Paultons Park: General Discussion

[AstroDan]

I do think Paulton’s is good value for money.
2 days at the park and 1 night stay 5 miles away £322.
Alton Towers for just the hotel is £302.
Both the same date 30th to 31st August and for 2 adults 2 children.

Which hotel is this? You can't really compare a hotel 5miles away with an on site resort hotel. I mean there are hotels a few miles from Alton for £75 a night.

I'd wager you could get a hotel in Uttoxeter, Ashbourne or otherwise with tickets for similar to your Paultons package?

 

[pluk]

For those taking issue with the queue time and fastrack based self promotion, this is a great example how they run it.

Today is sold out, you can't buy a ticket, they won't take your money. The very expensive premium AP holders can still attend, but there aren't that many of them.

These are the queue times...


That's as busy as they'll allow it to get, there's mo need to buy (or sell!) fastrack. You are basically guaranteed a good day out.

Note, availability is 100%, the listed closed ride was emoved last year for next year's new water ride.

They are not trading off of any lack of popularity, they are being popular by being excellent.

 

[Enter Valhalla]

This must be a fairly recent change then, because when me and my partner visited in April 2021, many of the queues (including Cobra, Flight of the Pterosaur and the Dinosaur Tour Company) were sitting at 40-50 minutes for most of the day.

It’s an interesting strategy by UK standards, or even by the standards of most theme parks globally. But if it’s working for them, then why not I guess

 

[rob666]

Just a shame that, with their "exclusive" pricing policy, poor people have no chance of seeing it!

 

[Thameslink Rail]

During COVID they struggled to provide enough annual pass slots while selling enough day tickets to break even and keeping guest numbers low enough to allow social distancing therefore longer queues were inevitable even if detrimental to the experience. Still way better than Merlin who ran an annual pass sale through summer 2020 causing them to be shamed by BBC Watchdog as pass holders couldn't book. Despite this, Thorpe and Chessington still frequently got queues 120+ although admittedly they had to close more attractions during phase 2 as they have more indoor areas.

 

[pluk]

Just a shame that, with their "exclusive" pricing policy, poor people have nochance of seeing it!

People who are actually poor can't go to Merlin parks either I guess.
Where is does your 'too poor to see it' gauge rest in terms of pricing acceptability sit? Should nice things not exist because not everyone can have them? A lot of people here treat them as an everyday thing, but a theme park should really be a treat.

And I think that you can argue the position the Merlin parks put people in, banding about low and discounted prices and then hitting them with costs that are not necessarily clear once they are there and commited, is a lot worse for those less well off than having a headline price they can save up for and it to be an honest price.

 

[rob666]

Two for one vouchers and clubcard points give greater access to Merlin parks.
I've done Melin parks for free for decades with the Sun vouchers.

 

[Benzin]

Shouldn't have to resort to buying such a rag to get free tickets.

Also what if you can't afford to shop at Tesco?

The "too poor to afford" argument can just be made eternal if we start moving goalposts. But given that Paultons is still really a regional park in one of the more affluent ones of England is it a surprise that that's their current market?

 

[pluk]

Two for one vouchers and clubcard points give greater access to Merlin parks.

Ah, so poor enough that the only way you can afford a day out is with spending your club card points, but not so poor that you actually need to spend those points on food not to be hungry. Got it

All spending on themeparks is entirely frivolous, whether that's cash, points with other spending opportunities, or the not insignificant amount of money needed to buy a shitrag for a couple of weeks to gather tokens. I don't really understand why the concept of paying a bit (and it really is only a bit) more for a nicer non-essential thing is in any way contentious here. It's the same with basically any entertainment.

 

[Shaggy_Dog_]

Just a shame that, with their "exclusive" pricing policy, poor people have no chance of seeing it!

We’ve mentioned this already in the thread recently but Paulton’s sell advance tickets for £39 pounds some days I believe, pretty sure that stacks up well next to Merlin that sell advance Towers tickets for something like £34 or the BOGOF deal where you get two tickets for £69 or thereabouts.

