• ℹ️ Heads up...

    This is a popular topic that is fast moving Guest - before posting, please ensure that you check out the first post in the topic for a quick reminder of guidelines, and importantly a summary of the known facts and information so far. Thanks.

London Entertainment Resort: All Discussion

I imagine a lot of this stuff will be done in phases - the attraction attractions as a whole will surely have to prove it's worth before they go adding huge things like this? Or I suppose the other way around... build the huge draws to recoup the costs?
 
I think they're just going to go all out, and build the expensive stuff for opening. There is no way a park like this will be a failure, they will recoup their costs and huge amounts of profit very quickly on expensive rides particularly as they will be bigger draws for people to visit.
 
This is great news for the UK Park industry. If there is a Doctor Who ride there, then I think it a lot of people from the States who flock over to Britain to ride it. Americans love Doctor Who like Brits love Harry Potter or The Simpsons. Even combine this with Paramount's own IPs like Star Trek, I think the selection of IPs will be a really good choice.

This also gives Merlin a good kick up the backside, Especially for Thorpe. If the park is still like how it is in 6 years time, why on Earth would I want to visit there when I can go to the Paramount Park which would be more in shape? Towers wouldn't be affected as much, but it still needs a makeover badly. As for Chessie, I can't see the park operating in 10 years time if I'm honest, but maybe that's for the better.
 
I think Towers will be heavily hit if this goes ahead, transport has always been a problem, and with many new European visitors coming in I would doubt they would travel a further 3 and a bit hour to Alton. With some wise investments the likes of Thorpe can benefit with more themepark tourists in the area, for example take Seaworld in Orlando, how many people would go to Orlando to solely visit Seaworld, but they are able to capture enough Disney or Universal guests to be profitable.
 
Towers will be ok, they have a very strong position in the market and a reputation of delivering top class coasters. As long as they continue that then they'll be fine. It's not as if the UK market is saturated at present.

Thorpe are at more threat, but I agree that they could potentially benefit. It all depends what guests Paramount does ultimately attract. I think Thorpe will suffer initially but if they stick at it then could start to attract the international visitors that come for Paramount.

It's Chessie you fear for. If there's Paramount, Thorpe, Chessie and Legoland all in the area you know which one is going to have the least appeal and it is unfortunately Chessie. Legoland will always be popular as long as Lego is popular.

:)
 
Make no bones about it: Alton Towers will be wetting themselves about this.

For the past 15-20 years, no park in the UK has had the marketing or financial clout of Alton Towers. In many ways, Alton Towers has been unchallenged... and if this development happens - this will change.

Paramount Resort will become a glitzy, clean and modern environment with massive budgets and a huge marketing clout not to mention the massive urban area of London on its doorstep. It will appeal not just to one group either - but all! Of courses, it will lack the hardware of Alton Towers on the whole - but Alton Towers is a grimy and in many places neglected theme park which will look second tier on a postcard when compared to something like Paramount.

It will need to really pick up its game if it is to attract those in East Anglia and the South East should Paramount open.
 
I don’t it will have any effect on Merlin, although their visitor numbers may fall in 2020 due to unfavourable weather conditions and something vague to do with the school holidays.

In all seriousness, if this does get built then I hope it forces Merlin to up their game, but I’m not entirely sure it will. A few years ago a lot of people predicted that Heide Park would get preferential treatment over the other Merlin parks because Germany has so many great parks and fairs. I haven’t been to Heide Park, but I don’t get the impression Merlin do throw extra money at it.

When Legoland Florida was announced there were predictions that it would be built on a different scale to the other Legolands with a Universal style dark ride. Legoland Florida is a nice park and the Cyprus Gardens are beautiful, but the quality of rides are higher in Windsor.
 
Given Heide-Park's low visitor numbers (sub 1.5m), I would say they actually do get quite heavy investment. But Germany is so vast that it's only really Hansa-Park that is in competition with Heide-Park.
 
Towers is probably the safest of the Merlin Parks from Paramount but it will have an effect, hopefully this will be positive.

The only concern I still have for this project is they say they have £2 billion to spend. That sounds a lot but if it includes IP payments on top of infrastructure then rides that's not a big budget.
 
Dave said:
The only concern I still have for this project is they say they have £2 billion to spend. That sounds a lot but if it includes IP payments on top of infrastructure then rides that's not a big budget.
Click to expand...

That kind of budget can comfortably build a Universal Studios theme park. Let's not be too greedy now! :p
 
Aren't the proposed rides IPs already owned by Paramount so only the BBC would need securing and paying for.
 
BigAl said:
That kind of budget can comfortably build a Universal Studios theme park. Let's not be too greedy now! :p
Click to expand...

The pure build cost of universal Singapore was around £2 billion. Bare in mind that figure didn't include IP costs and the fact construction is generally more expensive in Europe (compare US tower of terror to Paris).

