Ride Access Pass and Disabled Access - 2024 Discussion

[BarryZola]

"What support do you need?"
"Why do you need it?"
"What evidence can you provide to prove this?"
"If we don't give you a RAP, how will you access the attractions?"

Hypothetical:

1. The support I need is that I require the right not to queue for any more than a short period of time.
2. I have suffered with anxiety and can become very flustered amongst crowds for longer periods of time.
3. I have evidence from the doctors from our consultations and a prescription for anti-depressants.
4. If I am denied a RAP I will not be able to go on the rides at theme parks on an average day.

Think how many people could say this, and get a RAP, even if they don't strictly need one?

 

[Bowser]

It's not about limiting it to physical disabilities. It is about limiting it to people who can't queue.

This really.

Dividing between physical and mental makes no sense in terms of accessibility. A physical disability is often more about queue access than an inability to wait, just as a mental disability can be ambulant but unable to understand or tolerate various elements of lengthy queuing. And of course there is plenty of crossover.

 

[pjanvil]

Hypothetical:

1. The support I need is that I require the right not to queue for any more than a short period of time.
2. I have suffered with anxiety and can become very flustered amongst crowds for longer periods of time.
3. I have evidence from the doctors from our consultations and a prescription for anti-depressants.
4. If I am denied a RAP I will not be able to go on the rides at theme parks on an average day.

Think how many people could say this, and get a RAP, even if they don't strictly need one?

Even if I can't qualify on that basis I'm sure one of my friends easily could, if thats the criteria plus combined with up to 3 friends. I'd have thought nearly everyone could access the RAP queue on that basis (or one of their 3 friends could qualify) so if everyone can access the RAP queue its essentially redundant. Then you just pick the shorter of the two queues. Additionally it still acts as a free fastpass for the first ride. Useful for a new ride opening for example.

 

[Bowser]

Even if I can't qualify on that basis I'm sure one of my friends easily could, if thats the criteria plus combined with up to 3 friends. I'd have thought nearly everyone could access the RAP queue on that basis (or one of their 3 friends could qualify) so if everyone can access the RAP queue its essentially redundant. Then you just pick the shorter of the two queues. Additionally it still acts as a free fastpass for the first ride. Useful for a new ride opening for example.

Not aimed at you but this mentality very much exists and it's depressing. People trying to take advantage of a system aimed at helping the most vulnerable.

It's incredibly sad when you see people for who the day is an obvious struggle, no doubt quietly becoming further alienated because for all the complaints about RAP the intention is admirable. We simply wouldn't be able to visit these parks without it and it's single handedly made our lives so much more enjoyable having something we can look forward to doing in the holidays.

There's been a few positive reports of the implementation of the booking capacity from CWOA so let's see where we are in a month or two.

 

[TPick]

Don't think limiting to physical disabilities only would be the way to go - would make things very them and us for a start. Without RAP for our son we wouldn't be able to visit the parks, but his RAP is mostly for mental issues rather than physical. To lose RAP and subsequently access to the parks because his disabilities aren't physical would be a bitter pill to swallow.

Don't know the solution to be honest, tightening up requirements for access card applications maybe rather than loosening as some people have said is happening. To be honest, if you have a disability or have kids etc. with a disability then filling out a massive form and providing sh!t loads of evidence would be nothing new.

 

[ScottishChris]

Hypothetical:

1. The support I need is that I require the right not to queue for any more than a short period of time.
2. I have suffered with anxiety and can become very flustered amongst crowds for longer periods of time.
3. I have evidence from the doctors from our consultations and a prescription for anti-depressants.
4. If I am denied a RAP I will not be able to go on the rides at theme parks on an average day.

Think how many people could say this, and get a RAP, even if they don't strictly need one?

My point was more about asking people to describe what they need and why, instead of the Nimbus system of 'You've said you have condition X - here's what you can get.' I truly believe there is an attitude of 'I'm entitled to this so I'm using it'.

 

[BarryZola]

The Nimbus/Access Card and then onto getting your Merlin RAP does actually require you to say that you can't queue and then asks for evidence. The point is that it's almost as easy for a person who has had some exposure to a certain mental condition but who can actually queue normally to get a RAP as it is for someone who is a terrible sufferer of a mental condition that absolutely restricts their ability to queue 95% of the time. And we know that it's now discrimination to ask too much about peoples disabilities so it's hard to differentiate between those genuinely in need and others who are not but meet the application criteria if they choose to apply.

 

[TPick]

Sorry, as a reminder, what is the issue with getting the Chessington/Legoland RAP system working at AT and Thorpe Park? Is AT crappy internet/mobile data availability? Can't believe that is the case at Thorpe Park.

 

[Alphe86]

Supposedly but I get fine signal on three

 

[Bowser]

Sorry, as a reminder, what is the issue with getting the Chessington/Legoland RAP system working at AT and Thorpe Park? Is AT crappy internet/mobile data availability? Can't believe that is the case at Thorpe Park.

No reminder required, it’s inconclusive and don’t believe there’s any official word. Anecdotally all the parks have fine or bad signal for different networks and all operate digital fast track and photo schemes so makes no sense RAP isn’t the same considering the issues.

 

[imanautie]

No reminder required, it’s inconclusive and don’t believe there’s any official word. Anecdotally all the parks have fine or bad signal for different networks and all operate digital fast track and photo schemes so makes no sense RAP isn’t the same considering the issues.

Digital fastrack doesn't require the validation point to have data connection at all times (it can offline scan), loqueue also scans offline however it won't start the timeout till it gets back online.