By the way, have you ever visited Paulton’s? Treat yourself one day, you might actually really enjoy it, especially the very well tended gardens that are clearly so well looked after.

 

[rob666]

I haven't been to Paultons, and living a long way away, with no kids, and a wife with kiddie park refusal, I'm unlikely ever to go.

 

[Enter Valhalla]

I appreciate that a lot of people on here like the Paultons business model, but the way that people defend it so aggressively, I do find pretty surprising.

Paultons are, as far as I’m aware, the only park in the UK to operate this business model, so to say the least, it must have its pros and cons. Unless of course you believe that it’s as binary as Paultons have it right, all the rest have it wrong.

 

[rob666]

If the punters are happy, and the business is making a profit and expanding steadily with a quality product, I would guess they have got it right.
Many others haven't got it "as right".

 

[Benzin]

Paultons has the highest rating compared to the Merlin 4.

1.5 higher than Chessie & Legoland, its closest competitors in target audience.

Clearly doing something right.

 

[shakey]

On the subject of prices, I did a quick check and based on online prices and including parking, this is the cost of a family of four with 2 adults and 2 children at Poultons, Towers and Blackpool for a Random Saturday in September.

I know you can park at Blackpool for free if you know where to park but most families will pay for parking so I have added on £10 which I think is the current sea front car park price.

Also Blackpool have the most complicated pricing policy with a lower price for under 12s, lower prices midweek and higher prices if you book less than 7 days in advance.

Poultons : £167
Towers: £163
Blackpool (with 2 under 12 booked 7 days in advance): £154
Blackpool (with 1 under 12 booked 7 days in advance): £160
Blackpool (with 0 under 12 booked 7 days in advance): £166

Blackpool does have cheaper days if you choose to go midweek which the other parks don't but Blackpool also charges more if you book less than 7 days in advance , which the other parks don't.

Poultons also have free entry for anyone under a meter in height which is most 3 year olds.

Towers let 2 year olds in for free.

Blackpool let two year olds in for free but they aren't allowed on the rides unless they pay the under 12 entry fee !!

So overall there isn't really much difference in the prices, but if you have a 3 year old then Poultons becomes the much cheaper option.




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[pluk]

I appreciate that a lot of people on here like the Paultons business model, but the way that people defend it so aggressively, I do find pretty surprising.

As much as anything it's how much I passionately hate the Merlin model. The inflated headline price designed to be discounted, the unjustifiable parking charged in unmaintained carparks, the whole concept of paid fastrack, the atrocious food and beverage value. I think it about as close to a con as you can legally get to, and the result is parks that are very frequentl not a very nive place to be. Being the opposite of all that is what makes the Paultons model so refreshing.

More than that though, it's the either fake or to me misguided 'won't somebody think of the poor' altruistic comments that grate. If an individual doesn't like that they don't feel like they personally can afford or justify the price then that is entirely fair enough, to project that onto 'the poor' is just crass considering we are all in a position where we can waste a good amount of money on themeparks, but somehow one amount of money is morally acceptable over another?

Paultons are, as far as I’m aware, the only park in the UK to operate this business model, so to say the least, it must have its pros and cons. Unless of course you believe that it’s as binary as Paultons have it right, all the rest have it wrong.

Spending a good amount of time in a lot of parks, I would say Paultons have it objectively right. Multiple online review sites, queue times, and ride availability data would tend to agree!

 

[Enter Valhalla]

So are we ignoring the fact that, although Paultons does have some very well themed areas, there are various bits of the park which look bland and dated?

When you’re surrounded by the beautiful theming of Lost Kingdom and Tornado Springs, to then literally only walk a few steps into areas like the log flume and water play area, the area around the Teacups and Kotiki and the areas around the go carts, Cobra and Edge, it really serves to highlight just how much of a difference in quality there is.

Forget the “think of the poor” comment (I’ve never made this argument anyway), but I struggle to agree with the argument that it’s a totally premium product and therefore justifies premium pricing. If the level of theming quality extended across the whole park (which I expect in the future it will), then I’d be totally on board with the argument that it’s a premium price for a premium product. I would say this about Phantasialand for example. Paultons I don’t think are there yet. That’s just my opinion anyway.

