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The Asylum "offensive to the mentally ill"

Ben. said:
Its in the same category as a world war film, unfortunate but with its own dark and assassinating theme that would be a waste not to explore.
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I can't wait for next year's Auschwitz the scare maze! Also the Jimmy Savile hall of mirrors project sounds very exciting too. :D

Come on... Scare mazes are hardly a sobering pyschological deconstruction of their subject matter. It's just - look at the scary crazy peron!

Maybe you people don't realise that the big victorian style Asylums that indiscriminately treat their patients like dangerous prisoners by keeping them locked up in barred rooms, and were not treated with any compassion, existed all the way into the 90s.

My Aunt who is autistic was put in one. My parents who visited her there will tell you that these places which brought such suffering to vulnerable people, are not a subject for light-hearted halloween fun. Especially when you consider it still persists in other countries.
 
Now that is something I can agree with you on. These mazes shouldn't be "run from the scary nutters", they should be "you have been committed to an asylum and the doctors are going to torture and abuse you". Now that would be a scary maze.

That still doesn't mean they are offensive though.
 
DiogoJ42 said:
"you have been committed to an asylum and the doctors are going to torture and abuse you". Now that would be a scary maze.
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So, the Sanctuary then?
 
I can only go on last year's Sanctuary, but I found it pretty much the same. Just inmates, no doctors to be found.
 
Meat Pie said:
these places which brought such suffering to vulnerable people, are not a subject for light-hearted halloween fun. Especially when you consider it still persists in other countries.
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So, I'm guessing you want to ban all films and tv shows based in asylums then? Since they are artistically also using this cruelty for the entertainment of others? If we're going to prey on one thing for this reason, then lets not leave out the rest. That would be discrimination.

I'm sorry, but what part of Asylum is a realistic portrayal of these places? I'll tell you, none of it. I can tell you so many films that are based in asylums, for god sake, the WHOLE of American Horror Story's season two was based in an asylum, and was called Asylum, don't see anyone losing their minds over that. Session 9? Grave Encounters? Episode 50? Shutter Island? A Nightmare On Elm Street (two of the sequels)? No one seems to be losing their mind's over how damaging they might be to someone with mental health issues.
SO WHY THIS?
 
Don't put words in my mouth. I never called for any kind of ban. I don't think we should even ban racist jokes, but doesn't mean they are justified or funny.

What I do suggest though, is that we make progress. Films with racist ideology can be found in the past, but as society makes progress realising the hurt that stereotyping causes, we move forward by making art that is socially conscious and condemning that which isn't.

That doesn't mean however that subjects such as mental health and disability, race, class, etc... can't be dealt with in the arts, but it means that is should be done so in an emotionally intelligent way.

So for example, there is a 1946 film called Bedlam which shows exactly the way to make a horror/drama about the mentally ill. In this film it is first tries to imply that the mentally ill are dangerous and scary, but as the film continues it becomes clear that they are just vulnerable and are responding the savage nature of their treatment. The real monster of the film is the wealthy aristocrat that funds the Bedlam asylum, and the maniacal master of the facility who abuses the occupiers. Towards the end, the master ends up at the mercy of the occupants who put him on trial in a self-created court, but unlike the system that condemned them, they arrive at a humane decision. The film's only problem is that at the end it unfortunately makes bold statements about the improvement of conditions for the mentally ill following the story's end, but in reality that didn't transpire for a very long time.

The point is, in a film where the aim is to produce a socially conscious deconstruction of a subject, yes you can produce something about a tough subject that has a range of emotions, including fear, but still has moral content.

In a scare-maze that lasts a significantly less time and who's aim is to just make you jump and not think, there is no way they can cover the complexities of the subject and will have to revert to offensive stereotypes of vulnerable people.

I've not seen a lot of the films who have brought up Tarin, but if their content is exploitative without any real objective social deconstruction of the situation, then there is a fair case for saying it has failed to be socially conscious art and future film-makers should avoid recreating it's failures.

So Tarin, since you are quite keen on posing loaded questions, I'll return the favour. So you would have no problem with a Auschwitz themed maze?
 
I have very little problem with anything, when it is an unrealistic portrayal of something, and never claims to be one.

Please tell me, in which part of the maze, it attempts to be anything like an asylum. Because I went through it, and I don't think it really tried to be anything like that. Just because of the name? Honestly, have you even been through the maze?

