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TBC: SW9 Speculation

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JAperson said:
Fair enough, I'd say because there is so many of them, they are not all that different from each other and use similar components, further to this Thorpe already have B&M's that they are used to maintaining. I agree that it wouldn't be the case for all parks however I imagine for Thorpe it would make more sense. I don't know for definite but I'd bet good money on that being the case.
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Having more of a type of coaster built, with them using similar components, does not mean the components ware out slower, does not mean you need to oil them less and it does not mean you have to do less checks on the ride. Therefor, not easier to maintain. Maintaining a ride is the process keeping it running by checking parts, replacing parts, oiling parts....you get the picture. No matter how many coasters you build, you still have to do that with every single one, as much as you would normally.

Maybe I am being pedantic, maybe you meant that the processes and potential defects of a ride are more well understood when there are many built, thus meaning the process of knowing what goes wrong with them could be easier understood. I guess in that sense, what you said makes sense.
 
Given that there are hints towards SW9 being some insane, industry-changing ride, I honestly reckon it could be a resurrection of the cross valley coaster.

Before you all laugh me out of the room, hear me out for a second.

The cross valley coaster is hardly a contrived enthusiast fallacy. Alton Towers have shown desire to build this multiple times; once in 2003, once in the LTDP in 2010 and once in 2015 (I know this was never explicitly confirmed to be a cross valley, but rumours from the time and rumblings that have come out since have strongly implied that this was to be a resurrection of the cross valley coaster). I’m aware that the 2003 proposal experienced significant public pushback, but from what I can tell, this was down to noise and the quantity of supports required rather than the location in the valley. None of the other proposals experienced any real pushback, and I reckon that the issues found with the 2003 proposal could be rectified by using a different ride type. Most steel coasters would be quieter and less support-heavy than the wooden coaster from the 2003 proposal would have been.

Also, Alton Towers made a fair song and dance in the planning application for the Nemesis retrack about how they were putting sand in Nemesis’ track to make the ride more palatable for locals noise-wise. I’ve heard it suggested by some that this could be used as leverage by Alton Towers to get a potentially “difficult” ride through planning later on, in a sort of “we reduced noise on Nemesis for you, can’t you pass this difficult ride through planning for us in return?” type way.

Furthermore, I’d argue that building the cross valley coaster would be one of the best chances Alton Towers has of blowing the industry wide open with a coaster development. If John Wardley is calling SW9 “the most exciting development in the last 5 years”, then it has to be something pretty special, surely?
 
Having ride my second RMC last week - Iron Gawzi, my other RMC was twisted collosus. My concern with an RMC at Alton is the trains and the restraints, it may have been just slow operations but with the seatbelts, took ages to load and Dispatch trains on Iron Gawzi, which capacity wise don’t think would be great for Alton. For those that have been on more RMCs is this similar at other parks or are they able to operate them more efficiently?

Iron Gawzi was an insane ride though, prob my number 2 coaster, I would prob rank velicoaster as my number 1 as prefer the whole package with velicoaster and my back seat night rides where just incredible. Will update my top 10 when back home from this trip. I also think am Intamin multi launch motorcycle/sidecar coaster ie hagrids ride system (maybe without the free fall drop) would have been a better fit for chessington new coaster.
 
I would love
Matt N said:
Given that there are hints towards SW9 being some insane, industry-changing ride, I honestly reckon it could be a resurrection of the cross valley coaster.

Before you all laugh me out of the room, hear me out for a second.

The cross valley coaster is hardly a contrived enthusiast fallacy. Alton Towers have shown desire to build this multiple times; once in 2003, once in the LTDP in 2010 and once in 2015 (I know this was never explicitly confirmed to be a cross valley, but rumours from the time and rumblings that have come out since have strongly implied that this was to be a resurrection of the cross valley coaster). I’m aware that the 2003 proposal experienced significant public pushback, but from what I can tell, this was down to noise and the quantity of supports required rather than the location in the valley. None of the other proposals experienced any real pushback, and I reckon that the issues found with the 2003 proposal could be rectified by using a different ride type. Most steel coasters would be quieter and less support-heavy than the wooden coaster from the 2003 proposal would have been.

