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Nemesis Reborn: General Discussion

I mean smilers construction was completely cursed but it was a feat of engineering making a long track layout THAT compact, nemesis on the other hand that was 20 years prior and if I'm not wrong the ground before construction was just a flat plot of land, the fact they blew a massive pit in the ground made a rollercoaster that is still a fan favourite to this day and have the supports sitting on the ledges of pit and constructed this in the 90's is crazy to me I think both are very impressive in their own regards.

I've also rode nemesis reborn twice on the front row, twice on the back and once or twice in the middle and I can't say the roughness is comparable to the smiler, neither are rough imo but nemesis reborn just feels like a new coaster to me although I do feel it shaking on the last turn I wouldn't have noticed if I hadn't read and heard what people were saying beforehand, maybe I just got lucky.
 
Off topic completely...(again)...The smiler site was a complete swamp at the time of construction, that was a big part of the problem...and I was playing out a lot in the mud at exactly the same time...I nearly ended up with goosey webbed feet.
It was a very wet construction.
 
Ethan said:
I’ve said this before and people just waffle on about the fact Smiler was apparently built poorly because there’s a couple jolts🙄. You know it’s not like it’s one of the most compact rides in the world and building it in the first place would be very difficult. What did you expect exactly it wasn’t going to be butter smooth. At least Gerstlauer had the balls to attempt it B&M would never
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Did you see construction workers for Nemesis grinding down the track so there wasn't a step in the track where two meet? Do you see gaps in Nemesis track? There are probably issues with all new coaster construction but you've really got your head in the sand if you ignore all the problems the Smiler had....
 

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In addition to the above, you've also got the support structure that did not fit correctly over the toilet block (at the X Sector entrance), so they had to cut a part of the roof to accommodate the supports. Not to mention track pieces being hammered to fit in between joints (then subsequently ground down).

The Smiler was/remains the most chaotic/messy construction project ever seen at Alton Towers. Many factors contributed to this, but it was certainly not well built or a smooth-running project.

Anyway, roughness on a ride is very subjective, and it depends on your experience of rollercoasters you've been on, too. I cannot comment on Nemmy Reborn yet, but I always felt old Nemesis to be 'smooth'; it rode very well as a nearly 30-year-old ride.
 
RIPCorky said:
Not sure how smooth you can physically get a rollercoaster anyway? At the end of the day it has no suspension or inflatable tyres so you're limited as to what you can do. The excess energy from the forces created have to go somewhere.
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acctually quite a few modern coasters have suspension, like galactica it has has suspension, and famously oblivion is not 90 degrees because it dosn't have sprung wheel designs (modern dive coasters do have sprung wheel assemblies)

edit: it is not proper suspension, more springs compressing the wheels, it dose help with transitioning to air time.
 
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RIPCorky said:
Did you see construction workers for Nemesis grinding down the track so there wasn't a step in the track where two meet? Do you see gaps in Nemesis track? There are probably issues with all new coaster construction but you've really got your head in the sand if you ignore all the problems the Smiler had....
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The ride has been operating for over a decade. If it was that poorly designed it wouldn’t still be around
 
Ethan said:
The ride has been operating for over a decade. If it was that poorly designed it wouldn’t still be around
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I dunno, look at Thirteen with how it can't run in the rain, and has had trims added to the base of the lift...

However you look at it, Smiler was a nightmare in its early years. Dodgy concrete, stalling, track gaps, missing bolts and wheels - one of these things happening is pretty embarrassing, but all of that in the first year of operation says a lot.

Tieing things back round - the rattle on Nemesis is likely being investigated and rectified. I haven't been on it yet so can't say how offensive it is.
 
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mo237 said:
I dunno, look at Thirteen with how it can't run in the rain, and has had trims added to the base of the lift...

However you look at it, Smiler was a nightmare in its early years. Dodgy concrete, stalling, track gaps, missing bolts and wheels - one of these things happening is pretty embarrassing, but all of that in the first year of operation says a lot.
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Stalled four or five times in it's first season I believe and twice on the day it crashed.
 
We’re way off topic with all this Smiler chat. As long as you avoid the edge seats it’s still fantastic .

Re:
Nemesis. Can’t go for a while (knee op’:( ) - but I expect this rattle won’t be fixed until close season now tbh
 
Jb85 said:
I have to say it’s very uncharacteristic of b&m to have a rattle on their coasters.
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I posted a while back about just this thing. Some more modern ones seem to have a rattle in the UK, Mandrill Mayhem and now Nemesis for example. Heard reports saying Pipeline surf coaster in the US has a rattle too
 
I think that to some degree, any coaster will have a rattle. It’s only natural that a machine moving at high speeds and being exposed to high g-forces will have some small degree of vibration.

