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Incident on The Smiler 02/06/2015

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I think you'll find that while any of the electronic systems could be improved, the manufacturer will certainly state that there is no substitution for the visual verification of a train's position.

The only thing I think Gerstlauer should have to answer for is the design of the trains, particularly on The Smiler, where the inversions and changes of direction are tight. There should be no way that the bar on the front should be impacted in such a way during a collision with another train.
 
Tarquin said:
Gerstlauer obviously wouldn't design a rollercoaster where you were unable to tell if it had stalled. So something must have happened that was completely unexpected and that they had not foreseen if (and that's a big if) the stall wasn't detected. Therefore, there could be a similar set of unforeseen circumstances (not necessarily the exact same circumstances mind), that would result in another crash. I don't see the harm in preparing for such a possibility with physical measures at the front and back of each car.
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To clarify, the system/rollercoaster DID shut down because it realised a train had stalled. The train had not cleared the block so the ride stopped.

People then intervened and the ride was put into manual mode - from what we understand so far. If a process was in place like PeteB suggested, then even if the same thing happened again and the ride was sent round mistakenly, noone would be on it... Problem solved.
 
smudge said:
To clarify, the system/rollercoaster DID shut down because it realised a train had stalled. The train had not cleared the block so the ride stopped.
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Even that's an assumption at this point to be fair. The ride certainly did stop but we've had no confirmation to say that it definitely stopped because it detected a train had stalled. The reason I say that is because the ride continued on regardless afterwards. Perhaps another fault happened at the same time, stopping the ride? The engineer might have over ridden the system, missing the stalled train, and only seeing the more minor fault that could be safely ignored. It's impossible to say for certain at this point.
 
Tarquin said:
Even that's an assumption at this point to be fair. The ride certainly did stop but we've had no confirmation to say that it definitely stopped because it detected a train had stalled. The reason I say that is because the ride continued on regardless afterwards. Perhaps another fault happened at the same time, stopping the ride? The engineer might have over ridden the system, missing the stalled train, and only seeing the more minor fault that could be safely ignored. It's impossible to say for certain at this point.
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Regardless, the system stopped the ride.

Its not much of an assumption either, lets be honest. It's how a roller-coaster system works. Clutching at straws much.
 
Think so.

Isn't the whole point of a rollercoaster to make you feel in danger, to make you have the thought that you are about to fall out, isn't this the point. To give you a thrill. No matter what towers do, some people will still believe that are in danger. People will lie. "I was next to ride when it crashed" "my restraints lifted up" "towers let me on today even though it was closed to see if it is safe". I don't understand people who do this, but they will, and the media will be all over it. It's a lose-lose situation for Alton. There is NO situation where towers get off lightly, there is no way out, there is no happy ending to this story (sorry, couldn't resist)
 
smudge said:
Regardless, the system stopped the ride.

Its not much of an assumption either, lets be honest. It's how a roller-coaster system works. Clutching at straws much.
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It is an assumption. You say that it's how a rollercoaster system works yet clearly a rollercoaster isn't supposed to crash into a stalled train either is it? Something went wrong and we don't know what it was.

Leah said:
Think so.

Isn't the whole point of a rollercoaster to make you feel in danger, to make you have the thought that you are about to fall out, isn't this the point. To give you a thrill. No matter what towers do, some people will still believe that are in danger. People will lie. "I was next to ride when it crashed" "my restraints lifted up" "towers let me on today even though it was closed to see if it is safe". I don't understand people who do this, but they will, and the media will be all over it. It's a lose-lose situation for Alton. There is NO situation where towers get off lightly, there is no way out, there is no happy ending to this story (sorry, couldn't resist)
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The most important word there being 'feel' of course. I'm not trying to paint rollercoasters as actually being dangerous by the way. It's just previous experience has shown that when there's been terrible events such as these, even if it's been proven by the HSE that ride protocols were to blame, alterations to the train (sometimes quite drastic ones) have been made.
 
It would pointless strengthening the cars to make them able to withstand a crash - the cost benefit just isn't worth it. In a similar manner, the front end of trains are not designed to withstand an impact - it is generally acepted if there is a collision, then the driver is a 'goner'. The effort is placed into preventing the collision in the first place, which can can be controlled.

Car collisions, on the other hand, cannot be closely controlled. Therefore more effort is put into strengthening the vehicle.

It is all about the hierarchy of risk control measures - you put more effort into preventing things occurring before needing to resort to risk mitigation measures following an incident.

On a separate matter, I just checked the Chessington site ('cos I'm staying there in 2 weeks time after my trip to AT), and I noticed the Rattlesnake is still not operational. Wonder why that is? I've never ridden that one before, and was looking forward to it. I just wonder if it is because of the number of carriages on the ride at once (lots of small wild mouse type cars), and they have found the block brake system is deficient for the number of cars on ride?
 
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Your not missing much. Standard wild mouse with badly decaying theming and really dirty Windows that practically everyone has written there names on. I'd be surprised if you have any non-broken ribs after.

If it's open though, I'd still go on it
 
Leah said:
Your not missing much. Standard wild mouse with badly decaying theming and really dirty Windows that practically everyone has written there names on. I'd be surprised if you have any non-broken ribs after.

If it's open though, I'd still go on it
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Rattlesnake is not rough.
 
Depends, if your Sat in one of the rows next to either...
  1. Someone much bigger that you
  2. Alone
Then yes... it hurts.
 
Rattlesnake is no bpb wild mouse, but it is very rough, that final brake can knock you windless.
 
One of the changes on Sonic is when sending empty cars round it's done one at a time and every staff member keeps their eyes on it until it gets to the end.
 
XXBENNXX said:
Rattlesnake is no bpb wild mouse, but it is very rough, that final brake can knock you windless.
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BPB's Wild Mouse isn't rough either, it's raucous!
The final brake run on Rattlesnake is the only section that is even verging on rough IMO, the rest of it runs smoothly although you do get thrown about a bit, but it would be boring if it was completely smooth. :grinning:
 
XXBENNXX said:
Rattlesnake is no bpb wild mouse, but it is very rough, that final brake can knock you windless.
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BPB Wild mouse! My arch nemesis. Migraine, neck and backache guaranteed! A good laugh though.
@Leah if you ever go to pleasure beach avoid this ride at all costs!
 
AliceHL91 said:
BPB Wild mouse! My arch nemesis. Migraine, neck and backache guaranteed! A good laugh though.
@Leah if you ever go to pleasure beach avoid this ride at all costs!
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I will!

Personally, not a fan (at all) of wild mouse's (wait... plural of wild mouse? Wild Mouse's, wild mice, wild mouses?) So, usually avoid them. Didn't Alton mouse crash under similar circumstances to the smiler (not as bad though).
 
Clearly the chances of more than one car entering the same block are statistically tiny, given how rarely it happens compared to the millions of rides taken around the world every day.

Multiple redundancies are required to further reduce the likelyhood of a chain of events coming together.

My humble Honda has anti lock breaking, electronic break distribution, dual circuit breaking system, etc. These reduce the likelihood of an accident. It then has seatbelts, side impact bars, airbags, crumple zones, etc to provide protection should an accident still occur.

There will always need to be an acceptable compromise between safety, likelyhood and cost. I'm sure rollercoasters are safe because they allready have multiple redundancies and perhaps in the future they will have more.

I believe that Merlin will do the right thing and do whatever needs to be done to prevent a recurrence.

I want rides that are SAFE, but have PERCEIVED danger.

I hope that it will always be 'Fright Time' with 'The World's Most Intense Ride Experience'.
 
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