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Scarefest 2021

The atmosphere on these days, especially at night is indeed pretty nasty. Large gatherings of people, police everywhere, some anti social behaviour taking place and some intimidation of staff. Certainly not a family friendly feeling.

Sadly, I don't see what ATR can do about it.

One of those things that we, and the park, just have to live with.

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Going two weeks today but might not be doing the mazes as the rest of my group have changed their minds now, and I can't really do them on my own. :(

Also, it's a bit annoying that you can't buy park admission and maze tickets together like last year. They can only be booked separately.
 
AstroDan said:
The atmosphere on these days, especially at night is indeed pretty nasty. Large gatherings of people, police everywhere, some anti social behaviour taking place and some intimidation of staff. Certainly not a family friendly feeling.

Sadly, I don't see what ATR can do about it.

One of those things that we, and the park, just have to live with.

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If the police have been called then there would be good reason to add someone to a blocked list and class it as trespass if they enter again. But actually stopping them coming back would be hard. Blacklisting those individuals likely won’t make a large amount of difference if not enforced well.

As you say there is little they can do.
 
rob666 said:
All people of Romany background???
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They're not Roma. They're descendents of Irish itinerant workers who moved over to here in mainly the 19th century.

They're a real problem for society, bringing crime and violence, and too many people just shrug their shoulders and say 'what can you do?`, which just makes them more brazen in their actions, and decent people suffer more. If someone sticks up to them, they face intimidation, threats and even violence. If that doesn't work, they play the victim card.
 
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And how do you know that exactly?
Do you know any of them personally?
Probably not.
The heritage roots of travellers is not clear, they probably originated in the Indian sub continent, and there was a wandering shift, like the Jewish, from state to state through the last five hundred years, to avoid persecution, and were constantly moved on, as they often still are.
They moved to all nations in Europe, and the east, including all areas of the island of Ireland.
And using terms like "infest" makes you liable to accusations that you are a racist...animal pests and parasites infest.

The issue of travellers day could be better managed by sharing information about when the day may be, and what measures the park will be taking, before the likely day, and offering pre booked visitors the chance to change their booking.
 
rob666 said:
And how do you know that exactly?
Do you know any of them personally?
Probably not.
The heritage roots of travellers is not clear, they probably originated in the Indian sub continent, and there was a wandering shift, like the Jewish, from state to state through the last five hundred years, to avoid persecution, and were constantly moved on, as they often still are.
They moved to all nations in Europe, and the east, including all areas of the island of Ireland.
And using terms like "infest" makes you liable to accusations that you are a racist...animal pests and parasites infest.

The issue of travellers day could be better managed by sharing information about when the day may be, and what measures the park will be taking, before the likely day, and offering pre booked visitors the chance to change their booking.
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They get that intelligence from the police but it tends to be short notice. And how do you offer people to rebook? You can hardly contact everyone and say “we expect travellers you want to swap?” It would also be a method of profiling and discrimination.
 
Realistically, the only thing you can do is get the details of the troublemakers and ban them. I don't know how easy or effective that would be though.

You cannot preemptively ban people before they've done anything wrong.

As for emailing guests to tell them there's travellers visiting and offering to rebook... really? Imagine sending an email saying "There's a big event and there will be lots of blacks/ gays/ Muslims/ other minority group. Would you like to rebook to avoid them?". In what way would that possibly be acceptable?
 
Matt.GC said:
So that I can get this straight in my head, you're saying that stopping people from entering somewhere based on an "Irish sounding" surname is acceptable?
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Their anti social behaviour each year should be enough evidence to show now that they don't deserve a day on park. They seem to have no respect for others and their surroundings. If you can't behave and act like a decent human being then you shouldn't be allowed in. Damaging things and being abusive to staff who are just doing their job is completely unacceptable
 
AT86 said:
What a lovely text book explanation of discrimination you have articulated there.
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Well it's obviously not all of them, but enough of them. Don't really know how people on here stick up for them when they give staff plenty of c**p and a hard time for no reason
 
Dave said:
They get that intelligence from the police but it tends to be short notice. And how do you offer people to rebook? You can hardly contact everyone and say “we expect travellers you want to swap?” It would also be a method of profiling and discrimination.
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In communicating with pre booked customers, you can use polite, non discriminatory language in pre warning customers.
Something like..."There is a high probability that the park is going to be extremely busy with large groups going round the park together. We will not be able to offer the usual warm atmosphere within the park on this day, so if you would like to alter your booking, without charge, to another day, we will be happy to oblige, without charge."
No prejudice, no discrimination, and sufficient warning...following on from many years of easily evidenced negative experiences.

Or just sit on your hands, take a reactive approach on the day, and have a few thousand unhappy customers, on pretty much the same day, every year.
 
AT86 said:
It’s possible to disapprove of the behaviour of of individuals without resorting to discriminating the entire ethnic group.
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Since when were they an ethnic group? Can't they be anyone? They're not a specific religion or race, I've seem some that are white, black, Asian so not sure what you mean by their 'ethnic group'
 
Race Relations Act 1976 and 2000
Human Rights Act 1998
Romany Gypsies and Irish Travellers are accepted ethnic groups.

If you are a Romany mother, your child is 20 times more likely to die in infancy.
 
Out of interest, why is it that “Traveller’s Day” even exists? Surely there’s nothing wrong with travellers visiting at any time of year, if they want to?

I certainly don’t think it would be a good idea to start banning ethnic groups, though; it would almost definitely be construed as discrimination, and I think tarnishing everyone within an ethnic group with the same brush is very unfair myself. I’m sure the vast majority of the traveller population is just there to have a fun day out like everybody else.
 
Matt N said:
Out of interest, why is it that “Traveller’s Day” even exists? Surely there’s nothing wrong with travellers visiting at any time of year, if they want to?
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Mmm why don't people on here explain this one. Or are you going to claim towers are being discriminative for not letting them in whenever
 
Ethan said:
Mmm why don't people on here explain this one. Or are you going to claim towers are being discriminative for not letting them in whenever
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I was only curious because surely travellers are just as eligible to visit on the other days of the year as they are on these days? There’s nothing on the website or in the park suggesting that travellers are banned on other days of the year or anything… and there’s also no feasible way in which the park could even ban travellers. With that in mind, why is it that so many travellers visit on these specific days?

But yes, I would personally think that it is unfair to stop travellers visiting, as I wouldn’t want to ostracise an entire ethnic group like that, and I’m sure that the majority of travellers are at the park for a fun day out just like everybody else.
 
I believe the ‘traveller days’ are linked to race days at Uttoxeter race course. The adults go to Uttoxeter races and the kids to Alton Towers. It’s nothing more than that.

Of course in reality there will most likely be Travellers visiting the park on any given day of the season, it’s just on Easter Sunday and first Sunday of Scarefest there are often larger groups.
 
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