Ride Access Pass Systems and Disabled Access (pre 2024)

[Blackhole_Sun]

This will massively help efficiency
It took so long for the Offloader to deal with signing the cards, checking restraints and people trying to load from the exit!

I’d quite like the split to be at the old merge point, so RAP will use the old SRQ and does not require another staff member

I’d hope long term that if merge staffing is back, the SRQ could return as it worked well on oblivion

The staff member stands at the top where that last turret is facing towards SpinJam.

There is a spilt into three lanes now (they added a new barrier in the middle).

They have a line for fast track, normal queue and now RAP. Is there any room for single rider now?

 

[Rocket]

The staff member stands at the top where that last turret is facing towards SpinJam.

There is a spilt into three lanes now (they added a new barrier in the middle).

They have a line for fast track, normal queue and now RAP. Is there any room for single rider now?

If RAP is using the 3rd lane then unfortunately not, RAP would have be in the same lane as fastrack to have the SRQ back again.

But it will be interesting to see how this new system works during peak times like scarefest

 

[Enter Valhalla]

Just wanted to pick up on a few points suggesting that Merlin haven’t kept on top of their RAP systems. Whilst I agree that more could have been done, I would argue that the systems are constantly being reviewed and the right balance sought between being fair and being as inclusive as possible (admittedly they don’t always get it right, but it is constantly being looked at).

Since 2017 for example the following changes have been made to Chessington’s RAP system:

- The staff no longer cap the queue time at 45 minutes. In 2017 and before, even if the queue was 2 hours, the most they were allowed to write on the card was 45 minutes. This changed and they can now put whatever the queue time is.

- Staff now write a time on all rides. Prior to 2018, they only wrote a queue time on the top 8 rides, meaning that RAP holders essentially got free Ultimate Fastrack on the smaller rides.

- RAP holders now have to book 7 days in advance when they used to be able to just rock up and claim a pass.

As the number of RAP users has increased, steps have been taken to improve the situation.

Much as I know how upset enthusiasts get if you dare to criticise Paultons, I have to say that limiting the number of RAP users in a day and telling them they can only use each ride once, seems pretty unfair. I don’t use a RAP but if I fancied going to Paultons, I could easily book a ticket for any day. Why should people with disabilities be denied that right, especially if they physically don’t have the ability to queue. That seems pretty unfair to me. Same goes for if they want to go on an attraction twice but can’t physically queue.

 

[Benzin]

Paultons is a weird one, but when we visited we were able to ride Storm Chaser twice.

Might be ambulant versus wheelchair users in that case.

The Merlin problem is even with these changes there are still problems throughout the parks. That said when I was working at Chessie we didn't have a 45 minute cap on it (though there wasn't the high level of usage seen today). That sounds exceptionally stupid and probably sums up Chessie's management back then.

 

[Enter Valhalla]

Agreed. I always thought that the 45 minute cap was incredibly silly. It came in around 2015 I think, and when a new manager took over the scheme in 2018, the 45 minute cap as well as the top 8 rides limit was removed. Despite the RAP’s issues, it is at least a lot fairer now than in the days of the 45 minute cap.

 

[Poisson]

A much harder limit in the number of RAP users in the parks would do the trick. Queues would be kept down, couple that with real times written on the cards and it'll make it reasonable.

 

[John]

Telling people they're not allowed to visit at all seems like a very quick way to fall foul of anti-discrimination legislation. It'd be like the early days of MAP prebooking where people booked speculatively resulting in there being no availability on weekends.

 

[Poisson]

The current system doesn't work. A maximum cap makes it fair. Penalise those who repeatedly book and don't show. Guests without disabilities are able to queue, hence they get a large allowance.

Let's put it this way. 1 hour queue for Wicker Man is busy but manageable for the main queue. Guests with additional needs shouldn't have to queue twice, with the timeout on the card and then physically queue, which they can't do, for the ride.

 

[John]

The "fix" there is to squeeze ratios further. The new RAP entrance on Oblivion will almost certainly mean main queue moves slower than it did before. Galactica can now have more than 1 row of RAP per train, Rita loads entire trains from RAP. It's just little things here and there that add up to a considerable impact on the guest experience.

Sadly the easiest option for Merlin is to do nothing and just let the queues build up.

 

[rob666]

The current system doesn't work. A maximum cap makes it fair. Penalise those who repeatedly book and don't show. Guests without disabilities are able to queue, hence they get a large allowance.

Let's put it this way. 1 hour queue for Wicker Man is busy but manageable for the main queue. Guests with additional needs shouldn't have to queue twice, with the timeout on the card and then physically queue, which they can't do, for the ride.

A maximum cap is disability discrimination...fact.
We only let two hundred a day in sorry, the ableists keep complaining.
Ban people with beards on weekends, tall people Thursdays only...just not allowed I'm afraid.

 

[Benzin]

Merlin wise it probably needs a full rebrand away from those awful Facebook based groups who heavily push the "free Fastrack" nonsense and ruin things for everyone as a result.

New scheme, new rules. And those who are really complaining about any changes are likely to be those who were abusing it in the first place.

Honestly dreading my planned visit to Chessie. Even though going midweek in term time.

 

[Islander]

A maximum cap is disability discrimination...fact.
We only let two hundred a day in sorry, the ableists keep complaining.
Ban people with beards on weekends, tall people Thursdays only...just not allowed I'm afraid.

How would a cap at a theme park compare to, for example, a cap at a cinema or theatre on the number of wheelchair users? There is a finite provision for wheelchair users in a theatre, if they sell all those spaces for one show, further wheelchair users will be denied, even if the availability of standard seating is plentiful.

