated on the Avalanche and Infusion.

The world has gone mad overnight so it seems.

Ash
 
It's just about sensible H&S, if it has a point then I say health and safety comes above everything. It's just when H&S procedures are taken to an extreme where they don't improve safety but do impact guest experience.

It just seems to me that certain steps are been taken that do not improve guest safety but do detract from guest experience.
 
LiamC said:
Slugjc said:
This topic is very much like most topics on this forum people sticking there bottom lips out over nothing. If AT what to be safe rather then sorry let them. Yellow paint round trip hazards. Scaffolding around rita, bars near drops and delayed airgates. So what does this actualy affect anything to stop you enjoying your day there.............. no. Ther vast amount of people in this country are stupid. But they know enough that if they get hurt they can get money because tv has told them tv tells them everything (blame there's a claim.) are any of you suprised that with a culture like this that they are other cautious.
Click to expand...

The thing is though, quite a lot the new measures implemented CAN impact your day out. The whole dispatch on RMT seems to be unnecessarily long and impacts queuing times for it. Holding the queue before launches on Rita quite a way back even when a new tray has been fitted does impact on queue times also.

As for the yellow marking around raised areas on Rita's station platform, no they don't impact your day out. However, they do look messy and not needed. Unless you walk around just by shuffling your feet the chances of tripping must be extremely marginal so I, personally, don't see that it is needed.

I'm not disagreeing with you, as I'm all for H&S. However, Towers just seem to be over cautious and doing things unnecessarily to a point where, when gate figures will pick up, it will impact customers enjoyment of their days out.
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BigDave said:
Also, very few of the new measures actually resolve the underlying problem. If staff are doing stuff they shouldnt, then sort the staff out. Dont change a ride that as run fine for over 15yrs! If a launch cable snaps, come up with ways to stop it snapping and install failsafe features. Dont cover all of dark forrest in scaffolding.


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Staff will be trained to the max, if the staff aint pulling there weight then the company will put in measures to make sure they will i.e what they are doing with oblivion. Lets also not forget that it is opening part of the season. Im guesing the experianced staff will be put onto the smiler. Whilst the new staff will be put in to fill the void. Again this is me guessing. It takes time to get these people up to speed.


With regards to the queue times RMT and Rita. Does a few min more really matter. A proud nation that we are we all love a good queue. When i last went they we holding the queue back on nemesis and air. Half way round the queue line they would stop and let a few through to the main staion area. Didnt seem to effect my day so much that i wanted to go and punch a child. Nor will it if they hold back rita queue for a few feet still in that queue you are still gonna be queueing if they they let you into that wee bit. RMT always seemed long to me anyway, considoring its a tiny lap bar. It may be (at a guess) the ride they do much of there training on. i dont know its a theory.

Main point is give them a break.
 
^You're confusing Fastrack batch points to Rita's holding people out from under the launch 3 miles away...

The stuff happening with Rita is pretty stupid considering in Chertsey you can still queue/walk underneath the launch track without a care in the world...
 
I can see all the points though. Hope they get rid of the scaffold soon, and AT can get onwith a fantastic year.
 
I forgot to add that the holding of some of Rita's queue doesn't affect throughput. It would only do that if seats are waiting to be filled, which they aren't at any point.
 
Tom said:
I forgot to add that the holding of some of Rita's queue doesn't affect throughput. It would only do that if seats are waiting to be filled, which they aren't at any point.
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thank you for that what ive been saying all along.
 
My issue is that whilst Towers have a legal obligation to ensure your health and safety is protected, you have the exact same obligation to ensure your own health and safety is protected.

Take the gardens as an example. If there is a clear sign saying the paths are uneven and there are drops and what not, if you jump off one of the walls then it's your own fault. You were warned and made a DECISION to ignore that warning and do it anyway.

The same applies to the rides, a warning telling you to stand back from the platform until the air gates open and if you don't? Tough titties, YOU chose to ignore the warning presented.
 
Rita's throughput is affected because they aren't allowed to launch the train while anyone is under the track - if people move too slowly through through that part of the queue the ride gets held up. As for RMT, as I mentioned earlier the full queue line now takes significantly longer than it used to, and Oblivions queue is also much slower than it was before the new procedures came into place.

A typical guest may not notice the changes directly, but they will be annoyed if queues hardly move.
 
A thought has occured regarding the new fences. So many people these days never look where they are going because their faces are glued to their phones. There have been several cases in the states of people falling in to mall water features because they are doing this, who then sue the malls for not fencing off the three inch deep pool ::)

Obviously, these idiots deserve to drown.
 
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