Its harmful because it results to stereotypes? Well, aren't they the very same stereotypes in many horror films? Does that mean you think horror films are harmful, cause as a sufferer of mental health issues myself, horror is my biggest passion in life.

The point I was trying to get across was that if we are going to slate one thing for the way it portrays asylums and their patients, how come we're not slating the other things that also portray them in a similar way? Because its easier to pick on a park than on a film company. I've said the whole way through this, that instead of wasting their time with a park, they should go out and raise money and awareness.
Try not to bite my head off, yeah?
 
Going against the popular opinions on this, I do see where there are coming from with this. I point I would like to make is if Thorpe did make a maze based off lets say... Afghan Asylum seekers or Homosexuls getting Aids- if anyone has been on a American Christian based "Hell House" you get some of themes and controversy that it associates its self with. Anyway, if its not ok to make themes about minoraty groups, then why is ok to make a scaremaze based of an "Asylum" which accossates its self with people with Mental health? A bit of food for thought there.

On the otherside of the coin, I can understand why people think its political correctness gone too far. In alot of horror films and fiction, the theme of "Madness" is a very common one. Look at Psycho, The Shining, Texas chainsaw massacre and so on. Of course, these are all very extream cases of "Madness" and not a realistic interpretation of mental health. Speaking on personal experiances with mental health issues, you do develop a sence of humor to cope with it. As what many of you have said, I would rather see alot of this campainers, raise money and awareness as they are much bigger issues facing people with mental health problems than a scaremaze.

Overall, I would like to see some greater understanding with mental health. But not at the loss of great scaremazes across the country. I'm like many there, a big fan of scaremazes and haunted attractions. And at the end of the day, Its just a bit of fun!

So you would have no problem with a Auschwitz themed maze?
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A historical based attraction where the public can get an idea of what happen and some of the atrocitys committed by the Nazis, In all honestly, I wouldn't mind. As long as it dosen't glorify Hitler or Nazism. But I understand why people wouldn't want to see it.
 
On one hand, reporting the attraction as a hate crime is one of the most ridiculous things I've read in a while, but on the other, I do think the stigma around mental illness is worse than ever and I'm naturally inclined to support somebody like the student nurse who's keen to end lazy and damaging stereotypes. The world is a difficult place for a lot of people. I feel that there's less political correctness than before. People have the whole internet to be flippant about disabled people if they like, but Thorpe Park are the big boys here. The attraction will doubtlessly be back (as ever ::) ) next season, the content will remain exactly the same, and a poor multi-billion pound conglomerate will have to have swapped a sign.

I am increasingly defensive towards the freedom of expression and creativity, whilst equally exasperated with what I see as an increasingly intolerant and entitled society. Life and society is difficult, so in my view, fair play to Thorpe Park for attempting to strike a balance.
 
I highly doubt this was about people's suffering, I think this was a way for someone to cause a fuss over very little. If miss Katie really wanted to help, she'd be out there changing the views of schools and workplaces when it comes to mental health. Instead, she preys on a large company and gets lots of attention.
If the stigma is that bad, then go out and target the worst offenders, not a maze that exists for three weeks of the year. Schools and workplaces stigmatize mental health issues throughout the year. Make a difference there.
Go out and raise money and awareness, help people who suffer to get the support they need.
Please, someone explain how taking on Thorpe about their attraction that has existed for eight years, and only exists for three weeks a year, is a better use of time and energy than campaigning to raise money and awareness?
 
Tarin Maria said:
I highly doubt this was about people's suffering, I think this was a way for someone to cause a fuss over very little. If miss Katie really wanted to help, she'd be out there changing the views of schools and workplaces when it comes to mental health. Instead, she preys on a large company and gets lots of attention.
If the stigma is that bad, then go out and target the worst offenders, not a maze that exists for three weeks of the year. Schools and workplaces stigmatize mental health issues throughout the year. Make a difference there.
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She works as an NHS mental health nurse, she already does more for mental health awareness and treatment than the vast majority of people will ever do. Not to mention, we've absolutely no idea what other sort of campaigning she does. And it's very difficult to prey on a large company. They are exactly, that; large.