I’ve ridden all 3 of the coasters mentioned above by @Connor98, and despite having a relatively low roughness tolerance, the only one where I’d say I overly noticed a rattle and found it to be a detractor worth commenting on was Mandrill Mayhem.

Mandrill Mayhem had quite a pronounced bounce that almost gave me a slight headache, and it felt particularly awkward and bouncy during the backwards lap. However, I would have even have said that that rattle was more of a minor detractor than a complete deal breaker; I wasn’t massively enamoured with Mandrill Mayhem, but I don’t think that my opinion would have been that much different if the ride had been glass smooth. The bounciness knocked it down a tad, but it was far from the sole factor stopping me from rating it highly.

As I said before, I hardly noticed the rattle on Nemesis on either of my two rides; it was no more rattly than some rides I had on the original, and had there not been so much debate about the rattle, I probably would have thought nothing of it. The overall experience was very smooth. I grant you, I could have ridden the “good” train both times, but I found it to be a completely benign rattle that had no effect on my enjoyment whatsoever. It was more akin to the so-called “Mack rattle” on Icon, and notably smoother than Mandrill Mayhem. I had brilliant rides on Nemesis Reborn, and this minute rattle did not impair the experience at all for me.

I rode Pipeline last June, and I found that to be relatively similar to Nemesis; there was a tiny rattle present, but it was completely benign and I hardly even noticed it. The overall experience was very smooth. I grant you, I only had one back row ride on Pipeline in the morning, but that minute rattle had absolutely no effect on my enjoyment of that coaster, and I hardly even noticed it. I was pretty underwhelmed by Pipeline, but that was for completely unrelated reasons.
 
jibbsie said:
acctually quite a few modern coasters have suspension, like galactica it has has suspension, and famously oblivion is not 90 degrees because it dosn't have sprung wheel designs (modern dive coasters do have sprung wheel assemblies)
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Without going massively off topic. The only suspension Galactica has refers to the cars when sitting in the load position. There is no suspension on the track or wheel assembly's, so no such suspension that will contribute to making the ride smoother. As soon as the crafts lift into the flying position and lock into place, the shock absorbers that absorb the weight of people getting in and out of the crafts become completely redundant and all load is transferred through the lock pins into the rest of the chassis, rigidly. Modern dive coasters have sprung loaded wheel assemblies to clamp the wheels to the track, very different from a suspension system. It needs to be spring loaded on a coaster like a dive machine to account for movements between the wheel assemblies and track, they do not absorb any shock however, setup totally different.

Rollercoasters don't have suspension systems like you would see in a car, as they would very quickly absorb the potential energy that is allowing the train to complete a circuit of the track without stalling. The closest you get to a suspension is the compound used in the material that makes up the wheels.

I think perhaps Do-Dodonpa possibly had a suspension system in the traditional sense. One of the very few coasters to exist that ever did. They could get away with it because the pneumatic launch was just nuts thus they could afford to loose some potential energy, also because it really was needed to help prevent serious injury.

Pretty certain no coasters at Towers including Nemesis have a suspension system. B&M don't do them full stop, as with the other manufacturers that make it Towers' coaster collection. Intamin may have done one or two over their long history but that's about it, if even that.

Going back to Nemesis, this vibration is interesting, I am sure the park and B&M will be working to resolve it as quickly as possible. It may just be a case of new components needing to bed in, for all we know, the OG Nemesis could have had something similar back in 1994.
 
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I have never felt or heard a rattle on any B&M like I have on Reborn. Ever. It is very uncharacteristic for one of their coasters.

I haven't ridden the surf coaster or that nonsense lumbering monkey coaster at Chessington so can't comment on those. The roughest and most uncomfortable B&M I've ever ridden where the ride quality ruined the ride is by far and away Dragon Kahn, and that was quite aggressive jolts and not rattles or constant vibrations in quick succession so was a completely different kettle of fish. Maybe it could be argued that older B&M's like original Nemesis had it, or even Oblivion, Galactica, or Inferno currently have it. You could even go as new as Silver Star and The Swarm. But if that's the case it's nothing like I experienced on Reborn and the others were not tangibly noticeable to me.

I was expecting Reborn to be something like Black Mamba, but with old school profiling. Mamba is also whisper quiet and extremely smooth, but it's Inversions are profiled less aggressively. Reborn for the first half was exactly as I expected, a slightly tamed and very smooth experience that still felt mostly like Nemesis. But the rattling started by the stall before the loop slightly which wasn't really a biggie. It took the loop smoothly but then rattled again in the stall going down to the ground level corkscrew. That final inversion felt slower and slightly gravelly, coming out of it there were very noticeable vibrations and very loud noises until the brake run.

Like I said, I can't categorise it as "rough", but it was loud and detracting enough to make it feel not only completely different to Nemesis (which the first half didn't), but also uncharacteristic from any B&M I've ever ridden. It started like the Icon rattle, but progressed to far more than that.
 
