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Ride Access Pass Systems and Disabled Access (pre 2024)

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Well I never thought I'd see the day where Daily Mail could help Towers! It's parallel to that episode of South Park where the townsfolk need Bin Laden's help to wipe out all the Jersey Shore cast
 
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I remember when there was an article about Flamingo Land's system and a lad being barred from riding without a companion, even though there were only two of them and the companion didn't want to ride He then went down the main queue and they still refused him access. Pretty sure it was in the DM.
 
I think the answer, as others have suggested, is to make the RAP experience the same as any other guest. It shouldn't be quicker or better than using the normal queuelines. After all, it's not Fastrack.

I'm sure I heard a similar story of a supermarket that had family parking bays near the entrance. They found a lot of abuse as lazy people just used them as they were closer, so they moved the family bays away from the entrance. Now there was no incentive for the lazy people to use them. Meanwhile families could still use them for the extra space opening doors, adjusting child seats etc.

Basically, it's about keeping their intended purpose but removing any benefit from the abusers.
 
Alsty said:
I think the answer, as others have suggested, is to make the RAP experience the same as any other guest. It shouldn't be quicker or better than using the normal queuelines. After all, it's not Fastrack.

I'm sure I heard a similar story of a supermarket that had family parking bays near the entrance. They found a lot of abuse as lazy people just used them as they were closer, so they moved the family bays away from the entrance. Now there was no incentive for the lazy people to use them. Meanwhile families could still use them for the extra space opening doors, adjusting child seats etc.

Basically, it's about keeping their intended purpose but removing any benefit from the abusers.
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I agree but no idea how this would look. Even legoland's system which for many rap users is the least liked (some do like this system the best) is abused as it is essentially qbot and fast track and people go on other rides while waiting for a ride on the qbot (queuing for 2 rides at the same time). Alton has problems with wheelchair access as many of the queue lines aren't accessible so even excluding cognitive issues there still has to be some form of other access. I'd like to see proof of disability restricted to either a blue badge, high rate pip or dla or a social worker letter rather than a medical professional.
 
Trollydolly said:
I'd like to see proof of disability restricted to either a blue badge, high rate pip or dla or a social worker letter rather than a medical professional.
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A blue badge and high rate DLA/PIP mobility component are supposed to be primary for those with mobility issues, (the criteria was for those that can't walk for no more than 50 meters which was reduced to 30 meters a few years ago, there were a few exceptions, double leg amputees and unable to use a coin machine due to bilateral hands problems and also in exceptional circumstances special consideration would also be granted ). However some councils decided to go against the criteria and decided to give blue badges out to those that had non mobility disabilities. Also you had people applying for them that either exaggerate their medical condition as well as those that once was entitled to one due to mobility disability, who has had corrective surgery (like a joint replacement) but fail to inform the relevant department that they no longer need a blue badge.

Late last year it was announced that blue badges criteria will be extended to those with hidden disabilities too, whether the criteria has recently change or is due to change, which might also be the reason why we see an increase in the RAP use this season. So I can only see the situation getting worse and it might not just be all Alton's (and other parks) fault. Bringing the RAP back under control might be completely out of the parks hands.

As the RAP queue lines in-crease alone with limited rear seats for the RAPs, I feel that the RAP waiting time will exceed the regular queue line waiting time and won't affect the regular visitors, the only real losers here and these are the people that I feel sorry for, and that's the people that genuinely can't use the regular queue lines.

Disclaimer: I just want to make it clear that I have nothing against disable people, whether they have a hidden disability or not. I'm not also just for the wheelchair users, I'm also for supporting people with hidden disabilities too providing that they genuinely need to use RAP. I'm just against anyone abusing or making a mockery out of the system that is designed to help the disable in real need. :)
 
I'm surprised that RAP guests aren't put in the front on Nemesis and Galactica, as they would be easily seen by the CCTV. Also, I think the park should ditch the wristbands and just use the cards.
 
RoyJess said:
A blue badge and high rate DLA/PIP mobility component are supposed to be primary for those with mobility issues, (the criteria was for those that can't walk for no more than 50 meters which was reduced to 30 meters a few years ago, there were a few exceptions, double leg amputees and unable to use a coin machine due to bilateral hands problems and also in exceptional circumstances special consideration would also be granted ). However some councils decided to go against the criteria and decided to give blue badges out to those that had non mobility disabilities. Also you had people applying for them that either exaggerate their medical condition as well as those that once was entitled to one due to mobility disability, who has had corrective surgery (like a joint replacement) but fail to inform the relevant department that they no longer need a blue badge.

Late last year it was announced that blue badges criteria will be extended to those with hidden disabilities too, whether the criteria has recently change or is due to change, which might also be the reason why we see an increase in the RAP use this season. So I can only see the situation getting worse and it might not just be all Alton's (and other parks) fault. Bringing the RAP back under control might be completely out of the parks hands.

As the RAP queue lines in-crease alone with limited rear seats for the RAPs, I feel that the RAP waiting time will exceed the regular queue line waiting time and won't affect the regular visitors, the only real losers here and these are the people that I feel sorry for, and that's the people that genuinely can't use the regular queue lines.