 

[Alphe86]

Digital fastrack doesn't require the validation point to have data connection at all times (it can offline scan), loqueue also scans offline however it won't start the timeout till it gets back online.

As long as you have connection when generating the QR code the time is set by the park scanner which is then registered via the server and pushed to the account. There seems no logic reason

 

[RIPCorky]

Hypothetical:

1. The support I need is that I require the right not to queue for any more than a short period of time.
2. I have suffered with anxiety and can become very flustered amongst crowds for longer periods of time.
3. I have evidence from the doctors from our consultations and a prescription for anti-depressants.
4. If I am denied a RAP I will not be able to go on the rides at theme parks on an average day.

Think how many people could say this, and get a RAP, even if they don't strictly need one?

Indeed
Merlin are pretty much snookered here because if they take the RAP away from people who are not physically disabled then there will be an uproar. Maybe I'm wrong but I still think people who are physically disabled or unable to navigate an uneven queue line or partially sighted should be given this as a priority. Mainly because they're probably less likely to be able to make the trip there in the first place due to their disability, also getting around the park to each ride will take much much longer too so they are less likely to get on more rides on busy days.

Given the wide range of disabilities and conditions splitting the population into 50/50 was always going to cause this mess

 

[Trickytree]

So, just popped in here to see what everyone’s opinions are on this.
We have been going Alton Towers for years and didn’t know there had been a change. We booked for Thursday but due to a family issue we had to move it to Tuesday. I have a Little boy who’s 9 and goes to a special needs school. He has autism and mobility issues and physically can’t queue for long periods. He keeps coming down stairs saying he can’t wait to go.
We’ve gone in to book a RAP and there’s nothing for weeks. I’ve been told by Alton Towers that I can’t cancel and I just have to move it but he goes to a special needs school and can only get in the holidays. I’ve been told by customer services I’m to drive an hour and 45 minutes to get there Tuesday for 9am and see if there’s any cancellations lololol, if we are turned away at the gate my sons going to be devastated. It’s not as if we are just after an easy way onto the rides, he physically can’t queue for that long it seems unreal to me and I can’t understand who thought this would be a good idea

 

[Hazza]

So, just popped in here to see what everyone’s opinions are on this.
We have been going Alton Towers for years and didn’t know there had been a change. We booked for Thursday but due to a family issue we had to move it to Tuesday. I have a Little boy who’s 9 and goes to a special needs school. He has autism and mobility issues and physically can’t queue for long periods. He keeps coming down stairs saying he can’t wait to go.
We’ve gone in to book a RAP and there’s nothing for weeks. I’ve been told by Alton Towers that I can’t cancel and I just have to move it but he goes to a special needs school and can only get in the holidays. I’ve been told by customer services I’m to drive an hour and 45 minutes to get there Tuesday for 9am and see if there’s any cancellations lololol, if we are turned away at the gate my sons going to be devastated. It’s not as if we are just after an easy way onto the rides, he physically can’t queue for that long it seems unreal to me and I can’t understand who thought this would be a good idea

I genuinely baffled as to why they would implement this, on paper it works to keep RAP queues low but in action all it does is restrict people from making spontaneous trips to Alton Towers. I am planning on going on Wednesday and still haven't got my Merlin disabled pass yet as the ID from the nimbus card isn't working. I'm doing all this work to get an RAP card for Wednesday and I find out that it may be booked out? It's honestly making me regret not doing it weeks ago, when I wasn't even thinking going this year.

 

[Mick]

I wonder if, of the allocation they’ve deduced for RAP, they should allow a % for annual pass holders and a % for ticket buyers, as it wouldn’t surprise me at all if the vast majority booking up the limited RAP places are currently pass holders.

 

[Bowser]

I wonder if, of the allocation they’ve deduced for RAP, they should allow a % for annual pass holders and a % for ticket buyers, as it wouldn’t surprise me at all if the vast majority booking up the limited RAP places are currently pass holders.

I was just starting to write something similar. MAP holders have the benefit of a risk free booking situation, which i know for myself and i'm sure others is one of the big appeals for MAP when you're often unable to be sure if you'll make a trip.

Though conversely i do wonder if we will see a situation where MAP purchases drop off as frustrated holders are no longer able to get value from them due to being unable to redeem RAP slots.

 

[TPick]

Maybe I'm wrong but I still think people who are physically disabled or unable to navigate an uneven queue line or partially sighted should be given this as a priority. Mainly because they're probably less likely to be able to make the trip there in the first place due to their disability

Not sure I agree with this if I have read it right. Depending on the physical disability, in theory that person could choose to attend as often as they like and unaccompanied. My son for example, with his many neuro diverse conditions will never be able to attend without relying on at least two other people accompanying him.

Not trying to pit one disability against another, but think this shows how restricting RAP to physical disabilities may not work and could cause tensions.

 

[TPick]

No reminder required, it’s inconclusive and don’t believe there’s any official word. Anecdotally all the parks have fine or bad signal for different networks and all operate digital fast track and photo schemes so makes no sense RAP isn’t the same considering the issues.

As long as you have connection when generating the QR code the time is set by the park scanner which is then registered via the server and pushed to the account. There seems no logic reason

So from a technical point of view they could have the same system at AT and Thorpe Park. But for some reason known only to Merlin they are choosing not to do that.

 

[Bowser]

So from a technical point of view they could have the same system at AT and Thorpe Park. But for some reason known only to Merlin they are choosing not to do that.

I do remember being asked in an AT survey about if I’d prefer the system to change to digital.

It is nice not being glued to your phone all day but don’t think that outweighs the other benefits at this point.