TBC: SW9 Speculation

Discussion in 'Future Discussion' started by Matt N, 2nd Nov 2017.

  1. Jonathan

    Jonathan TowersStreet Member

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    Towers have needed new flat rides for years. In a weird way, this is the perfect opportunity for them to do so over the next few years.
     
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  2. Matt N

    Matt N TowersStreet Member

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    I should think that the British Treasury probably knows what it's talking about in this department; they're the people in charge of finance in this country! I read what they said earlier, and they're predicting that Britain could have a big recovery in 2021, with the final thing to recover being unemployment in 2023. In terms of actual park recovery, Walt Disney World, a huge international company, is predicted to recover in 2022 at the latest, so surely a regional business like Alton Towers will recover more quickly?

    The thing to remember here is that this recession was entirely self-imposed by the government as opposed to being down to fundamental problems with the financial system like some of the past ones, so if we open things up again with adequate financial support, as social distancing will of course mean that they can't operate fully, then that should go some way towards repairing the damage.

    Also, once the parks reopen and are getting adequate cash flow again, then it'll be no different to any of the past recessions for them. Regional theme parks have actually benefitted during some of the past recessions!
     
  3. Mr Pearse

    Mr Pearse TowersStreet Member

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    So many factors come into play when you talk about Alton towers financial recovery. Anything could happen next year plus it’s not just down to Towers remember they are part of Merlin so if the midways have a terrible year or another park loses x amount of money. It all filters through just because towers is doing ok don’t mean it automatically means new investment. It will take Merlin at least 2 years to recover from this. They haven’t just lost the theme park division but the whole portfolio and just think if they lose most of that for the rest of the year that’s 9/10 months without any income. When you have 30 attractions and you go that long without income by gawd you feel the hit. Just think how busy the south bank attractions normally are during summer season and then think how much they will lose out on just for those 2/3 months alone. Any company no matter how big or small if you pay out to keep 30 attractions running you’ll feel the squeeze.
     
  4. rob666

    rob666 TowersStreet Member

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    Sorry Matt, the Treasury is there to get us out of this as quickly as possible.
    Looking positive in times of stress is what they are there for.
    Any reasons to explain why we will come out of this quickly?
    I havent heard a single convincing argument for a rapid recovery...despite reading the business pages for the last forty years.
    They dont really have a clue, we have never been in such a situation before.
    All large firms are shedding staff, either through redundancy, furlough or natural wastage...not recruiting when staff leave or retire.
    What happens when the second and third wave of infections come through, as are expected to happen.
    Keep hanging on to your positive attitude, but realistically, I dont think we are anywhere near managing the situation, economically or politically.
     
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  5. Matt N

    Matt N TowersStreet Member

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    Of course it's always good to plan for worst case scenarios, but if we keep up social distancing, then we might not even have an uncontrollable second wave. The countries that are reopening certainly haven't reported any explosion in cases thus far (I know everyone's saying that Germany had a second wave, but their R0 number is still only at 0.74; it needs to be above 1 for a second wave to occur).

    I'll use the Spanish Flu pandemic as a historical example. During the first wave, it was not as bad as expected. Due to this (and also partially due to the war effort at the time), no social distancing was applied at all, and the second wave was devastating. After the war ended, when the third wave came, social distancing was applied, so the third wave was nowhere near as bad as the earlier two and a fourth wave didn't happen.

    If you want a historical example of a recession, then the Great Depression in the 1930s was very bad and quite drawn out, but nothing in the way of financial support was applied whatsoever, so it went badly. But look at the amount of financial support governments across the world are applying trying to prevent a bad economic crash now. If more is needed eventually, then I'm sure the governments will offer it; as Rishi Sunak said when the government first announced its initial financial measures, they will do "whatever it takes".

    I'm not trying to pretend that everything will be fine once things reopen, as I know that won't be the case. It won't be like flicking on a light switch; it will be a more gradual recovery. However, I think there could potentially be a v-shaped recovery once things reopen; the amount of people I've seen saying that they want to go to a restaurant or go on a foreign holiday when they're allowed to suggest that there's quite a bit of pent up demand building while we're locked down.

    So what I'm basically trying to say is; while expecting things to be an instant recovery would be unrealistic, I also don't think it will be as apocalyptic and morbid as some are suggesting, either. The world will still go round, and businesses will still operate and receive income.

    I too am very worried; very, very worried in fact. Perhaps the most scared I've ever been about the future. But if you look, I think there's reason to believe that there will be light at the end of the tunnel fairly soon, personally.

    With regard to Merlin, it's worth remembering that they also have a hugely expansive foreign portfolio to fall back on. I know many of their attractions in mainland Europe are reopening within the next month, and I think some of their attractions in Asia are open now.
     
    Last edited: 8th May 2020
  6. ATI

    ATI TowersStreet Member

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    I'd really like to see them build an Intamin Blitz on the Galactica car park. Believe it or not, but you can actually fit the whole of Klugheim and Taiga on that car park. So they definitely could fit one there.