 

[Ian]

For me this debate always harkens back to an EAS panel about 10 years ago. There were speakers representing a number of big parks, including Efteling, Puy du Fou and Amanda Thompson from Blackpool Pleasure Beach. It was said that ‘a quality park doesn’t need to have deals and discounts. It sells itself.’

Whilst the panel seemed to agree with this statement, all - bar PdF, who apparently never discount their product (or at least did) - also flagged that coupon culture has such a hold and makes it much harder to operate in that manner, especially in times of recession or economic downturn.

I seem to remember Amanda making a comment that whilst she agreed with the principle of never discounting your product it was near impossible to compete when seemingly every aisle of the supermarket has some product with a Merlin voucher on it.

Paultons, for right or for wrong seems to be challenging this norm and living by this ethos. Evidently it is working for them. It’s managed to carve out a niche for itself in spite of the UK industry trends, and I don’t think anyone can deny that it seems to be leading to a transformation of the park where the focus is squarely on quality and guest experience. The journey is still on-going, but they are gearing up to have a solid, all-round product within the next decade or so I would expect (Paultons is almost the UK’s Toverland in that respect). This is a something I think many of us would agree is what Merlin parks have lacked over the last decade, in spite of a park like Alton Towers being capable of flagship status and the jewel in the UK theme park crown. This is why I think Paultons and their strategy attracts so much interest from enthusiasts.

Merlin, by contrast, operates much more of a stack ‘em high, sell ‘em cheap model, fuelled almost entirely by the likes of BOGOF deals and free Sun tickets, and measured their success by the number of people they got across the gate line. When you hold such a monopoly on the sector, competitors will almost always be forced to follow suit.

 

[shakey]

So are we ignoring the fact that, although Paultons does have some very well themed areas, there are various bits of the park which look bland and dated?

When you’re surrounded by the beautiful theming of Lost Kingdom and Tornado Springs, to then literally only walk a few steps into areas like the log flume and water play area, the area around the Teacups and Kotiki and the areas around the go carts, Cobra and Edge, it really serves to highlight just how much of a difference in quality there is.

Forget the “think of the poor” comment (I’ve never made this argument anyway), but I struggle to agree with the argument that it’s a totally premium product and therefore justifies premium pricing. If the level of theming quality extended across the whole park (which I expect in the future it will), then I’d be totally on board with the argument that it’s a premium price for a premium product. I would say this about Phantasialand for example. Paultons I don’t think are there yet. That’s just my opinion anyway.

But they aren't really charging a premium price are they ?

And even the "bland and dated" parts of the park are still very well kept.

If I still had a young child and distance wasn't an issue then Poultons would easily be my number one theme park destination in the UK.

I don't know what the long term plans are for the place, they may well stick to the family market, but they are only a couple of thrill rides away from being a major park for all ages.



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[pluk]

So are we ignoring the fact that, although Paultons does have some very well themed areas, there are various bits of the park which look bland and dated?

When you’re surrounded by the beautiful theming of Lost Kingdom and Tornado Springs, to then literally only walk a few steps into areas like the log flume and water play area, the area around the Teacups and Kotiki and the areas around the go carts, Cobra and Edge, it really serves to highlight just how much of a difference in quality there is.

As has been said, the worst that can really be leveled at those area is they are not themed. Even with that being the case they are immaculately maintained and spotlessly clean. It is also really obvious that the plan is to envelop these legacy areas into new areas as the park evolves.

That's not the case with the competitors, areas are left to literally rot until they become unsafe or unserviceable when they are patched up. And finding an area that could be described as beautiful can be pretty tough to start with too!

It's much starker walking from Wickerman to X Sector, Dark Forrest, or almost anywhere in Towers! Even the new areas in Chessington are falling apart already. So yes, both the new parts are nicer, and the old parts a lot nicer, than the equivalents. Premium!