It's really great that the majority of people on here are either smart or perceptive enough to never be offended by anything, or perhaps privileged enough that such responses don't really apply to them, but sometimes, as is their right, people are genuinely offended or think something isn't on. Perhaps they have seen enough in their workplace to have reached the end of their tether, perhaps they themselves or others around them have been negatively affected by stale attitudes. I've not enough knowledge of 'miss Katie' to make a case either way, but I think it's wrong to naturally assume that she's simply out for attention. Although I'm not sure I'd have turned up to deliver a petition whilst dressed as a zombie. Surprised Thorpe's PR department didn't take it off her hands and offer her a job...
 
I seriously think this whole issue is just pathetic. Can't the people who are complaining see the maze is themed to an asylum full of murders & psychopaths, not a modern day mental health hospital? How can it be offensive towards people with common mental health issues such as depression, anxiety or autism when the actors featured in the scaremaze are clearly meant to be people like Jeffrey Dahmer or Ian Brady, not people with common mental health problems?

Some people. ::)
 
Adam said:
I seriously think this whole issue is just pathetic. Can't the people who are complaining see the maze is themed to an asylum full of murders & psychopaths, not a modern day mental health hospital? How can it be offensive towards people with common mental health issues such as depression, anxiety or autism when the actors featured in the scaremaze are clearly meant to be people like Jeffrey Dahmer or Ian Brady, not people with common mental health problems?

Some people. ::)
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Just to clarify, Autism is a developmental health issue not a mental health issue.
 
Then maybe she should go and do more, because apparently when I struggle at school due to my mental health issues, they kick me out instead of helping. Which is far more damaging than a stupid maze. So politely, please be quiet.
 
Tarin Maria said:
Then maybe she should go and do more, because apparently when I struggle at school due to my mental health issues, they kick me out instead of helping. Which is far more damaging than a stupid maze. So politely, please be quiet.
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Really sorry to hear that, but this is a public forum and I obviously wasn't aware you were approaching this issue from that perspective. Nonetheless, my apologies.
 
Plastic Person said:
Really sorry to hear that, but this is a public forum and I obviously wasn't aware you were approaching this issue from that perspective. Nonetheless, my apologies.
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Your apologies have been noted. I just personally feel that there are more important issues than a maze. And I know many others agree. Many people are ridiculed and stigmatized, but I happen to think this happens far more in real life and online than in theme parks. Surely, if we're all going to be that way, then it is far more important to teach people that mental illnesses aren't a joke. If someone says that they're suffering from depression, that they're self harming, that they're suffering from anxiety they're told all number of stupid things. "Attention seeking" "Having a moment" "Need to grow up and stop being silly". THAT is damaging. Not a maze.
 
Yeah, cool, I agree, I just feel that it's wrong to dismiss people who might have legitimate concerns about stigmatising and stereotyping, which is the vibe I have gotten from a few posts here and elsewhere online in regards to this issue.
 
What the hell?! You have a mental health issue so no-one is allowed to have an opinion different to yours? Just because you might be on the receiving end of more directly harmful experiences does not logically follow to mean that less direct issues to do with societal attitudes are not also important. It shows quite an arrogant self-important attitude to think like that.

Don't ever tell anyone to be quiet on this forum again. You have no right. I'm also a sufferer of mental illness, but that doesn't mean I assume that I have the voice of authority on the issue and neither should it for you.

If a Scaremaze was a medium that could have the length of time necessary to explore the complexities of social issues surrounding vulnerable people, then it would be ok for it to take on serious subjects. As it is not, it can be criticised for very poorly appropriating unsuitable subjects to be exploited for kicks.

Anyway, you ask if I have a problem with Horror films? Well my response is that I will criticise anything that relies on poor stereotypes with no exploration of the further complex issues surrounding the subject, that is including Horror films. However, as I had already made clear, there are Horror films out there, like Bedlam, that deal with the subject in a socially conscious manner.

I accept that creators have the lawful right to make their scaremazes/films/art but that doesn't mean they are awarded immunity from critcism or campaigning.
 
Meat Pie said:
If a Scaremaze was a medium that could have the length of time necessary to explore the complexities of social issues surrounding vulnerable people, then it would be ok for it to take on serious subjects. As it is not, it can be criticised for very poorly appropriating unsuitable subjects to be exploited for kicks.
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To the contrary, I'd argue that as long as the content isn't too exploitative, surely a scare maze isn't something to be taken seriously full stop?
 
For somethings there is no rational explanation, there is no way out, there is no sensible end to the story. Welcome to the unknown, welcome to eternal stupidity, welcome.....to TS 'debates'
 
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