Disclaimer: I just want to make it clear that I have nothing against disable people, whether they have a hidden disability or not. I'm not also just for the wheelchair users, I'm also for supporting people with hidden disabilities too providing that they genuinely need to use RAP. I'm just against anyone abusing or making a mockery out of the system that is designed to help the disable in real need. :)
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Blue badges are currently accessible (before the change) to those with severe cognitive need as an automatic qualification (high rate mobility dla under smi or vuw or high rate pip) these are the people with the most severe learning difficulties. Yes when the extended criteria comes in more people will be able to access rap through a blue badge but I think that this would cause an overall reduction as at the moment it appears the majority of users use a Dr's letter which can be paid for and covers things like rap for a nut allergy. Using a social worker letter rather than a medical letter would allow those who do not claim pip/dla to still access rap as it makes sense that if you need adjustments in a theme park your going to need them elsewhere. My suggestion is to weasel out those who just need adjustments for the time they spend in the parks rather than those who need them daily.

I'm sorry you felt the need to put a disclaimer like that. I think these discussions can be helpful and it's sad you feel you need to say something constructive but point that out to cover yourself.
 
skyscraper said:
I'm surprised that RAP guests aren't put in the front on Nemesis and Galactica, as they would be easily seen by the CCTV. Also, I think the park should ditch the wristbands and just use the cards.
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If it gets stuck on the lift hill though the people on the back have less far to walk back down.
 
Something that just occurred to me as well: It's a shame that disabled people never get to choose their seat (not all disabilities make evacuation more difficult) and also annoying for other guests who want to ride in the back row.
 
What's weird is for nemesis anyone riding via the exit goes back row normally, even fastrack

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skyscraper said:
I'm surprised that RAP guests aren't put in the front on Nemesis and Galactica, as they would be easily seen by the CCTV. Also, I think the park should ditch the wristbands and just use the cards.
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So you always take up the best seats (Back row) on the coasters, so now you want to take my front row viewing away from me too o_O ;)

Trollydolly said:
Blue badges are currently accessible (before the change) to those with severe cognitive need as an automatic qualification (high rate mobility dla under smi or vuw or high rate pip) these are the people with the most severe learning difficulties. Yes when the extended criteria comes in more people will be able to access rap through a blue badge but I think that this would cause an overall reduction as at the moment it appears the majority of users use a Dr's letter which can be paid for and covers things like rap for a nut allergy. Using a social worker letter rather than a medical letter would allow those who do not claim pip/dla to still access rap as it makes sense that if you need adjustments in a theme park your going to need them elsewhere. My suggestion is to weasel out those who just need adjustments for the time they spend in the parks rather than those who need them daily.

I'm sorry you felt the need to put a disclaimer like that. I think these discussions can be helpful and it's sad you feel you need to say something constructive but point that out to cover yourself.
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I forgot that they change the rules when PIP came in place to allow for severe cognitive needs too. As for the disclaimer, I see the situation from both sides. My wife is fully wheelchair bound, so we know the importance of making things accessible as well as knowing what it's like being on the receiving end of abuse. We also know the negative impact that people abusing the system has on the most vulnerable in society as it reduces accessibility as more people are wanting to use the disable facilities.
 
RoyJess said:
So you always take up the best seats (Back row) on the coasters, so now you want to take my front row viewing away from me too. o_O ;)



I forgot that they change the rules when PIP came in place to allow for severe cognitive needs too. As for the disclaimer, I see the situation from both sides. My wife is fully wheelchair bound, so we know the importance of making things accessible as well as knowing what it's like being on the receiving end of abuse. We also know the negative impact that people abusing the system has on the most vulnerable in society as it reduces accessibility as more people are wanting to use the disable facilities.
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I actually prefer the front of coasters. ;):tearsofjoy:
 
Was surprised to find Nemesis with no queue on my last visit, so I think we rode once in the front once in the back. Despite the other rides having significantly longer queues, I can honestly say neither of us noticed the RAP users so it can't have slowed down operations too much
 
speedy said:
Was surprised to find Nemesis with no queue on my last visit, so I think we rode once in the front once in the back. Despite the other rides having significantly longer queues, I can honestly say neither of us noticed the RAP users so it can't have slowed down operations too much
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You didn't notices the back 1/3rd of 13 being reserved only for rap or the huge rap que outside of of wicker man?
 
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Would be good if all the coasters could adopt the system used on Wicker Man, Galactica and Smiler, where the RAP queue leads to the usual boarding gates and ambulant guests don't have to sit in a particular row. That would free up the back rows for regular guests.
 
Personally, I think that the problem is not with the RAP system, it is with the whole queuing system. On busy days, because queues frequently exceed an hour, it is difficult to get even six rides in. Who wouldn't want to skip those queues and have a day out that is worth the £38 you paid for it? It would be so much fairer if Merlin implemented a timed ticket system on major rides therefore rendering the RAP useless and causing all guests to be happier. But because Merlin earn so much on Fasttrack, (a system that allows people with more money to spoil everyone else's day), this will never happen.
 
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