The Economy of different territories is not a simple matter of converting a currency

And paramount isn't building this park so someone is buying (either through money or shares) the paramount IP.

I'm not saying it won't happen, just pointing out some of the issues.
 
BigAl said:
That kind of budget can comfortably build a Universal Studios theme park. Let's not be too greedy now! :p
Click to expand...
Dave said:
Towers is probably the safest of the Merlin Parks from Paramount but it will have an effect, hopefully this will be positive.

The only concern I still have for this project is they say they have £2 billion to spend. That sounds a lot but if it includes IP payments on top of infrastructure then rides that's not a big budget.
Click to expand...

2 Billion is A LOT of money to build a theme park. Unless of course you factor in buying the land...

Also, IP licensing I cannot believe for a second would be done on a up front only cost basis, especially with a brand with the power of Paramount and all their IP experience behind it.

Also, if licensing from abroad, the pound right now is extremely strong against most currency so you can get a lot more for your money, especially US. It makes a monumental difference.

I'd imagine long term licensing routes will be taken, much like with any commercial venture, very rarely in such high profile cases are vast sums payable up front. It makes no business sense for a start, I suspect they've a little more acumen than that.

Let's remember what this park is up against... THORPE.

Now let's remember.

2 BILLION.

Not really sure we need to worry about this as the parks starting position...
 
The fact you had to say "unless" is the bit that can come unstuck.

It probably won't but like anything I'm not holding my breath until the diggers start
 
Dave said:
The fact you had to say "unless" is the bit that can come unstuck.

It probably won't but like anything I'm not holding my breath until the diggers start
Click to expand...

If it has to include land purchase... that's not a very big budget anymore.
 
2bn is that not just a rough figure?

Anyway I'm sure they can build a big project like this now as the pound is so strong.

If we look at the intellectual properties that have a large audience share abroad but more importantly stand the test of time then I think Doctor Who, Sherlock, and possibly Top Gear have high chances as over 200 countries purchased these last year alone. I also think we should not overlook a ride to do with the BBC natural history unit. It is the most respected and widely watched provider of blue chip wildlife programming.

I am not sure on the kids side of things but Shaun the sheep and mass international appeal including France, China and the USA/Canada.

These are all ideas, I think the towers could suffer from less southern traffic, and I agree with a lot of people its not had the investment to be top class. Parts are so dated tired and mainly grubby. Its due to laziness and the thight owners over years of neglect.

Visitor numbers will drop I have no doubt especially if for a bit extra you get a great family day out rather than a OK day. Towers really need to do something big to sustain itself if this arrives.

Thorpe could gain as people might want to get an adrenalin fix knowing its less than 1hour 30 away. Although as the vast majority of people will hopefully be on public transport I see that less likely. Have you ever tried going from St panc to Thorpe?

Chessington will most likely suffer the most, however if it remains focused on the zoo and educational aspects it could weather the storms.

All in all I think price is key, merlin need to look at the BOGOF strategy as surely the headlines would pick up on the price differences between the two groups.

I find it ironic Kent is getting all this attention. For years its been a go through county. With people just driving or getting the train from the continent. Now it will be interesting to see if this and Margates Dreamland both prosper.
 
I wouldn't get too hung up over that £2 billion figure. It was mentioned over a year ago and there is no mention at all of cost/budget on the London Paramount website. It all depends who the investors turn out to be and how much they are prepared to back it. If they're confident of it being a success and really want it to happen as planning then it could be a case of it costs whatever it costs (within reason). Will be very interesting to see if the Wanda Group do turn out to be investors.

:)
 
I think it is Chessington & Thorpe that are most as risk. Alton Towers is too far north to need to worry too much, but they are similar demographics they are targetting. Thorpe is still skewed more towards thrill seekers so should carry on OK. Chessington is focusing on the zoo even more anyway so I think they have accepted they can't grow much more anyway. Legoland focuses a bit more on 3-9 year old children so may be a different market.
Overall I think this will force Merlin to refocus, but there is probably enough room for both. It is the smaller parks that still need to be careful as if people prioritise a Merlin park and Paramount will Drayton Manor etc lose out?
 
Smaller parks will be hit the hardest, i do think the UK theme park industry is over saturated for the countries size (not with much quality i agree). At the end of the day it doesn't matter how popular the south parks are the only one i know to pull people from where i live (Yorkshire) is Lego Land and that is a once or twice in 10 years for a young family. Those same people do Towers every year. I think Paramount will have a similar effect on people more north than Birmingham, maybe a couple of visits but the northern parks (like Towers and Drayton) will keep their business. Thorpe is already struggling so it may suffer a little more, Chessington will probably be fine.

I really hope this drives up investment though, and i hope it turns out to be a good theme park, rather than a shopping mall with a few rides attached.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top