Also, Alton Towers made a fair song and dance in the planning application for the Nemesis retrack about how they were putting sand in Nemesis’ track to make the ride more palatable for locals noise-wise. I’ve heard it suggested by some that this could be used as leverage by Alton Towers to get a potentially “difficult” ride through planning later on, in a sort of “we reduced noise on Nemesis for you, can’t you pass this difficult ride through planning for us in return?” type way.

Furthermore, I’d argue that building the cross valley coaster would be one of the best chances Alton Towers has of blowing the industry wide open with a coaster development. If John Wardley is calling SW9 “the most exciting development in the last 5 years”, then it has to be something pretty special, surely?
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Firstly, does he mean the most exciting development in the last 5 years in terms of Alton Towers, or the industry? A cross valley coaster, I do not think, would tick either of those box's.

I think there is almost zero chance of getting a coaster in the valley. Due to it being almost a designated area of outstanding natural beauty. Not quite but close. None of the others experienced any push back like the 2003 one because they were not actually put into planning.....
 
I actually agree that planning applications could be revealed towards the back end of this year for a 2025 opening. I guess it could be 2024 if that’s the case, either way I really now think it will be one of them. I’m more inclined to say 2025 so it will go Chessington > Thorpe > Alton as that would be three major investment years for this country
 
Matt N said:
2015 (I know this was never explicitly confirmed to be a cross valley, but rumours from the time and rumblings that have come out since have strongly implied that this was to be a resurrection of the cross valley coaster).
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Just to say, the reason the 2015 documentation never explicitly confirmed the ride to be a cross valley coaster is because the plans explicitly confirm the coaster couldn't be in the valley. The highest point of the coaster and maximum height it reaches from the ground would have prevented it being anywhere near the valley.

Rumours at the time and subsequent rumblings seem to be more related to word association than the actual information that was available.
 
Will this Q&A with Wardley be uploaded to YouTube anytime soon as they have been in the past?

Of course if (as seems likely) this turns out to be a new coaster I’ll be there to ride it shortly after opening (and will track it’s development on here for years) but I will be a bit disappointed purely because I’d like to see a more rounded park. I used to go to AT far more often than I do and it’s purely because it’s becoming more like a well themed six flags than a rounded theme park, there’s just not enough none coaster stuff to do - perhaps a renovation for Duel into something resembling a ride befitting of a top theme park would help, reopening Sub Terra certainly would, but the park is surely crying out for a world class family ride?

I get that the park will go with what the optics say when they plan their next ride but surely there just be a market for developing the park more? I’m not the biggest flat ride fan unless they’re going to do something similar to that top spin at Phantasia Lane (the name of which escapes me) but the park does need them, as evidenced by the temporary flat rides which they’ve clearly realised is a decent idea hence holding onto them for a second year.
 
Josh555 said:
Will this Q&A with Wardley be uploaded to YouTube anytime soon as they have been in the past?

Of course if (as seems likely) this turns out to be a new coaster I’ll be there to ride it shortly after opening (and will track it’s development on here for years) but I will be a bit disappointed purely because I’d like to see a more rounded park. I used to go to AT far more often than I do and it’s purely because it’s becoming more like a well themed six flags than a rounded theme park, there’s just not enough none coaster stuff to do - perhaps a renovation for Duel into something resembling a ride befitting of a top theme park would help, reopening Sub Terra certainly would, but the park is surely crying out for a world class family ride?

I get that the park will go with what the optics say when they plan their next ride but surely there just be a market for developing the park more? I’m not the biggest flat ride fan unless they’re going to do something similar to that top spin at Phantasia Lane (the name of which escapes me) but the park does need them, as evidenced by the temporary flat rides which they’ve clearly realised is a decent idea hence holding onto them for a second year.
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I don’t think the video has completely edited yet, but it should be!
 