 

[pluk]

A maximum cap is disability discrimination...fact.

I don't think that would stand up to scrutiny.

1 - they are not saying if you are disabled you cannot come in, they are saying if you need a ride access pass that has sold out. Those with disabilities able and willing not to use the pass could still buy a normal ticket.

2 - the adjustment has to be reasonable, not total. Having a manageable amount of guests requiring the service when rides operate to physically limited throughputs will always be reasonable, and not managing that number can mean those requiring it cannot actually use it even with a pass which overall is LESS inclusive.

A similar situation is concert and theatre tickets. There is a section adapted for disability access, those tickets can sell out and the rest of the venue remains on sale. That's legally fine too.

But the only real answer as always is to reduce the demand and the only way to do that is to remove the free fastrack aspect of the current set up. There really is no way around it other than having a system that doesn't allow users to use other attractions while they are virtually queuing. It needs to provide access, not advantage.

 

[jon81uk]

A similar situation is concert and theatre tickets. There is a section adapted for disability access, those tickets can sell out and the rest of the venue remains on sale. That's legally fine too.

That system is broken too

Disabled music fans face ticketing barriers

Many deaf and disabled fans have problems buying tickets for concerts and festivals, a report finds.

www.bbc.co.uk

Theatre ticket policies 'a Wild West' for disabled customers

Research for Radio 4's Front Row finds inconsistencies in theatres' ticket prices and policies.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[pluk]

That system is broken too

Disabled music fans face ticketing barriers

Many deaf and disabled fans have problems buying tickets for concerts and festivals, a report finds.

www.bbc.co.uk

Theatre ticket policies 'a Wild West' for disabled customers

Research for Radio 4's Front Row finds inconsistencies in theatres' ticket prices and policies.

www.bbc.co.uk

To be fair though, the issues listed might well be even worse for the those needing support but they are issues of a system that is broken for everyone. Ticket scalping, hidden fees, fraudsters etc are a problem for all. The actual allocation of tickets for modern venues I think is roughly in line with the percentage of users in the population? It is going to be mote of an issue in historic venues, and one which isn't easily overcome in reasonable spend for adaptation.

This line raised my eyebrow though, it is a great equivalent to fastracks issues...

When tickets for Ed Sheeran's Divide tour went on sale last year, many disabled fans complained they couldn't reach the accessible booking line as it had been taken over by fans trying to obtain general tickets.

Those not needing the provision taking it away from those that do for their own self want. For both, that's what needs eliminating.

 

[pjanvil]

A maximum cap is disability discrimination...fact.
We only let two hundred a day in sorry, the ableists keep complaining.
Ban people with beards on weekends, tall people Thursdays only...just not allowed I'm afraid.

Poultons limit RAP per day and I'm sure they consulted their lawyers before implementing such a policy and as far as I'm aware they havan't been sued over it. Any adjustment has to be 'reasonable' if RAP grinds everything else to a halt I don't think that is reasonable. No one expects Warwick castle to install lifts on the side of every turret just to provide equal access to wheelchair users to the views that able-bodied users get (and substantially change the appearance of the castle in the process)

 

[Enter Valhalla]

As we’ve learnt from the Paultons topic, Paultons massively cap the number of guests generally that they allow into the park these days. This means that on ‘sold out’ days, the queues max about 20 mins. They’re limiting tickets for everyone, not just RAP users, so any issues of potential discrimination kind of sort themselves out.

Most theme parks don’t operate this business model and want to get as many people through the gates as possible. I’d say that Merlin would be on very dodgy ground if they said they could allow 17,000 guests on park but only allow, for example, 1,000 guests with RAPs.

Using the example of Paultons just isn’t comparing like for like. They have a totally different way of doing things.

 

[Benzin]

Download Festival this year had some big problems with the accessible areas over the course of the weekend. Think they ended up issuing a lot of additional wristbands to day visitors which of course meant that a lot of the available space that had likely been designed for the weekend visitors was filled up. Wasn't particularly well organised either which didn't help matters.

They also randomly didn't have access for those in our disabled camp to the village area as it was a bit of an oversight. You had to walk all the way up the hill of the camper site to get the bus, then walk through another uphill campsite. For an event that really pushes its accessibility benefits it suffered a lot this year.

I've had trouble getting accessible gig tickets through phone lines, right old pain.

 

[Blackhole_Sun]

A maximum cap is disability discrimination...fact.
We only let two hundred a day in sorry, the ableists keep complaining.
Ban people with beards on weekends, tall people Thursdays only...just not allowed I'm afraid.

People with beards don’t have a separate long queue but I get your point.

The best solution for all is to add another 5 high capacity attractions to spread the queues out a bit more.

In terms of RAP and fairness, well there is no solution other than what they basically want (to immediately fast track them on to the ride). The main queue will ultimately suffer and the greater percentage will have an unhappy trip.

 

[rob666]

People with beards don’t have a separate long queue but I get your point.

The best solution for all is to add another 5 high capacity attractions to spread the queues out a bit more.

In terms of RAP and fairness, well there is no solution other than what they basically want (to immediately fast track them on to the ride). The main queue will ultimately suffer and the greater percentage will have an unhappy trip.

There are solutions, fair ones, but they cost, or need to be followed by staff, to the letter.
The Blackpool card and band system worked well the last time I used it.
You queued the length of the last rides queue before your next ride, it was simple and effective...as long as the staff write down the correct time, can tell the time......and have a pen!
People with beards deserve their own long queue.