DistortAMG said:
Without going massively off topic. The only suspension Galactica has refers to the cars when sitting in the load position. There is no suspension on the track or wheel assembly's, so no such suspension that will contribute to making the ride smoother. As soon as the crafts lift into the flying position and lock into place, the shock absorbers that absorb the weight of people getting in and out of the crafts become completely redundant and all load is transferred through the lock pins into the rest of the chassis, rigidly. Modern dive coasters have sprung loaded wheel assemblies to clamp the wheels to the track, very different from a suspension system. It needs to be spring loaded on a coaster like a dive machine to account for movements between the wheel assemblies and track, they do not absorb any shock however, setup totally different.

Rollercoasters don't have suspension systems like you would see in a car, as they would very quickly absorb the potential energy that is allowing the train to complete a circuit of the track without stalling. The closest you get to a suspension is the compound used in the material that makes up the wheels.

I think perhaps Do-Dodonpa possibly had a suspension system in the traditional sense. One of the very few coasters to exist that ever did. They could get away with it because the pneumatic launch was just nuts thus they could afford to loose some potential energy, also because it really was needed to help prevent serious injury.

Pretty certain no coasters at Towers including Nemesis have a suspension system. B&M don't do them full stop, as with the other manufacturers that make it Towers' coaster collection. Intamin may have done one or two over their long history but that's about it, if even that.

Going back to Nemesis, this vibration is interesting, I am sure the park and B&M will be working to resolve it as quickly as possible. It may just be a case of new components needing to bed in, for all we know, the OG Nemesis could have had something similar back in 1994.
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I think I didn't really explain what i meant by suspension, I meant a sprung main wheels (gal deffinatly has sprung side wheels and I am pretty sure I read it has sprung main wheels) that should make a better ride as when getting air time it won't have the tollerance meaning there is no gap so it won't bang on the top, I thought it may also help reduce vibrations but thinking about it now it probably dosn't have much of an effect.
so I do agree apart from some rare models there is no propper suspension.
 
Much Like Matt. GC has commented my last ride of Nemesis in 2022 was quite sad as it was my first major ride I ever went on, and I think the original will be hard to beat. But I'm glad to see AT and Merlin put some investment and love into what is such a loved ride by many not just here but across the world.

I've only managed 2 rides on Reborn so far (visited 20th March).
We were kept in the queue for nearly an hour for our first ride while maintenance staff walked up the gantry to the lift hill and watched one of the trains go round, looking specifically at the first helix and inverted loop after the stall turn. They then took a ride on it a few times, swapping places each time, before declaring the ride was closed due to technical issues and they took iPad's out looking at the track. They then swapped trains over and rode with just the first 4 rows for the rest of the day.

The ride myself and my friends noticed no rattle or roughness ourselves. We did all comment how it seemed a lot 'tamer' than OG Nemesis though. Man, I miss that intensity I always experienced when going through the first helix.

Walking in to Forbidden Valley looks absolutely fantastic. There were actors around with signs and Phalanx operatives trying to shut them up. The whole area really looks and feels alive, as though Nemesis really has taken over the area. 10/10 from me.
Even after seeing it in person I'm not really a fan of the track. The original colour was a lot more low-key. I'd have also loved to see the original gun/drill being re-used instead of the new, boxy one which personally looks a little cheap to me.

The beast itself looks fantastic. Wow. Inside and outside. Though what happens with the eye over time I'm not sure. Let's hope the clean-up they've done around the park and TLC they've given to rides such as Oblivion is a sign of good things to continue!

I'm hoping to take another trip back soon but am not feeling confident with comments here regarding reliability and ride cofmort.
 
Apparently I can't quote myself from the original from October 2023, but I reckon I should get acting royalties (only joking). This was my post:

"I'm kind of sad for the Nemesis creature now. Nemesis creatures have feelings too. Just think about it, trapped, pinned down in the Staffordshire countryside in the middle of the pitch black cold nights of winter year after year. Having to listen to the same music day after day for months on end. I think someone should start a petition to set it free".

Happy to contribute John and team, no worries ;)
 
I’ve got to say I think Nemmy rebo was running a lot smoother today. It opened early and staff were clearly ready for 10am opening- they even let us in the main queue from way before 10! Ops were excellent on two trains all day- rattles still there but I felt it was less pronounced than when I visited last week!?
I also had the absolute treat of a front and back row ride!
Though noticed the little cage by the helicopter is missing a skeleton - surely a phalanx man Skelton fit with moustache would go nicely in there? There’s a ladder right next to it as well so could be quite easy to add!
They seem to working on phalanx official soil corner™️ as well. There was tech services team member working on the blue pump/ pipe thing. There was a little jcb there at the start of the day that did get moved later on.
 
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