Matt N said:
Given that there are hints towards SW9 being some insane, industry-changing ride, I honestly reckon it could be a resurrection of the cross valley coaster.

Before you all laugh me out of the room, hear me out for a second.

The cross valley coaster is hardly a contrived enthusiast fallacy. Alton Towers have shown desire to build this multiple times; once in 2003, once in the LTDP in 2010 and once in 2015 (I know this was never explicitly confirmed to be a cross valley, but rumours from the time and rumblings that have come out since have strongly implied that this was to be a resurrection of the cross valley coaster). I’m aware that the 2003 proposal experienced significant public pushback, but from what I can tell, this was down to noise and the quantity of supports required rather than the location in the valley. None of the other proposals experienced any real pushback, and I reckon that the issues found with the 2003 proposal could be rectified by using a different ride type. Most steel coasters would be quieter and less support-heavy than the wooden coaster from the 2003 proposal would have been.

Also, Alton Towers made a fair song and dance in the planning application for the Nemesis retrack about how they were putting sand in Nemesis’ track to make the ride more palatable for locals noise-wise. I’ve heard it suggested by some that this could be used as leverage by Alton Towers to get a potentially “difficult” ride through planning later on, in a sort of “we reduced noise on Nemesis for you, can’t you pass this difficult ride through planning for us in return?” type way.

Furthermore, I’d argue that building the cross valley coaster would be one of the best chances Alton Towers has of blowing the industry wide open with a coaster development. If John Wardley is calling SW9 “the most exciting development in the last 5 years”, then it has to be something pretty special, surely?
Click to expand...
Back to the hopeless optimism Matt!
I have held the desire to rebuild the Mouse in my back yard for some years.
I have made enquiries with the council regarding the issue and planning.
I have been in touch with the railway to enquire about using the airspace above the railway line behind my property.
There has been a little community pushback, but as the land is not in an actual area of outstanding natural beauty, I think I have a good chance of the ride opening in the foreseeable future.
Before Valhalla possibly.
 
rob666 said:
Back to the hopeless optimism Matt!
I have held the desire to rebuild the Mouse in my back yard for some years.
I have made enquiries with the council regarding the issue and planning.
I have been in touch with the railway to enquire about using the airspace above the railway line behind my property.
There has been a little community pushback, but as the land is not in an actual area of outstanding natural beauty, I think I have a good chance of the ride opening in the foreseeable future.
Before Valhalla possibly.
Click to expand...

Bless @Matt N I really do love your optimism.

If a coaster does go in, and does go near the valley it won't be to the scale previously proposed. It may take a little of the land up, but an out and back just won't happen.
 
New ScrewyLoops vlog from a few days ago, he says something along the lines of "he dropped some very big hints that something massive is coming to Alton Towers, stay tuned in the next weeks, I think something big is gonna be announced for SW9" - its making me want to see this Q&A even more, I really think we're not too far from an announcement!
 
It also really depends on what 'massive' means. Theoretically, we should be expecting announcements about both Nemesis and Duel in the not too distant future, both of which are things that Merlin could brand as being 'massive' announcements for one reason or another.

I suspect the announcement of Jumanji for CWOA would fall into the category of 'massive' by Merlin standards, but we've all basically known about that for months.
 
Alton though don’t really announce anything though until ready to unveil new rides and attractions a few months before they are due to open. With bigger projects some teasers outside construction zone etc. so I wouldn’t be expecting any kind of announcement. The only thing we are likely to get regarding a major project is when they submit a planning application or if they do a public consultation similar to what chessington and Thorpe did, with some longer term plans unveiled, but without specific details.
 
From what I keep hearing it doesn’t sound like either Nemesis or Duel. Also, “next few weeks” is not indicating 72 weeks, it’s indicating soon-ish
 
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