    Something similar to Taron (focusing on airtime and rapid transitions), combined with a Resort guest entrance and maybe a flat ride or two would work wonders. They could certainly fit a low to the ground coaster, like Taron, and also dig trenches for the lower elements, much like Taron. Throw in a few water effects and theming and I think you've got a winner.

    It would make the most sense that SW9 was built here as it is an open space that is rarely used, and considering the park are in the process of converting a grass field into another car park, its as if they are planning ahead for the parking space that will be lost to this development.
     
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  7. Jb85

    Jb85 TowersStreet Member

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    So what your saying it you want a ride like Taron


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  8. ATI

    ATI TowersStreet Member

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    Lol In short, yes. Although I would want more airtime and transitions and maybe the odd inversion. I think Taron has too many simple turns. Maybe throw in a wave turn or outer-bank, like what the new Velocicoaster will have.
     
  9. RicketyCricket

    RicketyCricket TowersStreet Member

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    Everywhere should have a Taron clone tbf.
     
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  10. Danny

    Danny Gugu Rides’ Number 1 Fan

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    If Merlin were to put a Taron clone on the Air car park it would be the very definition of a hideous car park coaster. Plus, much like the original, it would be tremendously overrated.
     
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  11. MakoMania

    MakoMania TowersStreet Member

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    I don't see the appeal of using the air car park for SW9 when there is lots of barren and unused space in the existing FV area where Ripsaw, NST and presumably now The Blade used to be. More interesting terrain around this area as well.
     
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  12. Matt N

    Matt N TowersStreet Member

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    I’d love it if Towers could put in an Intamin Blitz Coaster for SW9, something like Velocicoaster in terms of elements. Maybe they could use the swing launch technology like Pantheon and the 2023 Parc Asterix Blitz Coaster, as I feel like that could work quite well with Towers’ height restriction?

    Or if they did want a Mack, then maybe they could make it more inversion-focused like Helix? Or the UK’s first XTREME Spinning Coaster? I’m only thinking so as they can differentiate it somewhat from Icon in the marketing, although I suppose “UK’s fastest multi-launch coaster” would be a valid claim they could use if they make it faster than Icon’s 53mph, and I think an Intamin could potentially have the same problem with regards to differentiation from Icon.

    So my current prediction for SW9 is; an Intamin Blitz Coaster potentially utilising the swing launch technology. As for location, I’d probably go for the top end of FV, as with Ripsaw gone and Blade potentially on borrowed time (although they did refurbish it this closed season), they’d have a lot of space to use up there, especially if they removed all of the buildings like the food outlets (are any of them still open?) and the Edge games arcade. Not to mention that the park has wanted to use this area before for a previous SW8 proposal. As for opening year, I wouldn’t like to guess what with the current situation, but with most parks delaying investments by a year or two as opposed to cancelling, I’d probably opt for a 2023/2024 opening. I’d be very surprised if SW9 or a major project of some description hasn’t arrived by 2025.
     
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  13. Brad97

    Brad97 TowersStreet Member

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    I'd love to see an Intamin Blitz at Towers, it would be a great fit. Something like the new coaster at IOA would be perfect.

    The top of Forbidden Valley seems the most likely spot, but I wouldn't mind Rita being replaced with SW9. There's a lot of unused space in Dark Forest to work with. I'm not really a fan of the Air car park location though, I think a resort expansion would suit that site better.
     
  14. Matt878787

    Matt878787 TowersStreet Member

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    The blade (ship) has been returned to the pit so I can’t see them removing it again.
     
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  15. jon81uk

    jon81uk TowersStreet Member

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    There are plenty of things AT needs before another launched coaster.
     
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  16. Danny

    Danny Gugu Rides’ Number 1 Fan

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    There are plenty of things AT needs before another coaster full stop.
     
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  17. Thameslink Rail

    Thameslink Rail TowersStreet Member

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    Does SW9 need to be a coaster?
     
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  18. MakoMania

    MakoMania TowersStreet Member

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    We still need an airtime machine at Alton Towers, for some reason they haven't had one yet.
     
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  19. Stevie

    Stevie TowersStreet Member

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    In terms of hardware I'd say these are more important than a new coaster:
    1. Considerable number of flat rides
    2. A decent water ride
    3. A large scale dark ride

    The park are perfectly fine with the current coaster line up.
     
  20. Matt N

    Matt N TowersStreet Member

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    I admit they probably do need flat rides and water rides, but they already have a decent number of dark rides, in my opinion. Duel is pretty large scale, Hex is great, Gangsta Granny will be a good family dark ride and they could probably use the Dungeons ride system for another large-scale family dark ride during a medium year if they do end up removing the Dungeons fairly soon as originally anticipated.

    Also, flat rides could quite easily be installed in lower years, and water ride and coaster can overlap quite nicely; there is the obvious option of something like a Mack water coaster, but the water coaster has become a little more interesting in recent years with inventions like the PowerSplash, in my opinion. I do actually think that a Mack water coaster would be a nice addition to Towers; maybe they could go for a full-circuit launched water coaster? That could be quite interesting, and I don’t think it’s ever been done before; I know Atlantis Adventure exists, but I wouldn’t personally say that’s a true water coaster.
     
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